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7-21-2010 @ 8:07PM
I'm pretty sure Soggoth isn't an old god, but one of their servants. He's called a faceless one, not old god, in various quests- it seems the ACTUAL old god of this expansion is the one located in Twilight Highlands.
7-21-2010 @ 8:13PM
That's what i thought too.
7-21-2010 @ 8:27PM
I too was under this impression. I read anything I can get my hands on about the Old Gods too =D
7-21-2010 @ 8:37PM
There are two possibilities.If Soggoth is an old god, then he isn't the thing at the Master's Glaive.If the thing at Master's Glaive is Soggoth, then Soggoth is not an old god.Either way, the creature at Master's Glaive is NOT an old god. It has the same model as a faceless one, like Misanthrope said, and is being dug up. I believe he's a former servant of great power of the old gods. There happens to be an identical creature being excavated in the Twilight Highlands, and as far as we know old gods don't come in twins. Add to this that because it is a faceless one we know that he's not nearly as large as seems to be characteristic of old gods. Basically, the pieces just don't fit. There's no possibly way the Master's Glaive creature is an old god. I think Blizz is starting to ramp up the old god story arc, and part of that is a nice, new named servant.
7-21-2010 @ 9:19PM
Draniest: The problem is, the thing at the Master's Glaive is capable of not only creating Spawn (the Spawn of Soggoth, which infest the place for the final quest), there's even an Avatar of Soggoth you have to destroy with the help of an army of Ancients. Generally speaking, things that have Avatars are gods. It's quite possible Soggoth could well exist in two places at once, since the Old Gods don't seem to die, exactly. But we'll find out for sure when the Twilight Highlands quests start being playable.
7-21-2010 @ 9:42PM
Care to share spoillers, mr. Rossi?
7-21-2010 @ 9:59PM
I agree that old gods can be in two places at once, or rather, they tend to be so massive that we may observe them in multiple places at once. We know that C'Thun and Yogg as we saw them were not the entire body, we only saw a fragment. These faceless ones have clearly defined heads and arms that we can see, and seem to share a model that we've seen on occasion and we see frequently in Cataclysm, and that model has clearly defined legs as well. That's the only reason that I don't believe those two things being excavated by the Twilight Cult are connected. Also, if they're connected, then excavating them kind of seems a futile attempt, no? Of the little that we do know about old gods, the Master's Glaive thing just doesn't fit. From what I've seen of the quests in that area, it's never said that it's an old god, and hinted at strongly that he was one of their stronger servants. As far as his abilities, this is the first time we've seen a creature like this. We don't really have a set standard of measure for power for him or many other things. Archimonde and Kil'jaeden are both very powerful and have demonstrated some unique and god-like abilites on several occasions, but we know that they're not gods or Titans. And no offense, as I do enjoy Know Your Lore, but there is no lore precedent for Avatars being a signifier of a god. We've seen lesser avatars and images created. It makes sense to assume that given enough power any being could create a rather nasty avatar.My ultimate theory is that Yogg and C'Thun were both lesser old gods, sort of like Titans that we know are titans, but not part of the Pantheon. From the War of the Ancients, it doesn't make sense to assume that Yogg and C'Thun were included in those old gods planning on usurping Sargeras' Well of Eternity portal to escape. Rather, I think that those old gods, the true head of the snake, if you will, reside on a plane that was also suggested by Bornakk in the latest round of Ask a CDev questions. Either way, the Twilight Highlands quests will hopefully shed some light on all this. I expect it will reveal that these creatures are some sort of Faceless One generals.
7-21-2010 @ 10:54PM
The one in Twilight Highlands IS the one in Darkshore. The Twilight Hammer moved it there because it's their base of power.
7-21-2010 @ 10:58PM
My two cents:Cthulhu (basis of C'thun) wasn't an Old One. He was just one of their top servants. Yet he was still able to not only bend/corrupt the minds of large groups of people AND take a quasi-physical form (quasi-physical due to the fact that running over his face with a ship didn't seem to do much good). I'm betting this thing in the darkshore is like Cthulhu, a being of immense power, able to take on a physical form (an avatar, basically) and drive people to insanity.Just my thoughts.
7-22-2010 @ 2:39AM
@Anathemys: Cthulhu was most definitely a Great Old One. Perhaps you're confusing the Great Old Ones (which he was one of) with the Outer Gods (which he was not one of)?
7-22-2010 @ 3:16AM
Soggoth isn't an Old God. The dialogue during the quest line says that he was the powerful servant of an Old God that it took many stone giants to defeat. If was it wasn't midnight and I wasn't attending Comic-Con tomorrow, I'd level something to go redo the questline and take a screenshot and post the link to it here to prove it. Trust me, Soggoth is not an Old God. Indeed, the cultists had to summon a lesser version of him because player interference upsets their time table. Perhaps if he was restored in his true form, he'd be the equivalent of General Vezax...but then again he'd also probably be higher than level 19.If Tentacles = Old God presence.One under Ashenvale (Lake Falathim) and Stonetalon (Stonetalon Peak).Another in the Vashj'ir area (The source of the Faceless of the Deep and Ozumat).And then the C'thun-ish looking Sarlocc apparently named Isorath in Twilight Highlands.
