Breakfast Topic: The motivations of guild leaders
by Brian Cutaia 
Apr 10th 2010 at 8:00AM
My guild sucks. No, no ... it's okay. You don't have to comfort me. I've already accepted it. My guild sucks and it's entirely my own fault. I never finished our website. I've never done any proper recruiting. We have a tabard, but I'm not sure that it's very "sick" or even "awesome." I've been a terrible guild leader so far and as a result, I've watched our membership dwindle down to just the dedicated few over the past several months.
I'm not stuck there by any means. I've been offered spots with raiding guilds that actually do things like -- say, I don't know -- raid. So, why do I do it, you ask? Well, I choose to continue leading my cold, dead husk of a guild because I so thoroughly enjoy the concept of the guild management metagame. Call me stubborn, but for me it's a huge part of World of Warcraft. Even if I were to finish off every single achievement in the game, it wouldn't give me nearly the same sense of satisfaction that leading a mildly successful guild would.
Doing that, however, takes a lot of work. You can only get so far with word-of-mouth recruiting and a friendly atmosphere. Eventually, you have to have something to offer your few members or they'll find greener pastures. It's a big job, but somebody has to do it, right?
Have you ever tried to run a guild or is that a job that doesn't even interest you? For those current guild leaders out there (both successful and otherwise), what drives you to keep on keepin' on?Filed under: Breakfast Topics, Guest Posts
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
paul Apr 10th 2010 8:18AM
First of all, I want to say that your guest articles are always great, and just like your comments, I always anjoy reading them as they turn out to be well informed and a worthwhile read. Keep it up :P
I used to be a guiild leader of 2 guilds, an officer of antoher and a lead officer/assistant leader to another (not all at the same time ofc).I found it a challenge, and a good way to practice leading, organising and having responsibility over something, which as a student in rl, I dont usually get that much in the real world. Some of those guilds I wanted to be a leading member of, although others I just gradually worked up. My current guild is more of a social/casual guild with no website or real organisation, and I joined as a member and just kinda worked my way up to officer in a matter of weeks without actually realising it :S Jst kinda happened, just too friendly and helpful to be a normal member I guess :P
Unfortinately, all the other guilds that I was a big part in seemed to get dractically smaller or even disband altogether when I left, so Im trying to cut back a little bit and be just an average member for now, as a little break from organising :)
Knob Apr 10th 2010 8:57AM
I'm in the same boat now in that being just a normal member after being the GM of a raiding guild in TBC is frankly what has still kept me in the game. I couldn't imagine leading another guild, even though I had some fun doing so. You enjoyed it since you didn't have to manage people in real-life, but when you do have a job where you have to manage people and their problems in real-life, it becomes a chore to do it again in-game when all you want to do is let off some steam by playing a game that you enjoy. I'm sure there are those that enjoy managing both in-game and out of it, but that wasn't my cup of tea. I did learn a lot though; before I became the GM I didn't have an idea of what a guild's leadership has to go through on a daily basis. After having seen it, as a normal member in my current guild I don't try and "suggest" too much or try to ask too much of the guild's leadership; they have enough on their plate.
Dawn Moore Apr 10th 2010 8:23AM
Good to see you back Mr. Cutaia.
The thing I love most about guild leading is also the management-meta-game as well. I love managing the website, bank supplies, and auctions. I also like to mediate and resolve player conflicts, and do PR for the guild. I don't like to run a 1-man operation though. 2 gleads is the way to go, that way we can trade good cop, bad cop. Guild leading alone gets lonely very fast. I imagine it's a lot like single parenting.
mds Apr 10th 2010 8:29AM
I ran a very casual, very social guild that focused primarily on 10s when LK rolled around. I'm pleased to say that I managed to make a good environment for a lot of people, and I miss rolling through things like Kara with them. But it was a great deal of effort, a weight on the mind, and I took it as very serious work. In the end, I tried to ditch the reins twice to be able to step back and enjoy the game, which I had long since stopped enjoying in favor of helping about a hundred people enjoy the game more. I finally had to quit the game for half a year, take a break, and reroll opposite faction elsewhere to find any enjoyment again. (I did leave on good terms)
I don't regret my leading experience, and I made a lot of great friends, but I will absolutely never do it again. Doing it well is a lot of work and a serious commitment, and I went overboard and made it very unfun for myself for the end. Good leaders will modulate their experience better.
