Shifting Perspectives: Moonkin form in Cataclysm, page 2

For all the talk that I generally do about PvE stuff, I don't mean to totally ignore the PvP side of the game. Druids are, in a general sense, a fairly squishy class when they are caught unshifted or shifted into Cat Form. Similarly to how rogues are currently far too easy to kill once their cooldowns are gone, druids are just as easy to kill when we aren't in a form. Due to how soft leather armor is, Moonkin Form has become the first and last line of defense that balance druids have against being completely destroyed by anything that tries to poke us with sharp instruments of death. The increased armor on Moonkin Form is a very big deal, far bigger than people realize, and yet even that isn't all that high.
It is a very common misconception that a balance druid running around in Moonkin Form has plate levels of armor; the truth is that it is closer to that of mail armor while using a shield, which is a good 5% or more less physical damage reduction than pure plate offers even when not using a shield. What's more, both warriors and death knights have methods to further increase their damage reduction via Defensive Stance or Frost Presence. The damage reduction implications from these abilities aside, they still remain as options for when the warrior or death knight is being trained and aren't something that can be totally written off as useless.
When it comes to PvP, Moonkin Form is far too much of our defense as it stands currently. There is nothing inherently wrong with that fact, and there is a balance to it. Just as warriors or death knights have to give up damage or utility in order to drop into their defensive modes, we have to give up our ability to heal in order to gain higher defenses and marginally increased damage. That is the drawback of being in Moonkin Form, yet I would say that the benefits of Moonkin Form are not nearly enough to cover the cost that we have to pay for it.
Make no mistake, going into a heavy PvP battle outside of Moonkin Form is not a wise choice; you are bound to get slaughtered if you attempt it, yet for the utility of healing that we have to give up in order to be in our defensive mode, we simply do not gain enough. As a respectable comparison, a balance druid in Moonkin Form is going to take more damage than a shadow priest in Shadowform. One could argue that this is somewhat acceptable. A balance druid still has access to Entangling Roots, Cyclone and Typhoon while shifted, although a priest would have access to Psychic Scream, Psychic Horror and Silence.
I don't want to turn this into a shadow priest versus balance druid debate. There are pros and cons across both sides, and devolving into a juvenile "but they have what I want" argument is both petty and useless. The point I am attempting to make here is that balance druids need a little bit more protection against damage than they currently have; most importantly, they need that protection to not come from Moonkin Form.
Having some of our survivability tied into Moonkin Form is a good thing; it isn't something that should change at all. By giving up the ability to heal, a balance druid does need the ability to take more punishment. That being said, druids are not priests and balance druids are not shadow priests. It might be expected that a shadow priest almost always relies upon staying in Shadowform while in PvP (although I would argue against that premise as well), but it certainly is not acceptable to expect a balance druid to always remain in Moonkin Form. We are a shapeshifting class; shapeshifting is what we do, what we are, and shapeshifting needs to be far more versatile that it is today.
In PvP, a vast majority of druids do not actively shapeshift at all. Beyond feral druids who will sometimes choose between Cat or Bear Form depending on their needs, you will almost always see a restoration druid in Tree of Life and a balance druid in Moonkin Form. They will not change; they will not unshift, because to do so is to invite death. Being unshifted makes a druid far too weak currently; druids across the board need better survivability when they aren't in their respective defensive forms. I cannot say how this should be done, only that it should.
Damage reduction capability is a concept that I personally feel is far beyond the prowess of the player base. Yes, we can do calculations that offer strict mitigation comparisons; yes, we can make suggestions on what could improve survivability. But at the end of the day, only Blizzard can really understand how they wish for the vast matrix of everything that encompasses survivability to be balanced. After all, survivability is far more than mere mitigation; it is cooldowns, it is escape mechanics, it is CC, it is everything. A balance druid may have far higher mitigation than a frost mage, but the mage is going to have much higher survivability due wide array of abilities that they possess to avoid damage entirely.
There is no way of knowing precisely which portion of survivability is too low or what tweaks (even minor ones) might cause it to skyrocket. Nothing in PvP can be changed as a stand-alone mechanic; everything that is changed interacts with every other ability in the game in some way, especially when it comes to subjects such as this. This is why I generally choose to avoid speaking in terms of changing PvP. There are simply far too many variables that need to be considered. Even the smallest of changes would take pages upon pages of theorycrafting in order to properly guess how it might alter the PvP scene.
