The Art of War(craft): Looking ahead to battleground guilds

Arguably one of the biggest features of Cataclysm -- I say "arguably" because World of Warcraft's next expansion is going to have a ton of new features -- would be guild talents and progression. Not much has been revealed about this feature, but it has the potential to forever change the way guilds work. In particular, the emergence of rated battlegrounds combined with guild talents geared towards PvP play can possibly result in a schism between PvP and PvE players, forcing them to choose between a PvE-oriented guild or a PvP-centric one.
The guild progression system is such a great incentive for players to be part of a guild and allows guilds a better focus -- a guild's choice of talents should indicate the character of a guild. Although the benefits are relatively minor, they are telling of a guild's priorities, such as increased gold drops off bosses or reduced repair costs. Blizzard has only revealed a taste of PvE guild talents for now, but developers have mentioned that there will be PvP guild talents as well. This is where the potential for conflict arises. Players currently have dual specs that allow them to keep a spec for raiding and another talent spec for PvP, but will guilds have the same flexibility? There's not enough information to know for sure right now, but if there are distinct trees or talent for PvP and PvE, players will have to make some tough decisions when forming or joining a guild. In that scenario, guilds geared towards battlegrounds or even arena play will form and for the first time, players who thrive in PvP will have an environment in which to flourish.
I mentioned in last week's column that Cataclysm allowed Blizzard to reboot the game and work with an essentially blank canvas. Sure, it's still Azeroth, but everything has changed. This time around, they're working PvP and battleground play into the game directly instead of an adjunct feature, even going so far as to create abilities and talents that would be awesome on the battlefield. I don't believe their approach to guild leveling would be any different. It's reasonable to expect that the same attention to PvP enthusiasts will show in the talents available to guilds. Perhaps a talent to increase honor gains? How about a talent that allows players to loot more gold off enemy players' corpses? Maybe they could even loot special items, similar to the quirky loot table of Alterac Valley. How about increased healing from bandages while in a battleground?
The possibilities are pretty exciting. As a player who has always been more interested in the PvP aspect of the game, none of the announced guild talents really excited me. Having been part of a progressive raiding guild, I understood the appeal and practicality of getting more gold from bosses, or mass resurrection, or increased benefits from guild potions ... but none of them were going to enrich my PvP experience. I'm certain most players enjoy the PvE aspect of the game with a good helping of PvP on the side, but there are a few players who do enjoy the PvP game a whole lot more. Arena- or battleground-centric guilds allow these people to gravitate toward each other and get some benefits along the way.
Blizzard has yet to unveil its whole plan for the battlegrounds, but we already know how items will be easier to obtain, putting PvP gear acquisition at least on par with high-end PvE gear. Granted, there will always be more items from mobs, dungeons and raids at every level, but it's an extremely promising development. These little things all point to a conscious effort by Blizzard to put the PvP and PvE experiences on equal footing.
Would a PvP-centric guild make sense?
I'm fairly certain I'm in the minority when I express my desire for PvP-oriented talents or guild. But I'm also certain that more than a few of us exist, and the possibility of guild-wide benefits geared towards battleground and arena play is extremely exciting. What kind of talents would be appropriate and what would be imbalanced? Would a talent that lowers the cap time of flags in battlegrounds to seven seconds as opposed to the normal eight be overpowered? Or would it be a junk guild talent? The balance here is delicate because players would be going up against other players and Blizzard would be loathe to give an advantage through guild talents. Then again, it could be part of the grander scheme -- guilds going up against other guilds, with the PvP-oriented ones getting minor benefits in the battlegrounds.
The thought of belonging to a guild focused mainly on PvP appeals to me. With rated battlegrounds, Blizzard seems to be encouraging the kind of organization and focus that has always been present in raiding guilds. Battleground premades are common, but these are often PUGs organized by a handful of PvP enthusiasts. Rated battlegrounds will institutionalize them. One of the methods by which guilds can gain XP is through rated battlegrounds or arenas, where 75% of the players in the team belong to the same guild. This encourages players in the same guild to play together.