I still recommend trying the experience, if you're inclined. But doing it well means more than just showing up and making the tabard.
MadiTheBear Apr 10th 2010 8:32AM
I've been tempted on a number of occasions to start/run my own guild. This usually emanates from a desire for a cleaner guild, less drama, and more practicality in decisions being made. Most guilds that I've seen or been a part of are founded by a collection of friends that recruit other people. But no matter what, it's this core group of friends that are given preference in raiding roles and loot appropriation. I can already hear the cries of justification now, but the fact remains that the needs of the guild as a whole out ways preferential treatment.
I just don't have the time that it requires to manage a guild, not to mention that I have a very low BS tolerance level. I have a guild on one of my toons, but this is for the sole purpose of having more bank space. I commend the people who try, even if they fail to do it successfully. I greatly respect those that do so successfully. It's just too bad that most of the moderate guild leaders are on the horde side where there seems to be more common sense in practice. You'll find extremely successful guilds on both sides, but the middle ground seems to be lacking on the Alliance side. Maybe I should take advantage of the Faction Change option... Too bad it costs so much.
Erzfiend Apr 10th 2010 8:34AM
The author sounds a bit like the leader of the guild I was last in. I joined back when I was still leveling and when I hit 80, the only other 80 in the guild and I ran some heroics together. Besides that, it didn't really feel like a guild. Only one or two people were on at a time, if that, and while everyone who was a member was really friendly and the guild leader himself was a great guy, I just was not accomplishing what I wanted.
So as hard as it was, I decided to bid farewell to my guild and move on.
Now I'm part of a great guild where I feel very at home. We're not very large but the members we do have, I feel like we could become very close through our similar interests and goals in this game. We do progress a bit, having a scheduled raid night so that meets my needs to want to raid, but I also get that strong feeling of teamwork and camaraderie in the guild. I really look forward to spending my time in Azeroth with them.
Hanak Apr 10th 2010 8:35AM
Apparently you're far from alone in your desire to run a guild. I've been in more than a dozen guilds that said they offered raids/social/help with levelling, yet none of it was really sucessful.
I think atleast some of that desire springs from the fact that most other aspects of the game makes it quite easy to be successful, and thus people think they'll be successful in leading others as well.
The thing is, this game was designed to take a variable ammount of time and still be fulfilling. People on the other hand, takes a large amount of time, without any guarantee that what you do will be fulfilling.
The sucessful guilds I've been in (I admit, it's only been two) have had a leadership that wanted to achieve something and used the guld-structure to do so. That is, if another tool had helped them better, they would have used it instead of making a guild.
I personally don't believe any guild that has been created as a purpose in itself could be really sucessful.
Terrë Apr 10th 2010 8:41AM
I made a guild when I was level 14 on my first toon. That was when TBC first came out. I recruited the usual 10 people to sign my guild charter. I didn't know enough about the game then to know about raiding, and it was only a year later that we finally went into Kara. I was more concerned that my fellow guildies had fun, were social and behaved in a mature way.
That was over 3 years ago. Of the ten people who signed the guild charter, 7 are still in the guild. Our ranks have swelled over over 300 at times, but have stablised to around 150 members. We have had moments when someone else has decided that his ego is more important than the guild and taken a pile of our best raiders with him to make a short-lived guild. All the while, we have plugged on, raiding, learning, recruiting, and most important of all having fun.
It can be hard work. It can be stressful. I have had moments when I've wanted to disband, but my officers and my fellow guildies have all hung together and supported each other. When we have problems, we all work together to solve the problem, although I make the final descisions on what we are doing. We are not a hardcore raiding guild, but we have made slow and steady progress through the raids. We're happy with that - we will never be one of the top guilds who get world firsts in everything. We know our limits, and while we try to improve, it's not the end of the world if we don't.
My advice to other would-be guild leaders, is delegate. Your officers and your guildies are probably dying to help. Don't get burned out. If you are finding some things are too much, ask someone else to do a task. There is always someone willing to help you if you ask them and if your guildies care about the guild. In this way everyone is made to feel a vital part of the whole. The other piece of advice is always keep a sense of humour in every situation.
We may not have any uber achievements and we may only be 41 in the rankings, but our longevity and repuation and a nice place to be is more important to us.