Make no mistake, though: Balance druids do need higher survivability, and they need for it to not be tied to Moonkin Form. Having the option to give up some amount of survivability to use our healing spells isn't an option at all if doing so means we will instantly go splat. Balance druids need to have that option.
Every week, Shifting Perspectives treks across Azeroth in pursuit of truth, beauty and insight concerning the druid class. Sometimes it finds the latter, or something good enough for government work. Whether you're a bear, cat, moonkin, tree or stuck in caster form, we've got the skinny on druid changes in patch 3.3, a look at the disappearance of the bear tank, and thoughts on why you should be playing the class (or why not).





Reader Comments (Page 1 of 4)
Zhiva May 28th 2010 2:04PM
# It was for these same reasons that Tree of Life is going to be changed into a cooldown-based ability instead of a true shapeshifting ability. With that announcement, many players were hoping that the same would happen to Moonkin Form #
Objection!
Many players were pointing to Moonkin Form as an argument for not making tree form a cooldown.
Tyler Caraway May 28th 2010 8:23PM
Restoration druids might have been doing that, but there were many balance druids that were claiming Moonkin should be changed just like ToL is going to be.
Rage Jun 8th 2010 2:58PM
THIS IS NOT A TROLL
That said I do think the premise of this article is pretty bogus. All you have to do is read the lengthy tooltip for Moonkin form to feel good about investing points in it and indeed using it. Even if a lot of the raid utility is overwritten I never feel like I’m missing out by being in Moonkin form. The real heart of your article is problems with Moonkin’s because you kind of jump around with things you see wrong. I agree with much of what you’re saying and I have few comments for your consideration.
Defensively I agree we are really squishy but, I think that’s a good trade off for using heals, they aren’t super powerful big heals but we have fast long lasting substantial heals that let you get right back to dpsing. The problem isn’t that we are squishy it’s that once an enemy gets next to you your pretty much dead. It isn’t very much fun for you nor is it very challenging for your opponent. You hit the nail on the head when you used mages as an example of survivability. They have great escapes as do the other ranged classes; we need some way of creating space instantly. Mages have blink, hunters have disengage, Warlocks have demonic circle. I would like to see Moonkin’s receive something like the demonic circle. Something along this line would make the play style infinitely more fun and really help with some of the pve issues related to movement as a Moonkin. They made demonic circle and deepfreeze because Warlocks and Mages had the same issue they were quick kills. It would need to be a Moonkin talent or attached to an existing deep Moonkin talent. Resto don’t need because they are hard as hell to kill already and Feral’s have stun’s to use when they need to get away as well as having much better avoidance/mitigation.
There is another BIG thing missing when it comes to Moonkin’s. I think there needs to be some type of interrupt or silence. I know we have cyclone but if your dpsing a target and you cyclone it to interrupt your party/raid is going to be annoyed with you. We have typhoon but that is similarly annoying in any type of group situation. Since they are finally providing kitty with an interrupt I think it’s fair to say Moonkins deserve the same treatment. A form specific interrupt would also make Moonkins much more exciting to play and considering every other class has some form of useful interrupt but us it’s long overdue! For those who would reply but, you have bear form and bash you know that is ridiculous to think that an average player could use it effectively especially considering we are a RANGED spec! I cringe every time I have to sit and watch a mob cast a spell that most other classes could prevent. Likewise going against a mage or hunter and have them silence and shut me down while I can't do anything similar to them is very frustrating.
Moonkin has come a long way it just needs a few more tools to make it solid.
Rage Jun 22nd 2010 2:57PM
I really like the idea of a spell similar to demonic circle. It would provide a great boost in pvp and pve filling big voids in our class. Moonkin movement makes there damage suffer more so then other classes so being able to do so quickly would be a great benefit. Tying the ability to Moonkin Form would add the exciting twist that is missing. I think this could be interestingly tied to the new magic mushroom ability. You could plant the mushroom and make it so you could teleport to it. Then when melee swarm to you u detonate. BOOM ;P Suddenly I love the idea of magic shrooms! For the kitty’s reading this remember the joy you felt when we got kitty charge? Same thing… Nothing really immerses you in the game more than rapid movement.
