Know Your Lore: The Old Gods part three -- Yogg-Saron

To pick up a thread from our original Old God post, we now have a name for the entity that may or may not be an Old God in the Twilight Highlands (and I'm gambling that it is): Isorath. This demotes Soggoth the Slitherer to "really, really powerful servant" status, but it's worth keeping in mind that Great Cthulhu himself was not an Elder God, merely a Great Old One, and perhaps we're about to discover a similar division in Warcraft's lore. We now almost surely know the names of three Old Gods; it's too soon to call.
However, that's for the future. This week, we turn our eyes to The Beast With A Thousand Maws. Tremble before the God of Death! If you've run Ulduar, you've probably run into the handsome fellow above, who dwells therein. Its blood is power, its thoughts madness; few can resist the power of the lucid dream.
We discussed the basics of the Old God/Titan conflict in previous posts, but to give a general overview, it can help to visualize them as two opposing ideologies. The Old Gods like everything to be a roiling, disorganized mess. They gleefully enslave and direct elementals into pitched combat for no other reason than their own amusement. They keep worlds they infest at a constant tipping point, neither letting them be destroyed utterly nor ever allowing any kind of permanent order to be established. The Titans, on the other hand, absolutely love order. They can't get enough of it. They go around the cosmos constantly imposing it on every planet they can get their hands on.
You can see why these two groups didn't get along. In the smackdown between the cosmic Felix Ungers and the cthonic Oscar Madisons, it turned out that the Titans are not being played by Tony Randall. Despite the enormous, sanity-shattering power of the Old Gods, the Titans just wanted it more (and have a fair amount of enormous power themselves), and in the end, they and their servitors prevailed over the Old Gods and their armies of enslaved elementals, elemental lords and sinister servants like Soggoth. Save for one Old God who managed to fight a Titan to a standstill (at least according to his autobiography, the Prophecies of C'Thun), the other Old Gods were bound up in the world they'd infested and left to rot by their Titan enemies, due to a general belief that it would take destroying the entire planet to get rid of them.
Not that the Titans were entirely unwilling to go that far, but they figured they'd give containment a shot first.
In the eons before the Sundering, Azeroth was blessed with one continent, Kalimdor. At the center of that great continent stood the Well of Eternity, created by the Titans for some great unspecified purpose and imbued with the ability to draw mystical power directly from the depths of the Great Dark Beyond. (The Great Dark Beyond is basically the black void of space surrounding Azeroth and other worlds, as opposed to the Twisting Nether, a place of demons and other fel intelligences where the ruined remains of Outland currently reside.) On this ancient continent, the Titans left behind many structures, facilities built to shepherd Azeroth and its development. Some were also built as prisons. One such facility was the enormous city-complex known today as Ulduar. And within Ulduar, chained at its very heart with chains made of pure cosmic matter, lay the dread Yogg-Saron.
The dread Yogg-Saron
Unlike C'Thun, Yogg-Saron appears to have named itself. If not, no records remain to tell us who named it. Also unlike its peer, Yogg-Saron seems to have given itself a portfolio of sorts, declaring itself to be the Old God of Death. Trapped without recourse to the Well of Eternity, Yogg-Saron seemed to have slept in confinement for countless eons.
"Seemed" is the operative word there, because the beast with a thousand maws was anything but quiescent during its durance vile in Ulduar. We don't as yet know how much of what Yogg-Saron shows those who oppose it is truly accurate and how much the beast itself has to do with those visions, but we do know that it is possible and even likely that Yogg-Saron was one of the Old Gods who helped to corrupt Deathwing. (Indeed, given his title of The Lucid Dream, Yogg would seem a very likely candidate.) Yogg-Saron's display of the events of the formation of the Dragon Soul (later known as the Demon Soul) certainly indicates that he either has or claims a level of involvement with the madness that overcame Neltharion.
