Patch 5.2 interview with Dave Kosak
Inside an old alt's vault
The latest patch 5.2 news
All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsBlizzard to break the AVR mod in Patch 3.3.5
by Fox Van Allen 
May 20th 2010 at 5:00PM
Blizzard poster Bashiok broke the news of AVR's impending demise, citing its invasive nature and the fact that it takes away from the need for on-the-spot decision making:
Bashiok -- AVR Mod Broken in 3.3.5This is a notice that we're making changes in 3.3.5 in attempts to break the ability for the AVR (Augmented Virtual Reality) mod to continue functioning. For those unaware, this mod allows players to draw in the 3D space of the game world, which can then be shared with others who are also using the mod. In some cases this manifests itself through drawing/tagging/defa
The full announcement after the break.
Bashiok -- AVR Mod Broken in 3.3.5This is a notice that we're making changes in 3.3.5 in attempts to break the ability for the AVR (Augmented Virtual Reality) mod to continue functioning. For those unaware, this mod allows players to draw in the 3D space of the game world, which can then be shared with others who are also using the mod. In some cases this manifests itself through drawing/tagging/defa
We're making this change for two reasons. The invasive nature of a mod altering and/or interacting with the game world (virtually or directly) is not intended and not something we will allow. World of Warcraft UI addons are never intended to interact with the game world itself. This is mirrored in our stance and restriction of model and texture alterations. The second reason is that it removes too much player reaction and decision-making while facing dungeon and raid encounters. While some other mods also work to this end, we find that AVR and the act of visualizing strategy within the game world simply goes beyond what we're willing to allow.
The change we're making in attempts to break the functionality is light in its touch and approach. When blocking any functionality we run the risk of affecting other mods, but we've targeted the changes as carefully as possible. If we find that the AVR mod (or any mod attempting to replicate its functions) are usable after 3.3.5 we will take further, more drastic steps.
We're making this change for two reasons. The invasive nature of a mod altering and/or interacting with the game world (virtually or directly) is not intended and not something we will allow. World of Warcraft UI addons are never intended to interact with the game world itself. This is mirrored in our stance and restriction of model and texture alterations. The second reason is that it removes too much player reaction and decision-making while facing dungeon and raid encounters. While some other mods also work to this end, we find that AVR and the act of visualizing strategy within the game world simply goes beyond what we're willing to allow.
The change we're making in attempts to break the functionality is light in its touch and approach. When blocking any functionality we run the risk of affecting other mods, but we've targeted the changes as carefully as possible. If we find that the AVR mod (or any mod attempting to replicate its functions) are usable after 3.3.5 we will take further, more drastic steps.
Reaction to the news will surely be mixed -- there are plenty of purists who feel that AVR's very existence goes against what Warcraft is supposed to be about, and there are plenty of people who find AVR an invaluable tool that does little more than enhance their playing experience.
What's your reaction to the news? Did Blizzard go too far, or were they right in stamping out a blight on the World of Warcraft?
Filed under: Blizzard, News items, Add-Ons
Reader Comments (Page 13 of 14)
sherekhan88 May 21st 2010 5:19AM
Meant an addon really. In general, I was thinking a whiteboard/blackboard addon would be what AVR is, but not to the point that Blizz feels it gives an unfair advantage to the game, as they see it.
Hoggersbud May 21st 2010 10:42AM
I believe that's already in an addon, called Artpad.
http://wow.curse.com/downloads/wow-addons/details/project-5386.aspx
Yada May 21st 2010 3:26AM
Bottom line is it's not just their game -- it's their responsibility to make decisions on how much third parties should be able to add additional functionality to the game. It really doesn't matter what you think of the mod or the decision -- I think we have to respect the fact that the devs have done a pretty good job so far in keeping the game enjoyable and fresh, and if they think this kind of thing has to go, I'm inclined to not second guess them on it.
Thomas Prescott May 21st 2010 4:46AM
Anyone want to take bets on how many of the people saying "thank god AVR is dead" have done at least 9/12 fights in heroic ICC 25?
weltallica May 21st 2010 3:35AM
Don't worry, Lady D's ghosts will STILL be addon-immune.