Rated battlegrounds almost demand the creation of battleground guilds. Arena teams are too small to necessitate such organization -- pretty much any guild can field an arena team (for purposes of XP gain). On the other hand, the 10-man Warsong Gulch is the smallest battleground and for rated battlegrounds would certainly require the kind of coordination and planning commonly associated with guilds. If the increasingly casual environment in Wrath devalued guilds and encouraged PUGs, the new guild progression system will revive the former and discourage the latter.
Naturally, PvP-oriented guild talents are required for battleground guilds to thrive. Otherwise, it wouldn't really matter which guild you join as long as it's committed to the occasional rated battleground play and hopefully has enough members with an inclination towards PvP. Until we see the rest of what Blizzard has planned for guild talents and progression, it's difficult to determine if such battleground guilds will actually form. But I'm hopeful. It's a pretty exciting concept.
What if I want to raid, too?
The truth is, a lot of players enjoy both the PvE and PvP aspects of the game, and one doesn't necessarily preclude the other. This is what will make a potential schism definitive of a player. Players will be identified with the kind of guild they belong to, by the talents their guild chooses. I would, for example, much prefer to be in a guild that has PvP benefits and be willing to forego all the extras provided by PvE guilds. I can do without the extra gold or lowered repair costs. I would much rather gain bonus honor while playing with guildmates.
Players can also make guild alliances that allow some members of another guild into their raiding or battleground groups while keeping the 75% ratio needed to earn XP. Real ID will make it trivial to communicate with friends, rendering guild chat less exclusive. Battleground guilds can pretty much squeeze raids into their schedule, anyway, albeit without the benefit of guild talents. Perhaps it's a little premature now to speculate on the specifics of battleground guilds, but it's a possibility that looms on the horizon and is only one of the many ways Cataclysm is going to change the game.
Filed under: PvP, The Art of War(craft) (PvP)






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
ToyChristopher May 21st 2010 2:07PM
I'm afraid of this new guild system. It just seems like it will cause more trouble then it will be worth. Of course, I'll have to wait and see.
Eternauta May 21st 2010 7:12PM
I feel the same way too, sometimes. This system basically consists on making guilds more "focused", structured and less flexible than they currently are. So those players that prefer to do "a little bit of everything, but nothing in depth" will probably get the short end of the stick.
On the other hand, they're giving us guild achievements (which makes life a lot easier to guild-ranking websites like WoWprogress or Guild Ox), guild talent points we can invest on crazy awesome things like mass-resurrection, insta-summon raids, guild heirlooms for every gear slot...
I think this new system is worth the risk.
Berryaire May 21st 2010 2:10PM
Excellent post, Zach.
I would love to see Blizzard introduce significant incentives for PVP-focused guilds in Cataclysm- like you said, the possibilities are exciting.
Ragen May 21st 2010 2:18PM
I'm actually considering starting a Pre-Season group in which we'll work together on the strats and run training sessions to improve our coordination.
I'm hoping a guild won't be necessary to compete (as those who have the more advantages will prosper at equal skill levels) and the talents are really just vanity benefits (Like more honor [which of itself is an advantage, but not a big one]).
If necessary, I will make one though. It may be tough to bring out the character's I use as mains, but it just might be needed.
jealouspirate May 21st 2010 2:20PM
I will absolutely be looking to a join a PvP guild focused on rated BGs when Cataclysm arrives. It's my most anticipated endgame feature.
Desmeister May 21st 2010 2:21PM
Great post, as usual. The only things that worries me about the changes is the talk of this "Guild Tax". I don't mind sharing 5% of whatever drops of the things I kill but (especially in larger guilds) a lot of the planning might come out on the higher levels and people at the bottom of the ladder end up getting the short stick on where all that extra money goes to. Also, who decides where the guild currency goes to? Although I'm assuming it all goes to the GL, Although many GL's are experienced enough to talk it out with people, I'm sure there would be a lot of conflict as to which items and talents to spend it on...
Revash May 21st 2010 2:43PM
There's no guild tax, anything relating to gold drops will be in excess of what would drop normally... For example if 10 gold drops off a mob and you can get 10% gold drops into the guild bank as a talent, it will still be ten gold distributed to the raid plus 10s to the guild bank, it won't be 10g -10% cut to the guild bank. In effect it's not a tax, it's a bonus.