It's also telling, however, that Yogg-Saron displays the murder of King Llane Wrynn at the hands of Garon Halforcen. We know that Garona was acting on the orders of the Shadow Council, who had used their warlock magics to condition her over the years. We know that Gul'dan, leader of the Shadow Council, had used warlock magic to age and dominate Garona's mind and had entrusted the ogre mage Cho'gall, his own creation, with the task of controlling her. And we know that Cho'gall again attempted to use his power over Garona to help bring C'Thun back to life. So why did Yogg-Saron show us Garona's murder of the human king who had trusted and respected her? Was he claiming to have had control over Cho'gall even then? Is that why we find Twilight's Hammer soldiers and mages in Ulduar serving General Vezax? Just how deep do Yogg-Saron's machinations go?
The third vision we see, that of Arthas Menethil (the Lich King) torturing Bolvar Fordragon (his eventual replacement), is fairly simple: Arthas had made extensive use of Yogg-Saron's own blood for his undead minions. Yogg-Saron's words -- "He will learn that no king rules forever" -- proved prophetic indeed, as Arthas died at the hands of me and 24 of my closest friends. (Well, OK, maybe you killed him. Depends on who raids when.) At any rate, Arthas was slain, Bolvar took up the mantle of the Lich King, and we're left to wonder why Yogg-Saron -- who claimed such extensive influence, helping to cause the creation of the Demon Soul (and inadvertently the Sundering itself), the death of King Llane and destruction of Stormwind, and the ultimate fate of the Lich King -- was so unprepared for his own death.
Then again, when we look at the circumstances surrounding Ulduar, we're forced to wonder if it was unpreparedness.

Over the course of the millennia, Yogg-Saron enslaved the will of Loken, the Prime Designate charged with watching over the Ulduar installation and Azeroth entire. Using Loken as a proxy, Yogg-Saron manipulated the servants of its own Titan enemies, engaging them in a long and ultimately pointless war that ended with many of them being forced into stasis by Loken and thus unable to interfere with the corrupted watcher's plans for Azeroth. Loken went so far as to murder his brother Thorim's wife Sif and pin the blame on the servants of Hodir, another of his sibling watchers. Eventually, Freya, Hodir and Mimiron all found themselves imprisoned and slowly driven mad by the being they themselves had been set to ward over. The last watcher besides brooding Thorim was Tyr, a great champion of order who'd sacrificed his own hand in battle with the forces of the Old Gods. His fate remains unknown. There's speculation that Yogg-Saron used the corrupting force of his saronite blood to alter Tyr into General Vezax, but no evidence either way as yet.
Eventually, as great heroes from the mortal races reached the Storm Peaks in their quest to find a way to halt the Lich King's advances, Yogg-Saron used Loken to manipulate and capture Thorim, the final watcher of Ulduar with a component of the Algalon fail-safe. It's unknown why neither Loken nor Tyr had a piece of the device, perhaps as a check on these two supposedly most orderly of the watchers to keep them from summoning Algalon prematurely. With Thorim in his reach, Yogg either failed to keep a close enough watch on his servitor or deliberately sacrificed Loken to vengeful heroes in order to activate the Algalon protocol.
Because how else could it have happened? It's clear that Yogg-Saron must have known of the protocol after thousands of years of controlling Loken even more thoroughly than Deathwing has even been controlled. (Neltharion, for all his flaws, has never blindly obeyed the Old Gods, working with them only when it suits him.) Why would Yogg-Saron, the Old God of Death, the Lucid Dream itself, allow Loken to die alone in a side wing of the Ulduar complex if it didn't exactly suit his plans? Look at the larger picture.
