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4-26-2010 @ 11:41AM
This is the sound of twenty-five mans dying a horrible and painful death.
4-26-2010 @ 11:54AM
not true. 10 mans today drop mainly 2 pieces of gear. i bet they'll keep that loot to person ratio. so in 25 mans, you'll see 5 pieces drop, and increases the chances of that one special piece of gear you've been searching for to show up more often. granted you'll still have to roll against more people. but 25 mans will have the opportunity for it to drop more than 10 mans. (you'll see it more often...)
That was my 1st thought too. Great time to be a tank OK for healers but as a DPS class the options are gonna be very, very limited and raid spots will be reserved for the very best.Is now the time to grab a group of 12 friends and get that 10 man group set up? Could be.
4-26-2010 @ 5:09PM
I honestly think this is an accurate evaluation. IMO, the main motivation for doing 25-mans is the higher ilvl gear, achievements, and better mounts. Gold is already ridiculously easy to make and the fewer number of 10-man drops is not going to dissuade folks. OTOH, getting 25 people to showup 3+ nights/wk and focus on progression is a major PITA.Following the path of least resistance is human nature, just as it is physical nature. Regardless of whether this is Blizzard's intention, this change WILL be the death of 25-mans.
4-26-2010 @ 12:04PM
@WowcoholicIt says higher quantity PER person. So if there's 2 pieces in 10man there will be more than 5 pieces in 25man.
4-26-2010 @ 12:11PM
You know..is that a bad thing then? If just this kills 25 mans (which I seriously doubt) then that means 25 mans were terrible to begin with. If people only went there 'cause the loot was better and not 'cause they liked raiding with their group of friends then yeah, why keep them around?
4-26-2010 @ 12:32PM
It doesn't mean that at all. It means 10mans are easier to organise than 25mans (which, unsurprisingly, it is).The gear is a nice incentive, it provides people with the motivation to create 25mans and for people to show up. However I also enjoy the size of 25mans, the epic feel, the higher co-ordination required, the greater feeling of teamwork, etc.However at the end of the day if I'm looking at a 10minute effort to make a good 10man pug or 45minute-hour slog to get 25 people together (based on my own pug forming experiences) for very little bonus reward...well I'm quite a lazy man.(and before someone chimes in about joining a raiding guild I'd imagine a lot of guild leaders feel the same about getting sign ups and recruiting for their 25mans)
4-26-2010 @ 12:43PM
@Zoe I love 25 man raiding, and I love my 25 man, but I'm not willing to work harder for the same rewards. I'd say that my 25 man stands a fairly good chance of dying, and we fit your "group of friends who enjoy raiding together" characterization.
4-26-2010 @ 12:50PM
@Basil Berntsen So you don't love it enough to keep it going, well then this is great for you, you get to raid for the same rewards isn't it? As far as the 'working harder' the announcement states difficulty will be the same between 10 and 25sLike I said, anyone who doesn't WANT to raid 25 mans doesn't have to anymore.
4-26-2010 @ 2:42PM
@Basil Berntsen"I love 25 man raiding, and I love my 25 man, but I'm not willing to work harder for the same rewards."25 man normal and 10 man heroic drops are the same ilevel right now, but the 10 man heroic encounters are more difficult than the 25 man normal counterparts. This is not an equal system right now.If the difficulty is equivalent you will not be "working harder" for the same rewards. 25 mans will be compensated with extra drops, gold, and badges for the organisational difficulties. YOU WILL BE WORKING THE SAME FOR THE SAME REWARDS."I'd say that my 25 man stands a fairly good chance of dying, and we fit your "group of friends who enjoy raiding together" characterization."Blizzard is not going to stop you from running 25 man raids. You will be able to run them in cataclysm. If your 25 man raid dies it will not be because "Blizzarrd killed it", but because it actually wasn't as much fun for everybody as you thought it was.
4-26-2010 @ 2:43PM
The difficulty with 25 man isn't necessarily the difficulty of the raid itself, but rather getting together a solid, friendly group of 25 people to raid with, without having the claw for people to come raid."For 10 man guilds it's a great change. Get the same loot as a 25man raid without having to do a 25 man raid. For 25 man guilds who have 25+ excellent players it'll be a minor hit not being able to run 10 man content as well as the 25.The guilds I see it having the biggest impact on is the 25 man guilds who either struggle to get 25 players for every raid, or those that have 10 or so great players in a 25 raid but slightly lower calibre members making up the other spots. I can see a fair number of both of those type of guilds switching to solely running 10 man content come Cataclysm as putting together a strong 10 man group is a lot easier than putting together a good 25 man group." (Quoting Floss, a fellow WoW player and good friend)
4-26-2010 @ 4:45PM
Why do all the "25-man raiding will die!" doomsayers keep ignoring the blue quote "25-player versions will drop a higher quantity of loot per player (items, but also badges, and even gold), making it a more efficient route if you're able to gather the people"?Per Player. So if a 10-man boss drops 2 items, 100g and 2 emblems per person, the same boss in 25-man will drop at least 6 items, and more than 250 gold and at least 3 emblems per person.
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