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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsBlizzard to break the AVR mod in Patch 3.3.5
by Fox Van Allen 
May 20th 2010 at 5:00PM
Blizzard poster Bashiok broke the news of AVR's impending demise, citing its invasive nature and the fact that it takes away from the need for on-the-spot decision making:
Bashiok -- AVR Mod Broken in 3.3.5This is a notice that we're making changes in 3.3.5 in attempts to break the ability for the AVR (Augmented Virtual Reality) mod to continue functioning. For those unaware, this mod allows players to draw in the 3D space of the game world, which can then be shared with others who are also using the mod. In some cases this manifests itself through drawing/tagging/defa
The full announcement after the break.
Bashiok -- AVR Mod Broken in 3.3.5This is a notice that we're making changes in 3.3.5 in attempts to break the ability for the AVR (Augmented Virtual Reality) mod to continue functioning. For those unaware, this mod allows players to draw in the 3D space of the game world, which can then be shared with others who are also using the mod. In some cases this manifests itself through drawing/tagging/defa
We're making this change for two reasons. The invasive nature of a mod altering and/or interacting with the game world (virtually or directly) is not intended and not something we will allow. World of Warcraft UI addons are never intended to interact with the game world itself. This is mirrored in our stance and restriction of model and texture alterations. The second reason is that it removes too much player reaction and decision-making while facing dungeon and raid encounters. While some other mods also work to this end, we find that AVR and the act of visualizing strategy within the game world simply goes beyond what we're willing to allow.
The change we're making in attempts to break the functionality is light in its touch and approach. When blocking any functionality we run the risk of affecting other mods, but we've targeted the changes as carefully as possible. If we find that the AVR mod (or any mod attempting to replicate its functions) are usable after 3.3.5 we will take further, more drastic steps.
We're making this change for two reasons. The invasive nature of a mod altering and/or interacting with the game world (virtually or directly) is not intended and not something we will allow. World of Warcraft UI addons are never intended to interact with the game world itself. This is mirrored in our stance and restriction of model and texture alterations. The second reason is that it removes too much player reaction and decision-making while facing dungeon and raid encounters. While some other mods also work to this end, we find that AVR and the act of visualizing strategy within the game world simply goes beyond what we're willing to allow.
The change we're making in attempts to break the functionality is light in its touch and approach. When blocking any functionality we run the risk of affecting other mods, but we've targeted the changes as carefully as possible. If we find that the AVR mod (or any mod attempting to replicate its functions) are usable after 3.3.5 we will take further, more drastic steps.
Reaction to the news will surely be mixed -- there are plenty of purists who feel that AVR's very existence goes against what Warcraft is supposed to be about, and there are plenty of people who find AVR an invaluable tool that does little more than enhance their playing experience.
What's your reaction to the news? Did Blizzard go too far, or were they right in stamping out a blight on the World of Warcraft?
Filed under: Blizzard, News items, Add-Ons
Reader Comments (Page 2 of 14)
Sunsinger May 21st 2010 11:28AM
AVR and DBM-like mods remove the need for awareness? What kind of awareness are we talking about? Keeping 3-4 different timers for various boss abilities in mind while also doing something else (like DPS-ing, healing, or especially tanking)? Do you even know a person that had that kind of awareness in the first place?
FFS, really, WoW is about killing things more than about anything else. PVE-wise this killing process relies on flawless execution, plus, of course, lots of luck, which is why some guilds spend weeks and weeks on encounters that others luckily beat much sooner. Ok now, luck isn't something we can control, but there are aspects of game we can control and where is the reason for impairing our ability to do so? Warfare evolved with humanity, and so did its tools, ultimately making it more and more convenient where it was possible. And same is true for any kind of a challenge. Should we stop selling whiteboards and markers to John Madden, because the depth of his planning is too "invasive" and the game should have much more randomness? Ok, why not just set all abilities for all bosses to go off randomly? Why not make virtually unkillable EQ1-esque bosses were absolutely perfect execution would only increase your chances of beating an encounter by around 1%, leaving 99% to other factors?
Come on now, are they serious? I still can't believe Blizzard is taking this course of action. They worked for years to make warfare in wow more convenient, eliminating technical challenges and allowing us to face more tactical ones, certain talent trees that were mostly random talent collections became distinct raid and pvp viable specs (hello, Tyler Caraway =), certain annoying-to-refresh debuffs got longer durations, certain mechanics changed to allow us to think less about maintaining rotations and more about beating the encounters, but now this is a huge leap in an opposite direction.
So instead of giving us smarter bosses they start breaking our tools that evolved over years and allow us to deal with those in more convenient ways?