Rich May 28th 2010 2:09PM
yup, oomkin should just be a cool CD that you use, imo.
I raided MC through TK/SSC as oomkin so can feel where you are coming from.
Moonkinmaniac May 28th 2010 2:48PM
The problem with that is then cat and bear not to mention flight form should also be cooldowns. Druids are shape shifters it doesn't make sense for them not to have other forms. Just because their artists messed up with tree form and the "majority" of people didn't like it doesn't mean they should change us into warlocks or mages.
Auriokboy May 28th 2010 3:34PM
@Moonkinmaniac
While I like the moonkin form, and at the begginning I was one of the first to mourn the death of the Tree of life form I have to disagree with you in doing all the druid forms as Cooldowns, lets see why:
Bear Form: Completely different set of abilities and a different resource (rage like a warrior) it allows the druid to tank and seals off all its casting abilities. Cannot cast any spell.
Cat Form: Another completely different set of abilities. Another type of resource (energy and combo points, like a rogue) allows the druid to melee DPS. Cannot cast any spell
Flight, Acuatic, and travel form: Insta moving faster through land, water and skies?? yes, please. No need for a flying mount?? Yes please, Increased swimming speed?? Yes please. all of those things tied to just 30 seconds or so?? NO WAY
Now:
Tree of life form: Same resource than normal humanoid form, (mana) Increased healing.. just to be on par with the other healing classes and specs. Aura of increased healing at the party (could be baked onto a talent), Increased armor (only if talented) oh look, Now I can't cast any offensive spell, plus, If i'm not in tree form, my healing output it's lower than the other healing classes!! ummm..... yay??
Moonkin Form: Increased armor (refer to the article's survivality issues balance has in pvp), Raid buff (now shared with shammies and pallies) same resource as normal humanoid form (mana again), regain mana through single targeted spell crits cannot cast healing spells... funny dance.
As you can see, There's no way of turning bear and cat into a cooldown without affecting feral in such a deep way that it should stop calling itself feral and all our bear and cat brothers should relear how to play.
Moonkin form and tree of life form can have all their benefits baked onto talents of their respective specs and we should not notice the difference, actually, it could add a more complexity to our very simple rotation of spells, by adding a bursting DPS cooldown to balance druids, could be a defensive/offensive cd that allows us to crit 100% of time (as if we did not do that already), or a simple flat increase to our dmg during 15 seconds or so, could be that it allows starfall to have no cooldown or reset the starfall cooldown, or... you get the idea.
I agree with Mr. Caraway that right now, moonkn forrm has very little to offer hoping that if blizz plans to keep it, could listen some of the ideas the layr base is giving ( loved the idea of increased eclipse filling bar through crits during moonkin form)
Goodk4t May 28th 2010 5:03PM
@ Moonkinmaniac
Cat/Bear form are completely different from Moonkin form. For starters, both Bear and Cat form are iconic druid forms, while Moonkin is only a talent. Second, a druid in Night Elf form can do everything a Moonkin can do, he just has less armor, spell power, % crit.
It's all about to have a purpose: you shift into Cat to gain unique melee abilities. You shift into Bear to tank. Yes, you don't have unique abilities, neither does a DK in Frost presence. You shift into Moonkin form to...? To have increased stats. Without those stat buffs, Moonkin form is completely useless.
Shelly May 29th 2010 3:26AM
I disagree that the cat and bear forms CANNOT be made into a similar cd ability. if anyone can make the cd bear/cat work it would be blizzard. As for the travel forms, they are just that, travel forms and have no abilities tied to them at all. My undeniable proof I'm this is the changes to hunters power (focus) change in cata.
And has anyone else noticed that the ghost wolf (shaman, I know) has a longer base untalented cast time than the mounts now?
norcallights May 29th 2010 2:55PM
Also, remember that Balance druids already have a DPS cooldown (Starfall), while Resto Druids do not have a survival cooldown (Tranquility sucks, and we have nothing like Pain Suppression, Guardian Spirit, Divine Sacrifice, etc...). I often find myself without any buttons to push during healing-intensive phases. I just keep on healing like I have been all fight. So I think it makes sense to give Resto druids a big healing cooldown.
