The Care and Feeding of Warriors: But hitting buttons is fun!

Honestly, believe it or not, I'd actually like to talk about DPS today. My current raiding guild has between three and four regular tanks who show up for most every 25 man raid. As you might expect, you don't need three to four tanks for ICC. At this point in the raid's life cycle, if you have two tanks you can get through most everything except Putricide and maybe Blood Princes. (We have used two tanks and a DPS for this fight, but we usually use our feral tank for it, so three tanks.) Marrowgar at this point can be done by two geared tanks and a plate DPS standing up there mashing away, although to play it safe we usually just use three.
So last night, after tanking Sindragosa, I got to DPS on Arthas, which is fun for a warrior. (Ah, Glyph of Cleaving, you make up for the mechanical deficiencies of my class.) Then I went and did some stupid fun heroics with a warrior tank, arms warrior, another fury warrior and a resto druid who kept healing in bear form. (I know they can't cast healing spells in bear form. He'd occasionally pop out and throw a HoT on folks. It was pretty much all we needed.) So it wall all sorts of DPS warrior fun last night.
And then I went and read this endlessly exploding threat on tanking and now I have to talk about it. Why? Well, first off, Ghostcrawler mentions Monte Cook. That hits all of my nerd buttons. (If only you'd thrown in a plug for Kingmaker, Greg.) Secondly, we both hated the old Shield Block mechanic and we both hate the current Heroic Strike one.
Ghostcrawler - Re: Just get rid of dodge and parry altogetherI understand your point, but I hated old Shield Block. It was always the right button to push whenever it came off cooldown. It wasn't an interesting decision – there was no point in saving it for the right moment and no penalty for using it at the wrong time. It's okay to have some relatively spammy buttons, but old Shield Block crossed the line (and current Heroic Strike still does).
If you don't hate how Heroic Strike works in tanking, you're not tanking on a warrior. Essentially, once you've used everything else (which you will have) if you have rage it should be going into Heroic Strike. I have it macro'd so that I never have to use the ability, it's just autofiring off of several other moves, because if I didn't and I had to actually queue the ability my fingers would shatter like glass and I'd be tanking with stumps right now. Hell, Heroic Strike sucks as a DPS move, too. But at least there are times when you won't be pummeling the button as if it were the tulpa of every humiliation you ever experienced in your life.
Ghostcrawler - But hitting buttons is fun!If you don't think Shield Block is interesting enough today, that's a fine discussion to have. I'm a little surprised to see any nostalgia for the old model though. Hitting a relatively common dps button that plays into other talents and abilities is one thing. Having to constantly mash "make me slightly more survivable" is another. I'll grant you that it was fun on Illidan, but it took that mechanic specifically to make it fun.
Imagine how you'd react to this scenario:
GC: Good news, everyone! We lowered the cooldown of Shield Wall to 5 sec and balanced assuming you hit it every 5 sec.
Tanks: Um.... Thanks? Could you maybe just make it a passive at that point?
GC: But hitting buttons is fun!
Imagine how you'd react to this scenario:
GC: Good news, everyone! We lowered the cooldown of Shield Wall to 5 sec and balanced assuming you hit it every 5 sec.
Tanks: Um.... Thanks? Could you maybe just make it a passive at that point?
GC: But hitting buttons is fun!
I will be honest with you here. The second I read this, I knew it was going to be the title of this post.
Frankly, I think I'm on record as not always being supportive of Blizzard's design philosophy or goals. I don't subscribe to the notion that the development of the game is some sort of sacred cow that can't be criticized or what have you. But every so often the stars align and there is a moment where they and I become conjoined at the soul, and this is one of those times. No, Shield Block wasn't fun in the old days. No. It was not. I tanked back then too, I tanked Rag, I tanked Nef, I tanked the Twin Emps and C'Thun and the original Four Horsemen and Anub'arak back when you actually needed Nature Resist to tank him and up through Kara, Gruul, Mag, TK, SSC, Hyjal, BT, even Sunwell... no. No. No no no no no!