Which one is next? Healbot? DBM? ForteXorcist and other dotimers? I swear, DoT precast indicator is so "invasive", because it makes my life so much easier. Maybe you should ban Vent and Teamspeak too? Come on, swing that hammer on all of the tactical planning efforts, our discontent can't possibly be more vocal than that of tree druids.
Sure, dear Blizzard, we will coup with anything you do, because we have little choice (yeah, right), but on this particular matter hear me say this and hear so many agree:
You. Are. Wrong.
Jorges May 21st 2010 1:39PM
People a comparing apples with pears when they compare AVR to DBM.
DBM only prints on the screen the normal cues that bosses do, either by emotes or by actions exposed on the combat log. The calculations of spell timers and other kind of information DBM shows is normally available by analizing the combat log.
DBM will go as far as PRINTING MESSAGES ON SCREEN, wich in no way will tell you where to stand or where to go. DBM tells you "RUN AWAY LITTLE GIRL", but it doesn't tell you where to run. And it isn't even 100% accurate, i've seen timers go off before things actually happen.
AVR goes farther than this, and it draws ON THE GAME WORLD where you have or don't have to go... it's a graphical DON'T STAY IN THE FIRE addon. It's definitely intrusive from a design point of view, and if you mix AVR + DBM (I don't know if AVRE print messages like DBM) you are not far away from letting addons play for you, wich is not what Blizzard wants.
I completely agree with the removal of AVRE. I liked AVR "core" though. Was pretty nice for explaining fights.
catharsis80 May 21st 2010 1:46PM
Damn, this this was awesome. Our guild made this mod a requirement like DBM a few weeks ago. Useful on just about every fight.
Another awesome use: Some people just couldn't get the last phase in 25-man Sindragosa. So, we decided to do a drill inside the empty gauntlet chamber using AVR. A member drew two circles beside her indicating where the two groups stand, and another two to show where the people with ice blocks go. They'd put skulls on the iceblock targets, who were then to react and go where they should go. Tanks (me included) would rotate in and out, alternating clearing their buffs, calling out "Clear" in vent. We kept doing it until people could finally feel out what was going on.
We then went to fight her and downed her that attempt.
I understand Blizzard removing the in-fight functionality, like showing a red circle around ice block targets, indicating where others are NOT to stand, but it would be nice if we could still do the drill part I just talked about.
Para May 22nd 2010 6:05PM
@Veirit
Lets tear this rubbish appart slowly shall we?
"extremely timing dependent bosses where you have to be in exactly the right place and the right time otherwise you go insta-splat"
No just plain f***ing no, hc modes are just APPROACHING the same level of difficulty of TBC bosses, which was how progression should be. It wasnt hand it just required you to learn encounters and have the gear for them.
Currently you can do ICC 10-25 in badge farmed gear up to PP or even further if you have a group that knows their classes, why? because the gear requirement isnt high so if your failing then its because someone(or many) in your raid is being a total F***wits. End off.
There is a reason so many people struggled with kara before it was nerfed.
"and if you have latency above 50ms you'll die anyhow" No thats just you not being able to play, sorry truth hurts yo! I hear a lot of the players in australia play with 200-300 ms if they are lucky, I myself in the UK only notice lag over 200 ms and even then its not that bad it only becomes unplayable after 500 or 600 ms.
"This mod kinda helped with that sort of problem."
This mod kinda helped idiot keyboard turners + ppl who are just plain terrible at the game. Fixed your statement.
"Lack of raid awareness (which also goes with execution) is the single largest cause of raid wipe"
No s**t Sherlock.
"and most all these mods like DBM, Healbot, Grid and Decursive (I think named all the essentials for raiding there) most regard as ESSENTIAL to helping you do your job while being aware of whats going on it in the raid - AVR was just another tool akin to all the others I mentioned."
DBM just states things nothing else, it doesnt tell you who to heal or who to decurse or where to move and when, it just simply says "boss is using this" or "boss used x on y" Healbot is for bads who click
Grid shows everything the standard raid ui shows, it just allows you to custimize it.
Never used decursive never needed it so its clearly not essential.
AVR was nothing like these AVR TOLD YOU WHERE TO GO AND WHEN, it left nothing up to the person.
Pve rotations are easy, how hard is it to watch where you are too your teamates and check for when the boss uses what ability? Answer - not very, if you fail at it, its either because your bad or trying to do too much dps at the cost of survivability/
Xandee May 25th 2010 1:40PM
Hmm...
So 5, 10, 15, 20% buffs.
