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4-23-2010 @ 12:54PM
This kind of letter is why I refuse to level with other people anymore, and I think it's important to point out that Duoing really only works when both people are generally on the same page when it comes to playstyle and leveling philosophy. People need to understand that just because you're good friends with someone/in love with them, does not mean your playstyles will mesh. Bluntly, I don't duo anymore because it simply drives me fucking insane and sucks all the fun out of the game to have to deal with other people's BS when all I want to do is level. If I wanted to level according to someone else's schedule/quirks, I'd still be playing FFXI. My very first toon (a mage) was supposed to be duo-leveled with my then-BF's shammy, but I got the WoW bug in a bad way and needed zero handholding so I ended up outpacing him by a lot just because of our schedules (I had a lot more free time because he had work + school and all I had was my normal-houred office job). In the end I ended up catching up to his other leveling alt, a paladin that had stalled, and we ended up zooming those two to 70 because his classes ended. It was fun, largely because we had the same philosophy: as many levels as you can in one sitting, no bullshitting around, let's gather as many of these "kill x mobs for a quest" things as we can and AoE them down.The thing is, I've found that every time I've tried to level an alt with someone else, I get driven insane in the first ten minutes. I've been playing this game for 2+ years, I have 14 billion alts and I'm very set in my ways about how I do things when I quest. I'm not skipping xp-rich zones because you don't like them, I'm not doing every step in every exhausting and pointless chain because you want Loremaster, I'm not fucking around with QuestHelper, I'm not stopping every 5 seconds because your cat is setting the house on fire, and I sure as fuck am not doing ANY Nesingwary quests (I hate him like burning). I'm all about brutal efficiency and getting to cap ASAP. If that sounds harsh, keep in mind that's *my* idea of fun; I've done all this crap a million times, on both factions, and speed leveling is the only way to keep it fun for me. I'm sure the people I tried leveling with had just as miserable a time with me, because their idea of fun was diametrically opposed to mine. So I go it alone, and the only time I ever quest with someone else is if I can't manage to solo a group quest (which is pretty rare for me at this point, even with a clothie), or if I see someone else having a hard time with one. If I found someone who digs the way I quest, I'd duo again, but I rather doubt that at this point.Yeah, I realize it's an MMO, but there are a zillion other (much more fun IMO) activities you can do with friends besides leveling--dungeon runs, two-manning old world raids (did that in MC with a pally friend of mine recently XD), dailies, achievements, rare mount farming. I will probably end up duoing again at least once for Cataclysm though because my gf wants to try the game, but that'll be different because the leveling experience will be entirely different and I won't nearly mind it as much to take my time.
4-23-2010 @ 3:31PM
I think people who want to duo definitely have to have their ducks in a row about how they're going to do it. While almost your opposite in approach to leveling (I'm going for Loremaster on all six of my alts, and I have a zone-by-zone schedule that I'm moving them through in tandem), I respect the fact that everyone likes to level differently. I wouldn't dream of subjecting anyone to my madness - even my good friends. I know they'd hate it, they know they'd hate it, and I'd hate the way they'd probably want to level. I call out guildies/friends for help when I get stuck on a group quest I can't complete, otherwise, I stick to solo.Differences in leveling style don't even begin to touch on the whole problem of wanting to play when the other person isn't around, or running into a problem where your schedules maybe only work out 1-2 times a week for a few hours so that leveling, even when it commences and you're in agreement how to do so, is painfully slow. The biggest hurdle for me when it comes to this, aside from the fact that my leveling style is just *weird*, is that I can't really commit myself to running stuff with anyone else until my daughter's asleep for the night so that I can play uninterrupted. And that time is reserved for, mostly, my main toon - dungeon run, battlegrounds, mount runs, raiding, etc. I don't want to shaft my main character, as I need to keep her in good shape for raiding. That leaves very little time for a restrictive schedule with another person.
4-23-2010 @ 3:34PM
Omg our fun doesn't match up I hate this now omg.When you're leveling with someone else there has to be some compromise. Basically you're being selfish...if it's not on your agenda you're simply not going to do it. The other person is expected to follow you around like an NPC pet and do whatever you want to do.So, yea...I agree with you. I think it's best if you level alone.
4-23-2010 @ 4:33PM
It's not a matter of selfishness, I don't think anyway. I don't like (read: hate) PVP at low levels, for instance. Some people in my guild use that as their sole method of leveling. I could never duo with someone who just wanted me to run battleground after battleground. It's mind-numbing to me. The same goes for running dungeons. I acknowledge the fact that my method of loremasterpalooza isn't for everyone. But I'm also running on the tight schedule, for old world at least, of Cataclysm potentially messing up what I'm trying to do. I'm not willing to wait until my characters are 80 and risk going back to do Loremaster only to find out that it very likely will be massively changed simply because of some of the zone changes that will be taking place.Now, I wouldn't be opposed to making a toon of a class I haven't tried yet (shaman or druid) and running it up with a friend. But there are certain things I would not do in the leveling process because I don't like them at all, and because I don't have a lot of time for them. Solo questing is something I can do during the day while taking care of my daughter without worrying about leaving someone (or four other someones, in the case of a dungeon) in a lurch. Even from friends, I've gotten a cold response before when I'm helping them with something during the day and I have to AFK because my daughter needs something - even if I tell them why.I've done the joint leveling thing before, in other games, with other people. And these are all people I know outside the game, not just people I've met in the game. I have never seen tandem leveling work well. Someone's either trying to drag people through zones and quests they want to do too quickly, or doesn't show up at all for weeks at a time leaving the duo character in limbo, or someone has too much free time and starts to move beyond the group, or one person likes to chain run dungeons and everyone else finds it boring. It's a game - not a job. If two or three people don't find playing the same way fun, they probably shouldn't be playing together. You can still play in tandem without being grouped together and questing identically. I find it preferable, really. Everyone's still leveling, but they're doing it enjoyably, and we still can chat on vent or in guild/party chat.Some of us are talking about tandem leveling worgen in Cataclysm. But I'm already hesitant about that because I'm not sure I'm interested in playing a shaman or druid, and the only other class I've not yet played is death knight, which would start a lot higher than the other classes.Go look at your /played time, and tell me, really, are you willing to sacrifice *all* your enjoyment for the amount of time that needs to be invested into leveling a character in tandem with someone when you don't enjoy it? Even mild compromise can make the most compatible duo miserable. That's like trying to force a friend who doesn't like raiding to raid with you. It will not work. In fact, it will likely directly fail, and probably cause more real-life repercussions in your friendship or relationship because of it.
4-24-2010 @ 1:42AM
@ Lemons: Yeah no. Selfishness is expecting someone else to compromise their idea of fun just because you want company.This isn't a marriage, it's my leisure time, and my $15/mo. Leveling is not raiding. My friends get a say in how fast/when I level when they can arrange for my job to give me more paid time off. We do plenty of other things together, on and off the game.
4-26-2010 @ 1:59AM
Oh now I'm the selfish one? Nice deflection.You don't have to be married for there to be a give and take, I think it exists to some degree in all relationships, or at least the ones you actually value. I don't care how you slice it, but the whole "we do it my way or it's not fun" just sounds like the mentality of a 12-year-old brat. Selfish means you're primarily concerned with your own interests, and I think that fits this situation to a T.I find it fun to hang out with certain people and that supersedes whatever need I have to control the situation like and OCD maniac. So when they wanna do a quest I might not wanna do, I'll just do it, because I'd want them to do the same for me. I don't think you're going to hang onto your friends very long once they realize you won't even go a little bit outta your way for them, especially concerning something as trivial as a video game.
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