7-22-2010 @ 3:41AM
Like I was going to sleep with this hanging over my head.http://i918.photobucket.com/albums/ad29/Aremic/soggoth.jpg"Herald of the Old Gods."
7-22-2010 @ 4:51AM
TO: KING OF THE DWARVES MAGNI BRONZEBEARD, IRONFORGE.FROM: CENARION CIRCLERE: [OMITTED FOR SAFETY]/BRANN BRONZEBEARDFOR YOUR EYES ONLYInspecting the grounds of Ahn-Qiraj, we came across this "lost" recording of your brother's work in Silithus, where he managed to get audience with [OMITTED]. He appeared to have time to edit it somewhat in his outing.As we expected, Brann did not get any more info about [OMITTED]. But we are impressed with your brother's willpower. To say the least. -END MESSAGE. VIDEO BEGINS-BRANN BRONZEBEARD, dwarf adventurer: Oi! This be Brann Bronzebeard with a Bran'new venture on me on show, "Brannspanking Azeroth!" on the Uncovery Channel - Uncover yer whirl! So here I am deep under the sands of Silithus, looking for one of Azeroth's most enigmatic buggers, the Old Gods! They say there's either a dead one or an asleep one 'ere. And buggers there are too! This tunnel I'm in was made by big scary bugs that ate all of me crew, so we won't have to worry about lunch breaks or the loo. I'm doing everything I can; I hope this is all worth it!(Sign of editing: A flashback to the fateful moment)BRANN: Wiikus, Blaym, help me move this stone ...WIIKUS PANDUMERDE, Gnome director: Ya sure we should move dat? Looks like it was put there to block something ...BRANN: Shut yer trap ya pen pusher, unless ya wanna get back to filmin' scientific poop videos, and help push this rock!(Rockslide shows a passageway, and an ... egg chamber)CANE WIPEFURST the Tauren cameraman: There's eggs here ... getting the camera in for a closer look ...(The egg Cane approaches quivers, then pops, spreading slime across Cane's face. Wiikus vomits. A swarm of baby silithids emerges, engulfing Cane, knocking him down to the floor and stripping him to a bone-white steer skull in seconds. Wiikus gags and upchucks something fierce.)BRANN: HOLY MOOLY! NOW THAT'S OWNING YOUR SUPPER! BLAYM, GET DAT MOTHER!!!(A muscular gnome rushes up, clad in a uniform showing he is a veteran member of Razak's Roughriders. He's also wielding a chaingun ...)BLAYM DABODI, the Gnome merc: (in high-pitched, typical nerdy gnome male voice) PAYBACK TIME! (Chaingun buzz, bullets puncture through hordes of insects, eggs and other horrors in a messy fashion. The scene makes Wiikus barf.)BRANN: Egads, you coulda hold it ...BLAYM: (Stops attack, glares at Brann) What the fu ...BRANN: Not you - keep it up now, plenty of death-dealing for everyone! It's Wiikus here cacking up his guts! Poor Cane died wretchedly, this boy is gonna die retchin! Just how much is in yer belly, wee man?WIIKUS: Sorry, Bra-phlegharghBOOMING, OMINOUS VOICE IN THE DISTANCE: Fhtagn! (Group pauses, stunned. Then Blaym gets hit with a stinger to the shoulder. The sight of blood makes Wiikus retch again).BRANN: Crikey! Yer hit, yer bleedin!BLAYM: I ain't got time to bleed.(A giant claw comes out of a tunnel, decapitating Blaym and shooting up a fountain of blood taller than the gnome. Wiikus, for lack of anything better to do, pukes.)BRANN: Oh my, ya got all the time in da world now ... And will ya stop doin' that, YER MAKIN' ME SICK!(A claw spears through Wiikus' abdomen, and his final action before being ripped asunder by a spreading claw is ... a dry heave.) BRANN: DO I GOTS TO DO THIS MESELF? TIME TO KICK SOME ANSWERS!!!(Sounds of gunfire, screaming, explosives, expletives, flamethrowers and possibly power tools; video cutbacks to a bloodied, dirty Brann)BRANN: So here we are, deep under Ahn' Qiraj itself. And lookee! (Shifts the camera to the Old God's body, a mass of tentacles and an eye.)BRANN: Here be the Old God himself, BREATHIN! Take a moment and relish this with me. Soon all will be revealed! They say the Old Gods, unlike the Burnin' Legion, don't mind mortals being around. They're rarely seen or heard but sure as hell felt. And smell! Like week ol' squid left on the docks! But seriously, it's difficult to really understand them other than they like a state of chaos. They drive the living, the dead and the undead insane. "And with strange aeons, even death may die" -- their worshippers go on with drivel like that. In short, they mock all reality. (whispers, putting the camera back in his face) They're kinda like female dwarves when ya think about it. Anyhoo, this suckers alone and I can tell it wants me to axe it a question -- the answers are here, I can feel it!