There was nothing fun about an ability that required absolutely no thought. Shield Block was up, you used it. The only time you ever saved it for anything was Shear. An ability that requires no thought on the part of the player is not a fun ability. We're not drinking bird toys here or metronomes. It's fine to have abilities that you'll weave into your rotation on a fairly regular basis... an arms DPS warrior is going to be hitting Overpower and Rend fairly often and not constantly analyzing whether or not he should, it's true... but Shield Block totally stepped over that line. I admit, I was used to it. We all were. But amazingly, being used to something doesn't make it good. I can still remember the first time I stepped into Kara and had to pray for Shield Block to keep me from getting crushed by Prince Malchezaar's Thrash ability. Remember Crushing Blows? Remember having to rely on Shield Block to get to uncrushable?
I'm going to admit that as a tank, I go out of my way to make sure I stay alive. I value threat stats. Indeed, I value threat stats more than most people (you will never ever see a post from me arguing that threat doesn't matter now, that you shouldn't gear for it, I've repeatedly argued just the opposite) but in the end I gear to stay alive. I gear for armor and stamina over avoidance because armor and stamina are more reliable. I'm not a gambler. Higher armor means less damage taken. Higher stamina means more damage can be taken. A streak of dodges or parries is great, but it's not reliable. Blocking an attack is fine, but ultimately a block is (currently, we all know it's going to change in Cataclysm) is functionally just mitigation with an annoying avoidance-like mechanic. Sometimes you mitigate some damage, sometimes you don't! Roll the dice!
But one of the flip sides to random abilities like avoidance mechanics is that their random nature tends to balance out with a much more potent effect. Sure, armor is always there. It always reduces how much damage you take. But if you dodge, you take no damage at all. Taking no damage at all is pretty sweet for a tank. So while I don't stack dodge, I don't avoid it, either. The idea that dodge and parry should be removed from the game is silly: randomization is what allows us to have doubt about the outcome of an encounter. Having doubt about the outcome of an encounter is part of the gameplay, it's what causes us to have to learn strats, make appropriate gear choices (and upgrade our gear) and use our abilities in the proper place and time to help the group as a whole overcome an obstacle.
Old Shield Block and current Heroic Strike are prime examples of abilities you almost never have to put that kind of effort into. Shield Block in the days of Crushing Blows and HS now are boring because there's no thought, you just spam them. Spamming an ability without doing anything else is the definition of boring. As I said to my arch-nemesis Ziebart the Destroyer this week as we were locked in battle over the yawning chasm deep within his stygaian pit of darkness, yes, hitting buttons is fun. But hitting the same button over and over again isn't, unless you happen to be a rat with electrodes hooked up to the pleasure center of your brain.
In short: hitting buttons is fun, when they're the right buttons, and not just the same buttons all the time. Gearing for mitigation/stamina is a fine choice but if you don't have to make choices then what's the point? We may find randomization annoying and work to minimize our having to rely on luck, and that's a fine and good choice. (I hate luck.) But asking for luck to be taken out of the game or asking for abilities that require no strategy or tactics to use (hit me over and over again to avoid being smashed into paste!) just doesn't seem like a good idea to me.
Filed under: Warrior, (Warrior) The Care and Feeding of Warriors
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Reader Comments (Page 2 of 4)
jbodar Mar 19th 2010 10:54PM
Disregard previous post; I was just thinking of the Stance change shared-CD
iraowens Mar 19th 2010 1:37PM
"Unless you happen to be a rat with electrodes hooked up to the pleasure center of your brain."
Pure awesomeness Mr. Rossi.
...SilveR
Wiedmaier Mar 19th 2010 2:41PM
Never play a frost mage then...
splodesondeath Mar 19th 2010 1:45PM
"But hitting the same button over and over again isn't, unless you happen to be a mage."
Fixed in the name of Arcane Blast spam!