Lee Weaver May 21st 2010 4:38PM
10% of 10gold is 1 gold not 10 silver
Gimmlette May 21st 2010 2:22PM
Interesting point of view. I think it will spice up forum chatting with guilds puffing their collective chests about which style is better.
As you said, it's too early to know what Blizzard has in mind. One thing that does concern me about your speculation is how it affects people like me. I don't PvP but my guild offers on irregular occasions, "Guild BG Night". We form a group and hit 3 or 4 BGs in an evening. People who hate, loathe and abhor PvP will go these nights. We are lousy. We die, a lot, but we have lots of fun because we're with people we know. My PvP Officer tells us the objective of the BG, explains the fight and we do our best to win.
Will we be steamrollered by PvP Guilds? There are way too many self-annointed "experts" in BG's as it is. Is it possible to have some way of delineating that we are casual PvPers and are just doing this for fun instead of hard-core PvPers? People who get to what could be considered the "top" of the BG charts seem to conveniently forget they had to run into the BG for the first time and then spend hours learning it. There's already entirely too much bashing of people in the BG trying to learn it. I fear this kind of guild system will make that worse.
But, for those for whom the game is about player versus player instead of computer, this will be a boon for you. I hope Blizzard can implement this for everyone's benefit.
AltairDusk May 21st 2010 2:55PM
I may be wrong but I believe the option will still be there to run regular non-rated BH's which should be more casual-friendly.
Pam May 21st 2010 2:25PM
*distracted by pacman*
Burnaphatone May 21st 2010 2:37PM
Would a talent that lowers the cap time of flags in battlegrounds to nine seconds as opposed to the normal 10 be overpowered?
Pretty sure the cap time is 8 seconds now.
Zach May 21st 2010 2:51PM
Fixed. Still stuck in old school mode, forgot they changed that in 3.2! Thanks for the heads up.
Burnaphatone May 21st 2010 3:01PM
No problem homie. You can send me my compensation for performing editorial duties in game gold to Oxycut on Aegwynn (Alliance). :)
Wildebeast May 21st 2010 2:32PM
Thank you for the multi-faceted approach to this subject. I was allowed to form my own opinion despite the fact your article was based on theories and ideas, albeit educated ones.
I'm not gonna get too excited, I'm the kind of player that represents a VERY small faction of individuals who treat this game like its a console Thrid Person Shooter. I group with people in Pick up Groups because I have to in an attempt to stay competitive (Xwrath-Hyjal). All my six 80s are bank alts with multiple personal guild banks.
I'd like to hear if anyone else plays my style of game. Please do not confuse me for someone who treats others like pixels on the screen, I'm quite mindful when rolling on gear and committing to groups that individuals with lives, families, and jobs are on the other end of the Fortitude Buff my bear tank is so grateful for!
Thanks again for the article.
Marathal May 21st 2010 2:36PM
I am sure there are others with the same opinion.
They are offering added bonuses to players that are part of a guild. I think what may end up happening, and I hope that I am wrong, is the formation of Mega Guilds. Guilds with 500+ members with sub groups devoted to PvPers, Questers, and Raiders. All of the small friends guilds will be absorbed into the larger collectives.
OMG Blizzard is the Borg. Resistance is Futile.
Revash May 21st 2010 2:46PM
Bloodlust is going to be where it's at for rated battlegrounds. I've been running a premade organization for the last 9 months that's been running pretty much 24/7. To say I'm looking forward to it is a drastic understatement.
Elmouth May 21st 2010 2:55PM
Oh noes! The guild tag! It buuuuuuuuurns!!!
Really?
pyroroko May 21st 2010 2:56PM
I could see them making a talent ability that would benefit Pvp but possibly be useful in PvE too, something like a "Helping Hand", having a close range, and you'd be able to break free another guild member from snares and such, like casting the Human talent "Every Man for Himself" on one of your mates. It's geared toward pvp, but would give you the snare removal without having to lug around a Insignia of the Horde/Alliance in raids.
madog May 21st 2010 2:59PM
make a pvp dungoen side for pvp and pvp gear can be used in it and drop drop