(Brann coughs, and re-aims the camera at the Old God)BRANN: Uh, hello?C'THUN: (No response)BRANN: Hm. Greetings and salutations? (Nothing). Praise be! (Nothing) Maybe he likes casual ... Yo yo yo! Guess what?C'THUN: Chicken butt.BRANN: (Stunned). Chicken bu - Ah, I'm Brann Bronzebeard and I'm here to get answers about the Old Gods -C'THUN: 42.BRANN: Forty-two? There's 42 of you? You got 42 of those tentacle things, what?C'THUN: The answer.BRANN: Ah, you want to play hardball eh? That's just my game ... I've got to concentrate ... concentrate ...C'THUN: (whispering) Concentrate ... concentrate ...BRANN: Hello?C'THUN: (whispering) Hello? Hello?BRANN: Echo.C'THUN: (mimicking with effect) Echo ... echo ... NOW PINCH HITTING FOR PEDRO BORBON ... MANNY MOTA MOTA MOTA.(A voice from the distance: Sanity is for the weak.)BRANN: Hang on, nobody's gonna be sanitized as long as I have a say, you silly string squid in Sili --C'THUN: And then?BRANN: And then what? Tea and biscuits? Spill the beans already!C'THUN: And then ...BRANN: Whatinthe - Speak bloody common, will ya?C'THUN: And then and then and then and then and then and then and then and then and then and then and then and then and then and then and then and then --BRANN: STOP!(SILENCE)BRANN: OK. (Draws breath) C'THUN: AND THEN!BRANN: (Grabs his hat and pulls it over his head and stomps) BAH! Just tell me how the Old Gods came to be, and start at the beginning. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED?C'THUN: (DEAD SILENCE. Then in an ominous, booming voice of ancient mystery) First ... the earth ... cooled. Then ... the dinosaurs ... came. But they ... got ... too big ... and ... fat. So ... they ... turned ... into ... oil. And then ... the goblins ... came ... with their ... Mircades-Benzers ... (switches to a faster, hyper voice) and Prince Charming started wearing all of Lady Dye's clothes -BRANN: Right, right but what about the Old Gods?C'THUN: Now. Everything that happens now, is happening now.BRANN: But what happened to you then? Back when Azeroth was young?C'THUN: We passed then.BRANN: When?C'THUN: Just now.BRANN: Well, can't you tell me about then?C'THUN: When?BRANN: Now.C'THUN: Now? I can't.BRANN: Why?C'THUN: We missed it.BRANN: When?C'THUN: Just now.BRANN: (slyly) OK, well ... when will then ... be now?C'THUN: Soon.BRANN: Oh to hell with this! (drops camera, throws something at the Old God in anger and storms back through the hole in the wall, mumbling about heading to Northrend, and the truth is out there.)(C'THUN, meanwhile, moves a tentacle towards the object, grasping it, bringing it to its eye. It is the base and 42nd piece of Atiesh, Greatstaff of the Guardian).C'THUN: OMGWTFBBQICANHAZCHEEZBURGRLOL /dance
7-22-2010 @ 6:17AM
@VodkamartiniSo. Much. Win.
7-22-2010 @ 8:35AM
To go along with what Fidius said. If you look at "God" mythology the herald/messenger is usually a god also. Take Greek/Roman mythology, Hermes was the gods messenger but he was also a god himself.
7-22-2010 @ 8:52AM
Vodka,I really hope you do that for a living. You are hilarious, and despite the fact that it is complete fiction, actually put me in the scene as an invisible observer. To steal from my counterparts across the pond...Cheers! for great work. I am more impressed with that than anything the internet has shown me since Napster died.
7-22-2010 @ 9:57AM
@Artificial"Cthulhu was most definitely a Great Old One. Perhaps you're confusing the Great Old Ones (which he was one of) with the Outer Gods (which he was not one of)?"It's worth noting, if we go down this road, that Lovecraft was inconsistent and actually wrote little about what became the Cthulhu mythos. He does say Cthulhu was not an Old One, but cousin to them. (I think; been awhile.) The mythos was created by related writers. Belknap Long, Howard, Derleth. Most importantly Derleth. Without him none of us would know Lovecraft had ever existed.In any case, it's the mythos WoW's drawing from, not Lovecraft, and in-game it's fully Blizzard's. They can and do have their way with it. Much as I love the image of Ghostcrawler rocking back in his deck shoes, stroking his carapace, and saying "but what would Long do?" it seems unlikely.
7-22-2010 @ 11:49AM
If the question is, does being a "Herald of" mean that one is not one themselves? Why not look at Algalon, Herald of the Titans. Is he a Titan, or isn't he? And perhaps look back to Greek mythology, and the Herald of the Gods.Personally, I'm not concerned about whether his title makes him an Old God or no - if he's a being of great power, and connected with the other Old Gods, then he might as well be. We'll still have to kill him.And, even if he's buried in two places... Who's to say the Titans didn't chop him into bits and pin the bits far away from each other?
7-22-2010 @ 12:25PM
Hermes, a god in his own right in the greek pantheon, bore the title "herald of the gods".Not saying that Soggoth is or isn't an Old God, but the fact that he carries the title doesn't mean he isn't.
7-25-2010 @ 3:15AM
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