Heilig Mar 19th 2010 1:50PM
I'd love to meet this hypothetical Arcane Mage that thinks his rotation is FUN. If that's you, I pity you. Or perhaps I envy you. My life would be much simpler if I could be entertained by watching a clock tick.
Every Arcane mage in the top guilds on our server (and yes, I actually have asked all 11 of them) is ecstatic that they get to go Fire next patch. They are bored to tears by Arcane.
Zheo Mar 19th 2010 2:33PM
Throwing speeding missiles is kinda fun. The spam, not so much. But going pewpewpewpewpew followed by a spinning tri-colour ball of energy is entertaining.
thebitterfig Mar 19th 2010 2:49PM
i think a fair number of people had fun with arcane, when it was newish. these days, when almost every mage has been playing arcane for a long while, we're just bored with it.
splodesondeath Mar 19th 2010 4:41PM
'Twas a joke. I, myself, am so darn happy to go back to fire.
Tom Mar 19th 2010 1:51PM
"[...] as we were locked in battle over the yawning chasm deep within his stygaian pit of darkness[...]"
What on earth were you doing in there?!?
Tom Mar 19th 2010 1:52PM
On second thought, I'd really rather not know.
Hollow Leviathan Mar 19th 2010 7:10PM
Being locked in battle! They need no reason to battle, their battle is the reason.
busuan Mar 19th 2010 1:51PM
IMO, Shield Block could be changed into a 'Conditioned' ability.
It's not CD-limited or rage-limited. Rather, it is offensive action-limited; you can only use it after a few attacks to your target. Afterwards, when it's ready to use, you still can choose not to do it, and wait for the right time. It's somehow similar to the combo-points mechanic, but gives more freedom to the tank: if you don't use it, it doesn't necessarily hurt you because you always have armor/dodge/parry for mitigation.
What's the right time? When your healers are oom/dead/distracted, or simply under-geared/under-skilled.
It would be feeling like a mini-Shield Wall with you in total control.
Clevins Mar 19th 2010 1:53PM
"As I said to my arch-nemesis Ziebart the Destroyer this week as we were locked in battle over the yawning chasm deep within his stygaian pit of darkness..."
*cough*... TMI man, TMI...
Matthew Rossi Mar 19th 2010 2:00PM
Note to self: readers have filthy minds. Can make use of this.
JONGA Mar 19th 2010 2:25PM
KINGMAKER.........that is all
lissag Mar 19th 2010 2:03PM
Hey, my fiance writes and does layout for paizo. =) And the paper minis for Kingmaker specifically. ^_^ That's kind of awesome!
Matthew Rossi Mar 19th 2010 2:07PM
James Jacobs was my DM for a couple of years when I lived in Seattle. Paizo is awesomesauce.
lissag Mar 19th 2010 2:18PM
Yeah, I know James! Heh. Small world. ^_^
Jewbanks Mar 19th 2010 2:21PM
Tulpa? I actually had to google that word. Wow I learned a new word from WoWinsider article. I dont know how i feel about that. But I love the word. Thanks for that. Also I enjoy these articles. My warrior is in his mid-40s and I dont see that changing drastically anytime soon, but still I read your articles because the writings enjoyable.
Gratia Mar 19th 2010 2:45PM
im tired of people complaining about heroic strike. we are warriors we are pure feral power(druids) or holy powerhouses(paladins) or unholy disease machines(DK). We don't tank with ultimate strength or power, we tank with precision and battle experience. we should be pushing more buttons. that's what warrior tanking is about. And realize, people such as the writer here, who macro HS to other abilities is lowering their threat because GC and Swing timers are very diff. i have my HS and Cleave on a seperate hand along with some more casual (less spammy) buttons on my right hand(mouse) and the spam abilities on my left hand (keyboard). in this way, tanking is much like playing the piano, both hands doing completely different things yet working together to make harmony. the day blizzard takes this away from me is the day i stop playing my warrior after 5years.