Priestess Apr 10th 2010 9:56AM
Wow, I just won't say anything about my own guild. I'll just say DITTO!
I'm always glad to hear of other guilds like mine. It makes me happy that there are people out there willing to work as a team to provide a fun and successful environment for others to enjoy the game in.
Adoisin Apr 10th 2010 10:17AM
"My advice to other would-be guild leaders, is delegate. Your officers and your guildies are probably dying to help. Don't get burned out. If you are finding some things are too much, ask someone else to do a task."
Very important! I have about five officers in my guild, and they all play a very important part in the guild. One is in charge of the guild bank, since i am horrible at organizing and she is practically OCD. One is a raid leader and our main tank... he never loses his cool, and keeps calm even after we wipe for the 4th time cause half the dps stands in the void zone. One is what I fondly call my webmonkey. He handles everything to do with our guild website and other things out of game. My co-leader is the mediator if problems occur between members. I help all of them by trying to pick up some slack here and there. Our main guild rule is no d-bags, so if after talking to someone repeatedly, and they still want to continue their behavior, I break out the gkicking boots.
Our guild is a very friendly guild. We raid, mess around with older content before it vanishes with cataclysm, have pvp days, whatever. It's a game, we do it to have fun. I've found that if you ask people for help with situations, 90% of the time they will be more than willing to help you out.
Moonzcar Apr 10th 2010 8:44AM
I've been a guild leader for the past 6 months. Its a tough "Job", filled with ups and downs. Sometimes my guild have problem with to low attendance on raid nights, other nights, we have people on standby.
But i like it, even though things arent going great, i would never abandon my guildies. When i made the guild and started recruited member, i made myself a promise to never leave people behind. I've been offered raid spots in guilds on ICC25 HC. But i like the idea of doing a guild the way i want it to run.
Sometimes im just not sure all the time whether i should be the harsh guild leader or soft guild leader. So im glad i have officers to share the burden with.
exogenesis. Apr 10th 2010 9:08AM
I created a guild early 2009 to run with my boyfriend, but it never really took off. We advertised enthusiastically, and helped the guildies we did have whenever they needed it, and tried our best to make the experience fun. But since neither of our mains were 80, the vast majority of our members were under level 60, and we could never find things for the guild to do for everyone to take part in. Eventually people left, and we went back to laying beneath other peoples' rule.
Nowadays, I'm in a casual raiding guild (no matter how much the GM wants to believe we're more than we are, it is just a casual guild, there isn't much progress), and I've been a member for almost a year, making me one of the longest-serving and most loyal members. I'm still waiting for some recognition.
Priestess Apr 10th 2010 10:02AM
IMO if you are "still waiting for some recognition" after a year, you are most definintely in the wrong guild. If you have a desire to be a strong and reliable member, there are guilds out there that would be glad to have you in their ranks and who would recognize and use your skills of "entusiastically" advertising, helping others, and working together to make things fun.
I think you should look into The Classifieds....
Hiwa Apr 10th 2010 3:30PM
I'm pretty burned out on guilds right now. With my raiding main I've found that the closer I get to end game progression hordeside on my server, the fiercer the guild competition becomes and the more people jump ship just to down another boss. If Guild A has putricide on farm but Guild B has Blood Queen on farm, hardcore raiders will disappear to join Guild B. And on it goes.
With my alts it's just as bad, but in a different way. I like them to be in leveling guilds, but I swear people make and join guilds without any thought of what they actually mean. If I log on and say hello and am greeted with no response, there is no guild chatter going on, there is rampant joining and quitting, I know I'm in the wrong place.
If I find a guild I like, with people I like, I'll stay there. I've stayed in dying guilds because my friends were there. I have no desire to be either a GM or a high ranking officer, but I'd like at the very least for people to know me and care just a little bit about me.
kunukia Apr 10th 2010 9:51AM
I was guild leader of a very nice guild. We were alive and active for a year and a half. The recruiting was done with the premise that we were solo-ers, that guild chat was usually quiet, that only occasionally would we get together for an instance. There are a lot of nice people in game who do not want activity all the time, but like a guild to share goods with and get help on class quests etc
Obviously no end-game, obviously heavy on hunters. It is amazing what you can do with 5 hunters, by the way. I had to leave for several months, and handed the guild over to an officer, who handed it off to someone else, and when I came back...well, we still exist, but not actively.