As with C'Thun, we see an Old God confronted and slain in its own lair by mortal hands, when the Titans themselves supposedly could not do so without destroying Azeroth. Perhaps the issue isn't that the Old Gods can't be slain, but that to slay them utterly requires the complete eradication of Azeroth back down to its primary unmixed materials (as Algalon himself implies when he arrives) -- and therefore, Yogg-Saron can't possibly be dead now. I don't know about you, but when I killed him, I didn't reduce Azeroth to its primary components just to be sure. However, in manipulating a group of mortals to not only kill Loken but then to storm Ulduar, regain the fragments of the Celestial Planetarium key, and take a key role in preventing Algalon himself from reoriginating Azeroth, Yogg-Saron ensures its own survival and the survival of the Old Gods.

It's not that Yogg-Saron particularly wants Azeroth to survive, but the Old Gods have shown a remarkable tendency to enjoy their own existences. Allowing Algalon to wipe Azeroth down to the raw cosmic matter that formed it and root out the slumbering and presumably vulnerable Old Gods trapped within wouldn't suit the Old God of Death at all, since it happens to be one of those selfsame trapped beings. But look now: Not only has Yogg-Saron slain, corrupted or weakened his eternal jailors, it has convinced them and Algalon that it has been destroyed and is no longer a threat. Furthermore, even if clear and present evidence of even more widespread systemic Old God corruption of Azeroth should surface, Algalon's not coming back to deal with it.
Azeroth belongs to the Old Gods now. While there have been a handful of mortals who have shown the ability to balk them, these same mortals run the risk of corruption every time they raise a weapon against the Old Gods. Just ask Milhouse Manastorm about the insidious whispers of the madness that crawls behind reality's mask. Can mortal heroes who have accepted the Faustian bargain and worn the very blood of an Old God possibly hope to retain their sanity and battle a hopeless fight against forces that threaten to swallow the world in chaos, and do so without the help of the Titans?
Sure, Yogg-Saron is dead. Of course it is. The alternative ... that events unfolded exactly as it hoped they would ... is too horrible to contemplate.
Next week, the new lore of the Old Gods in Cataclysm.
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Lore, Know your Lore, Wrath of the Lich King, Cataclysm
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Reader Comments (Page 4 of 5)
Cheeselandman Aug 11th 2010 9:48PM
I personally think that the old gods love us mortals. Think about it... even while working together to kill the Lich King, we fight amongst ourselves (Garrosh, Thrall, Varian, Jaina) in away the elemental lords never did. The amount of chaos we mortals are able to achieve seems to vastly outrank anything the old gods got around to ordering their elemental slaves to do.
Even in the past, trolls managed to survive through the great conflicts between the elemental lords. If Azeroth didn't constantly have these threats arising, it'd be the perfect world for the old gods! Even Alagon the Observer was corrupted by us.
Claire Aug 12th 2010 2:38PM
Of course they do. The Titans barely tolerate us, I imagine.
Clydtsdk-Rivendare Aug 11th 2010 9:51PM
I'm surprised TLK and Yoggy never squared off...
Perhaps if Yoggy gets rezzed (as this article seems to imply) he won't know that TLK isn't Arthas anymore?...
telrash Aug 11th 2010 9:54PM
the way i always viewed it, the titans could not get rid of the old gods becasue of the power they needed to use would destory the planet as well. humans, being much smaller and weaker (but as a group) were able to use enough force to kill them without making the planet go boom. for example, lets say i have a glass jar with a dollar inside of it. the titans are like a hammer, they cant get it out without destorying it. but lets say the mortal races can reach in and just grab the money, keeping the jar intact. same results, but much less coletral damage to the planet.
Bedvyr Aug 11th 2010 10:01PM
My proud priest has never worn any of the blood of Yogg-Saron, that's for sure. Of course, I can't say the same for my poor warrior, the orc is probably even now trying to think up ways to sow chaos in my guild.
Lichbane Aug 11th 2010 10:29PM
The more I think about, the more the Old Gods and Titans are just as dangerous as each other ... much like the Shadows and Vorlons in B5.