Tier gear available with badges. I mean serious you can complete gear yourself in the various badge gear items.
All things that cater to the "casual" player Blizzard seems to LOVE so much. AVRE is just the perfect addon for Blizzards target market. Yet they want to break it?
Maybe they should stop giving badges too and go back to people having to know how to play to get gear like they did in BC.
Maybe they should stop writing such fail content and go back to what was TRUE progression in BC.
No wait. Let's spend our development time on breaking some addon that helps the casuals be not as fail.
techdork May 26th 2010 2:54PM
There is one key element that is being forgotten. There are a number of players out there who are not you.... what do I mean? They have physical disabilities, they are much older, they are not 18 year old high school kids. Our guild has a number of grandparents who play just to be with their family, we also have a few people with disabilities. Until this mod they were too self conscious to even try and raid. This tool allow their slow responses to at least have a good idea of what they should be doing. In the end they played the game, maybe not the best, but they had a great time with their friends and family. If you think the mod makes the game too "easy" dont download the addon, simple. For those who dont have a choice, it opens the doors to whole new world.
Instead of Blizz "breaking" something created within the guidelines they set forth, take the time to develop a better game. A game playable by all, allowing for each person to decide what addons they can use.
dkslatten Jun 1st 2010 6:10PM
I will miss you AVR,
if only because you allowed me to see things that I could not see without 100% spell detail.
Idea: lets not have 1 shot kill affects with a 10 yrd radious if the players cant see where the affect is happening. Through the 25 players and thier special effects while casting, plus pets, plus mobs, plus giant boss, throw in a little lag, and a miscommunication or two over vent, and what were the chances a raider was going to see that zone, stop casting, move to an appropriate area (sometimes a specific distance from other players)?
Raids look more like a field of drunken todlers than any orginized effort, mostly due to the fact people cant SEE where to go, and the distances required for that movement.
thebestloser3 May 20th 2010 5:03PM
Crutches are gone.
evanmbunnell May 20th 2010 5:06PM
Too bad the assholes are still here.
thebestloser3 May 20th 2010 5:08PM
How does being situational aware make me an asshole?
evanmbunnell May 20th 2010 5:11PM
Talking about the poster whom I replied to.
Now I just think you're dumb. ;-)
evanmbunnell May 20th 2010 5:12PM
I'm the dumb!
Sadface.
evanmbunnell May 20th 2010 5:17PM
Your original comment had nothing to do with you being situationally aware, though it did make you sound asshole'ish in the sense that you were calling people who use mods virtually handicapped.
PS. Can we get some comment editing / deletion yet? Christ, WoWinsider. Lichslap AoL and tell em what's up.
Golis May 20th 2010 5:29PM
Hey, now before we point fingers and say, "bye bye crutches," I want you to check your own interface and see if you have Omen installed... How about DBM? Does your healer use Healbot? Heaven forbid you have Questhelper or Auctioneer...
Crutches, everyone.
And yet, I bet you have some of them installed right now. The Mod developer in this case used an ingeneous method that while against the spirit of the developers was not considered an exploitation at the time. The Mod developers thought they had a smokin' deal.
The game balancers have decided to alter the agreement.
Pray they do not alter the deal anymore!
Hefren May 20th 2010 5:42PM
Kudo's for the Vader reference there. I laughed.
jv_gdesign May 20th 2010 5:55PM
They once said that DBM was a crutch. And that it took away from the ability required by players. And there are so many of those bossmods now and they were never banned.
AVR is ingenious and took the bossmods to the next level though. It goes from showing a list of people you are too close to, to actually drawing circles around them.
I suppose it was only a matter of time though. I didn't think it was a huge deal, but what the Blues say, goes.
Para May 22nd 2010 6:19PM
@ golis
"Omen installed... How about DBM? Does your healer use Healbot? Heaven forbid you have Questhelper or Auctioneer..."
Omen, Auctioneer and QH have all been partially implemented into the standard ui so obviously blizz thought they were a good idea, and they didnt take the choice away from the player they just generally saved time. For example if avr was desinged for leveling it would not only tell you where to go but draw circles and arrows to mobs you need to kill.
Also DBM just picks info from the combat log which blizz puts in and makes the text REALLY BIG in the middle of your screen, you could do without it but it just makes things that are already there more obvious, unlike AVR which draws into the game what you have to do and when.....2 completely different things.
GiGa May 20th 2010 5:04PM
And let the QQ begin
Tim {the other Tim} May 20th 2010 5:36PM
Pandering to the casuals again. Wait what?
Anathemys May 20th 2010 5:44PM
It's okay.
I feed on tears...