Not that I wouldn't support giving Balance druids the same treatment... it's just that I don't know that they need it as much as Resto druids do.
Cptanimal69 May 28th 2010 2:19PM
What about tying Mana regen to the new Eclipse UI? The deeper you are into the specific side of the eclipse UI, the more mana regen you have. Making it dynamic, useful, intuitive, and tied to the dps integrally? Once again an amazing article over a million words.
Fantastic
GrumblyStuff May 28th 2010 4:05PM
An intriguing idea. Perhaps making one increase damage and the other increase regen allowing players to moderate how much regen they need vs how soon something needs to be dead?
PictoKong May 28th 2010 5:00PM
the problem is that Eclipe was annonced like a "amplify damage from the other school". While the idea of having one side on damage and one on regen is good, its going to be hard not to break the mechanic
Kj May 28th 2010 9:51PM
Maybe Moonkin Form could be the cooldown to press when you reach the Eclipse cap (either nature or arcane) that increases your dps and increases your mana regen while burning down those eclipse points back to 0.
nelk May 28th 2010 2:23PM
I also would love to see Moonkin form actually feel like its 'doing something', without feeling like I have to be in the form at all times. Ideas of it doing more damage, being tied to mana regen, etc are all great, but leave us firmly in the 'have to be in the form' camp. Even a slight DPS increase would make it mandatory.
My solution would be a mix-and-match type of system, where we get some bonuses inside the form, and other, DIFFERENT bonuses outside, such that you switch form based on the situation and what needs to be done, rather than just to get flat increases. Some specific ideas would be doing more damage OUTSIDE the form, but getting more mana regen while in form and having it modify the Eclipse slider more or some such. Perhaps while in form we could be gaining some sort of stacks of something or other that are only consumed while outside of the form (or the other way around; gain these mystery stacks outside of form and consume them inside the form).
Doing things this way actually gives reasons to switch back and forth, and lets the druid decide, based on the specific encounter, when he/she should be switching.
flint May 28th 2010 2:23PM
I will say right now that if Moonkin form gets turned into a cooldown, I will never play my druid again. Tree of Life form was a big enough blow for me (I absolutely cant stand caster form, I think my night elf male is absolutely hideous), but I imagine I'll get over it. But if I lose moonkin form, half the reason I even rolled a druid (the other half was Tree form), I can safely say that my druid will absolutely not be touched, no matter what cool stuff druids are getting. Silly, I know, but it would undermine the entire druid class, in my eyes.
iltafas May 28th 2010 2:28PM
This.
Pyromelter May 28th 2010 3:58PM
This will totally get downrated, but I am completely on the other side of that fence. Moonkin form is stale, boring, and, frankly, ugly (in my opinion). I'm currently leveling my druid with the BoA shoulders, which are absolutely awesome looking. It stinks to lose that look by shifting into form. TBH I think most people won't care if Moonkin turns into the same thing as a tree of life type cooldown. And murmurs is right, it is pretty boring, just a simple buff, like a mage or warlock casting their armor-buff spells.
CaryEverett May 28th 2010 4:18PM
This.
A long time ago, when I was a wee little kid on a trial account, and I was big and shiny eyed, I was exploring around on my little dwarf, and stumbled my way into Westfall. There I saw a Tauren Balance Druid, dancing away.
And as I looked at her, I was in awe, of the sheer awesomeness that was the Moonkin form. I knew immediately I had to reroll Horde and make myself a Balance Druid.
If Moonkin was turned into a cooldown, I don't think I would ever touch the class again. It is the thing that makes druids so much fun to play, the single coolest player model in the game.
bennet May 28th 2010 4:31PM
@Pyromelter: I guess I don't understand why people would play druids if they hate the forms. I love moonkin, am having a hard time coming to terms with losing permanent Tree of Life in Cataclysm and like flint I think I'd retire my raiding druid in favor of my priest if both the caster forms were shunted off to cooldowns.
Even though I'm not much of an RPer, I always feel a little different around hordie druids with my night elf shifted to moonkin or tree. In form we aren't Alliance anymore, or Horde, we're druids, and our shapeshifting gives us a commonality that other characters don't share. It's not a power-gaming "purpose" to the form, but it is one, and I can't help but feel sad that it might be lost in the name of utility come Cataclysm :(