Jonas Aug 11th 2010 10:30PM
I think the whole "can Old Gods really die" thing has gotten a bit misconstrued myself. The Titans are, lets face it, extremely large entities, and the ones that fought against the Old Gods were probably a lot more massive than the ones players have encountered. Due to this, its reasonable to assume that players can do what the Titans couldn't (kill Old Gods without blowing up the world) because their smaller size lets them attack more precisely. Keep in mind that fighting C'thun required players to attack from inside his stomach and fighting Yogg-Saron required entering his brain.
As to the whole revival thing, I believe that using C'thun as an example is not the best of ideas. Blizzard seems to be developing a habit of reviving vanilla bosses (Onyxia, Nefarion, Ragnaros... all of Naxxramas) because so few people were able to fight them in their prime. It's probably best to see C'thun's revival as a quick in-game explanation rather than an actual development. After all, considering how powerful the Old Gods are it seems like they should be a lot harder to revive than by what Cho'Gall did.
Imnick Aug 12th 2010 8:41AM
By that theory though, in the expansion after Cataclysm they will HAVE to revive Yogg'Saron.
Because as it is two expansions after vanilla reviving C'Thun, two expansions after Wrath nobody will have had a chance to fight Yogg'Saron, so using the same logic he'll come back too.
So he really isn't dead!
Aaron Hoffman Aug 15th 2010 5:43AM
Counting fail?
Vanilla + BC + WotLK + Cata = 4.0
WotLK + Cata + Dream? + Argus? = 6.0
So TWO expansions after Cata, or THREE after WotLK.
Leviathon Aug 11th 2010 10:36PM
Isoroth is just a servant also just like Soggoth.
Ullaana Aug 11th 2010 10:48PM
I'm not going to voice my ideas on which side is good and which is evil but point out that both are determined in their beliefs.
Absolute Chaos or absolute Order are not the best of things for mortals. WE are the balance and both sides have ideas how we should be dealt with. Ideas that we do not always agree with or allow to come to fruition. So they try to set us against each other and their enemies.
It seems to be working, slightly.
Beware the things that go bump in the dark.
Dendallin Aug 11th 2010 10:55PM
In the post you mention that Yogg-Saron claims to have had a part to play in the formation of the Demon Soul and the (accidental) Sundering of Azeroth. But from the final chapters in the War of the Ancients trilogy, I got the direct feeling that the summoning of Sargeras, its stop, and the Sundering of Azeroth greatly pleased the Old Gods. It seemed that they desired for Sargeras to come and destroy the life on Azeroth and destroy the planet itself. If the Titans had imprisoned the Old Gods inside Azeroth, something would need to "destroy" the walls of their prison before they could truly escape. Before the sundering they were fully imprisoned (from my understanding). Now after the Sundering (which I think was an ultimate Goal of the Demon Soul and corruption of Neltharion the Earthwarder - whose realm to safeguard was the Old Gods very prison), the Old Gods are able to "squeeze" little bits of themselves between the cracks. An eye there, a mouth here, and a few tentacles wherever there's a little bit of room. Through these they are able to manipulate beyond just their whisperings. They are able to truly "speak" and "interact" with their followers and pawns. I agree with Rossi that Yogg-Saron wanted the death of Loken to initiate the Destruction of Azeroth, but perhaps not for the reason given above. For taking down a Titanic Watcher is one thing, taking down Algalon the Observer is another, and Yogg-Saron must have known that Algalon would be much stronger than the Watchers or the Dragon Aspects. Would he have gambled all his work and effort on the hope that 25 mere mortals could defeat the Observer, or that the Observer would rebel against his programming and NOT send forth the beacon because of "hope"? I do not think an Old God would have risked so much on so little. Instead, I think the Old God of Death was hoping Algalon would issue his beacon, that the Titans would return and that without Sargeras (whom they know is now fallen and part of Burning Legion, which he may not have been when the Old Gods were first defeated) the Old Gods may be able to destroy their captors. With the defeat of Algalon, this plan was foiled and the Old Gods would have to wait until something else would happen on Azeroth so that they could work again to free themselves. Cue the Cataclysm and all the work C'thun and the new Old God are planning for us with the further shattering of Azeroth, and the loosening of their cages even more...
lishuss Aug 11th 2010 11:43PM
you see, my first though was "who the hell makes a Odd Couple Reference that isn't the movie with Jack Lemmon and Walter Matthau?"