Camaris May 21st 2010 3:45AM
Good! My guild uses this, but I've hated it from the beginning.
dick May 21st 2010 4:10AM
Hmmm kinda weird this decision since it's not completely fair. They say that it 'interferes' with the game world by displaying stuff in it, but so do other addons. DBM marks players or mobs for example. There are addons that display the locations of nodes on the map. AVR does not actually do stuff like cast stuff or whatsoever, so I cannot see any reason for this particular addon to get broken over several others. Then just shutdown all addon functionality. I have used AVR for a bit and basically it's just an enhanced version of stuff that's already out there. DBM has a range meter too, AVR just shows you a circle.
Positioning use to be done with flares, AVR showed you circles etc.
Been using it only for a short while but I will miss it, it was fun, even used it to do some fun stuff in the guild, for group dancing or following a path in a convoy of Elekks, so everyone knew which path to go.
Too bad Blizzard, bad decision, then again in the end you decide. Still my opinion is that it did not interact with the game world more than other addons. Sure it did stuff, but it's not interaction, just like DBM.
dick May 21st 2010 4:23AM
On a different note. Instead of putting focus into this, I would recommend putting more effort into:
- Farmbots
- Gold selling spam
- Misuse of trade channel for all kinds of stuff besides trade.
Been very annoyed with the last one myself lately. Had trade turned off for about 2 years because I felt the spam and misuse was too much then. Well just turned it on 2 weeks ago and it only has gotten worse during my absence. It sucks when you want to use trade and that more than 80 percent of messages is about guild recruitment, LFG, anal spam and all that crap.
Xenn May 21st 2010 4:53AM
Oh well, just discovered and loved the functionality with totemrange, and was using uniquely for that... oh well, will need to drop totems more often to make sure they are in range at all times... just like i did until last week i guess!
Xenn May 21st 2010 4:54AM
btw edit button - TotemRadius was the one! :D
Glacios May 21st 2010 5:14AM
I used AVR / AVR Encounters for a couple of weeks now. Is it the crutch most people are saying it is...no. It's merely a tool for minor convenience. Before I got it...nothing was any harder. So on rotface and putricide I did an extra few seconds of running throughout the entire fight...oh well...no difference. Honestly the only things it really trivialized was the empowered vortex on blood princes and ice tomb placement on Sindragosa.
Like dick...I feel that there are better things blizzard could be spending their time on. Practically every hour I get whispers from people trying to steal my account information (very poorly might I add). And if you ever dare enter the maelstrom that is Trade Chat, you get plenty of gold sellers.
I liked the addon...but I really don't need it to play. It just made a couple things a little more convenient. I always found DBM or DXE basically telling you exactly when defile was going to hit was more game breaking than this. But, do as you will Blizzard. Try actually fixing the gold problem next...maybe just ban anyone who posts something like that in trade...that might help.
Dude May 21st 2010 5:28AM
There's always Second Life for self created genitalia. Er, or so a friend told me.
Meow_whoosh May 21st 2010 5:53AM
Perhaps someone has mentioned this already, but anyway.
A lot of the people assume AVRE is used and abused in simple fights. Blood Princes is not that hard, with it it just becomes less annoying. My main use of it was in the 25 man HC Putricide fight with up to 3 malleable goos and a jumping disease you can't pass to someone 2 times.
The way DBM and defualt UI show these events is a crime against humanity. The goo bouncess off the floor and flies in a way that in full 25 man raid, with all the flashes and movement is difficult to follow. If the targetted person has good latency, they will start running away from it faster than the rest notices, which will mean others can actually run into goo thinking they are running away from the targetted person. The disease is even worse. If you've had it, you have a faint green aura arfound your middrift. Each toon in 25 man has like 5-6 graphical effects around them! Because the WOW engine is so CPU intensive, I have to play with minimal graphics settings, plus I play really zoomed out for positioning. That means I have huge issues seeing who's already been infected, and finding that single ranged who's clear of the debuff.
If Blizz removes the addon, sure, go ahead. But make sure that the relevant raid cues are actually visible to people who play on low graphics, or are zoomed out. Otherwise, an encounter that still requires heaps of skill (with AVR) is reduced to a RNG based wipefest.
Fletch May 21st 2010 7:09AM
Whilst I can understand Blizzard changing the programming to break this mod, it's a pity they don't seem to show quite the same rigour in fixing the problem of those annying farmers who travel around Wintergrasp at high speed invisibly mining nodes
mindrazor May 21st 2010 7:46AM
Blizzard has to start breaking addons. This way they can make money selling their missing functionality back to us. $2.99 a month for WoW Raid Assist anyone?
styopa May 21st 2010 7:56AM
Not really fair, in my mind.