I only go to that server occasionally to peek in, and I see that a few others occasionally peek in.
Redcow Apr 10th 2010 10:05AM
I took over my guild in late 2005 when the founder just couldn't lead anymore because real life took precedence. I had no intention of ever leading a guild. I actually originally never had any intention of ever joining one. Heh. But when he just couldn't do it anymore, I took over because I believed in the idea behind the guild too much to let it die. I was well aware that a guild can't survive without leadership.
I don't regret the decision. I love the guild and I've always naturally gravitated towards managerial positions anyway. I guess I just really enjoy the guild management meta-game as well. It's been an especially intrigueing challenge since I've spent the last 5 years trying to maintain a casual social atmosphere in an RP guild that raids. It's been a good experience trying to find a way to find a balance between providing for the guildies and playing my own game as well the way I want to. Not always successful, admittedly. But we keep chugging along.
Ed Apr 10th 2010 10:24AM
I have no experience of guild leader in WoW (other than a rubish leveling guild a Dk invited me to, soon became a bank guild)... But on PS3 i have been the co-leader of a fairly sucsessfull Clan that has dabbed around top 20 in Europe and beaten some of the best clans around.
What you really need to make your clan/guild/group work.... is a Heart, a Head... and a little bit of luck.
The Heart is the dedication, the time, effort, the money you put into it. You have to love your guild and stick with it, even through the rough.
The Head is the mind set behind your actions, Do you need to recrute? were do you recrute? do you chalange yourself or play within your comfort zone? How do you deal with troublesom players? Do you reject that clan hopper or ninja looter even if they have zomg 6k GS or do you take a risk on the guy who just dinged 80 or come back after 2 months break?
And the luck... well getting the right members for a start, thoes with a heart for the Guild/clan and a head for the game. Thoes that have the skill, have the dedication and are nice people. Also in your game, you might have that lucky time when you just down the boss on the edge of your enrage or your best Sniper on COD is on fire.
All this done well and in the right quantitys can bring sucsess, sucsess can bring confidence, enjoyment and further sucsess.
Althalas Apr 10th 2010 10:25AM
I have been the leader of my guild since it formed in 2006. We took a small haitus after our first big guild drama, and merged with another guild. After that blew up, we re-formed and the Spirit Reavers of Anvilmar have been around ever since.
We are a 10 man guild. We ran Kara till our eyes bled, and we have raided through ICC to festergut. We killed Yogg, and cleared everything else. For us Wrath has been a mixed bag.
I keep the guild together because the people I have attracted and that have stayed in the guild have become my Friends. I cannot imagine raiding without Sandrocks sarcasm, or Melekafrays insane quips. Mirrisaan never talks on vent, Katalini is the token girl and Caffety is wicked funny. We are a solid group that enjoy the game and each other.
Our problem now is with Blizzard. At this point we have no real reason to log except to raid. And even the raids make us mad now. See in 10 man normal you don't get armor tokens. the only way to get tier pieces is with 60-95 emblems. So we are forced to grind for our peices at this level while 25 man raiders can just get a drop.
Way to make the most casual raid the most hardcore. Grinding sucks. We hate it. Give us back out armor tokens so we care about killing stuff.
So we are on hiatus till Cataclysm.
I love my guild. If it was not there I would not play. As odd as it sounds I am the leader. In a very real sense. Without me the raids don't happen. I give the group focus, and goals. If I get bored things get bad pretty quick. Even more, they begged me to make the guild again after guild 2 blew up. I was honored that they wanted me to lead them. I will continue to do so until I am the only one in the guild.
RaasBeast Apr 11th 2010 6:18AM
Not to nitpick but just to clarify: the tokens that drop in the 25 mans only upgrade the normal t10 that is acquired through grinding out those 60/95 emblems. IMO its actually much better than what was done for T9 becasue it doesn't mean doubling the grind by using your emblems for ilvl232 and then once more to upgrade to the ilvl245 etc. So I'm sorry you've given up on what is undeniably a very well made raid...
Tirrimas Apr 10th 2010 11:26AM
I'm not a leader, and honestly, have no interest in doing the job. After doing similar jobs irl, I don't want to do it in-game. I might organize a retro raid or something, but managing people isn't my strong suit.
Good guild leaders (and other guild members who take the initiative to keep stuff happening) have my utmost respect. It takes more than a charismatic leader to keep a guild together.