One of the main failings with videogame-vs-reality in utility is that in real life you can talk to someone in context, and point to a spot on the floor saying "be sure to stand over there, right THERE". It's FAR, FAR more efficient than trying to describe the location "stand over there, just to the left of the statue and inline between the boss and that flaming brazier. No that statue. No the one holding the bowl. No the other brazier. The thing on fire. No that's the hunter and that's his fault/problem, I'm talking about a torchlike thing. Yeah. Ok, now the other 23...."
You simply cannot do that as video game characters.
DBM tells you far more info that (in reality) you shouldn't really know - like when the boss will enrage, etc. AVR simply restores functions that one would have in the real life, plus the ability to paint crude genitalia so it's a net win.
Patrick May 21st 2010 9:44AM
This is a notice that we’re making changes, in attempts to break the ability for the Free Speech Party to continue functioning. For those unaware, this group allows citizens to meet together and discuss what is wrong with our government, which can then be shared with others who are also in the group. In some cases this manifests itself through rallies/conventions/revolutions in the world, but more popularly is used to give a voice for those who disagree with us.
We’re making this change for two reasons. The potential undermining nature of the group and/or changing the government is not intended and not something we will allow. Groups held by the citizens are never intended to interact with the government itself. This is mirrored in our stance and restriction of free speech and personal rights. The second reason is that it removes too much player patriotism and gives people the ability of decision-making when it comes to our government. While some other groups also work to this end, we find that the Free Speech Party and the act of rallies against the government simply goes beyond what we’re willing to allow.
The change we’re making in attempts to break the functionality is light in its touch and approach. When blocking any functionality we run the risk of affecting other groups, but we’ve targeted the changes as carefully as possible. If we find that the Free Speech Party group (or any group attempting to replicate its functions) are meeting after these changes we will take further, more drastic steps.
--------------------
THEY CAME FIRST for AVR,
and I didn't speak up because I didn't use AVR.
THEN THEY CAME for Deadly Boss Mods,
and I didn't speak up because I didn't use DBM.
THEN THEY CAME for Grid,
and I didn't speak up because I didn't use Grid.
THEN THEY CAME for me
and by that time no one was left to speak up.
While this is a drastic comparison, it serves to illuminate the issue. Free Speech is not just limited to words, or causes. It extends to art, and expression. Does AVR make the game too easy? Perhaps. But where do you draw the line? At what point does a mod get banned because it takes away from the challenge of the game, and at what point does a mod get banned because the powers in charge fear change or power within their communities hands?
AVR is not hacking the game. It is simply allowing players to draw on the game field to help react to boss encounters. How is this different than Power Auras? How is this different than BigWigs making your screen flash and shake? Where is the line? If we don't stand up for basic freedoms of speech, we give up all our rights as players of this community.
Hoggersbud May 21st 2010 10:46AM
This isn't about Freedom of Speech. Stop trying to distort the argument with push button issues.
And you want to know where the line is drawn? It's drawn around the space where it comes to directly interacting with objects in the game. Which through various methods of interpolation is what AVR did.
WoWie Zowie May 21st 2010 8:37AM
i liked AVR for rotface. during the angry poopoo
Ayden May 21st 2010 8:45AM
I personally am sad to see it go. I tried it out for one run through of ICC and was asked by my raid not to run it for fear of banning/losing kills over it. I have a hard time measuring distances in game.
In the Blood Princes fight for example when Empowered Shock Vortex is about to go off, you have to be 30 yards from the tank/boss and 10 yards from any other player. I as a Resto Shaman tank healer on this fight, have a hard time when I have 4 melee characters all running in my direction. Yes DXE/DBM has a range check box that gives me a name, and a distance, but I have very little to no time to react to this, realize they are too close, decide which onscreen character it is, see if they are continuing to move out of my radius, or whether I need to move. All while trying to focus on healing my tank, and anyone else in range that needs a little touch up to stay alive. That visual ring radius around me, made it a little quicker in telling which character was too close, and which direction I needed to move in to be safe.
I remember reading this somewhere else recently, it wouldn't be such a big deal if there wasn't such a huge difference in the amount of damage you took if you were say 6.99 yards away from someone versus 7 yards.