Matthew Rossi Aug 11th 2010 11:45PM
Jack Lemmon can win a fight. Tony Randall never struck me as any sort of pugilist.
alpha5099 Aug 12th 2010 12:53AM
A very cool read. Although this might not gel with the idea that Yogg-Saron (and the Old Gods as a whole) are first and foremost concerned with their self-preservation, I think you could look at Yogg-Saron's machinations another way: perhaps he was taking one for the team.
Assuming Yogg-Saron is truly dead (admittedly, a rather large if, particularly given Blizzard's love of set-backs), it could be that it allowed itself to be killed for the reasons laid out above: to have the mortal races take down Algalon, potentially forever protecting Azeroth from "planetary reorigination."
Yogg-Saron may have exposed itself to mortal danger to give his fellow Old Gods free reign to take over Azeroth without fear of Titanic reprisal.
Hydden Aug 12th 2010 1:26AM
I love this series ^_^
Ty Aug 12th 2010 1:37AM
CRAZY idea here, but here it goes.
What if.... The final part of wow is we decide the Titans are the actual bad guys here. Sure the old gods are evil, but what's truly the difference? The titans, as Algalon stated, go and destroy worlds, killing billions at a time.
And you cannot see we aren't powerful enough lore-wise because if you think about it, we become more and more powerful each raid we beat. We have killed 2 old GODS, 2 elemental lords, Kil'Jaeden (well we banished him but we still beat him), Illidan, The Lich King, and one (soon to be 2) dragon aspects. The final raid may very well be us rebelling againest the titans once and for all.
I like crazy speculating :P
Moeru Aug 12th 2010 1:57AM
I look at the Titans like scientists, and Azeroth is a petri dish. A petri dish with an extremely dangerous magical tendencies, but still just another experiment that they can 'terminate' at any time, if they so wish.
Moeru Aug 12th 2010 1:53AM
I think all the Old Gods are one giant being that stretches across the entire world of Azeroth, and the 'Old Gods' we're fighting, is merely their limbs or primal organs or something, that are able to communicate telepathically with mortal minds.
Exhibit A: C'thun is an eye, and a stomach.
Exhibit B: Yogg'Saron is a giant mount and brain.
Exhibit C: All the old gods are similar in construction when it comes to tenticles, despite their different locations in the world.
Exhibit D: Most of the time, they don't refer to other Old Gods, but rather only universally as one collective, or doesn't mention others at all. You'd think if it was multiple entities working together, they'd allude to an organization of some sort, or some kind of rivalry, if they're not working together.
Exhibit E: Yogg'Saron's presence stretches far and wide across Northrend...way larger than any creature we can imagine. His blood seeps all the way to Howling Fjord and Sholazar Basin, and even into the depths of Azjol'Nerub, which is 'supposed' to extend across most of Northrend as well.
> http://www.wowwiki.com/Whisper_Gulch
> "Azjol-Nerub stretches much further than people thought, as it appears that the Argent Crusade has built the Crusaders' Coliseum above the northern reaches of it."
Exhibit F: The 5 point star Old God placement map, purely speculative, seems to show how a large being could spread across the huge area, with 'power' points in those areas to influence the mortal races
> http://www.wowwiki.com/File:OldGodMap.png
Now this is all speculation of course, but It would be nice if this is how it played out. It would mean we couldn't do anything about the Old Gods since they're embedded in THE VERY FABRIC OF AZEROTH'S PLANETARY MASS. It would also mean it's like a huge parasite, living off the heat and the life of the planet's core/nature. There's a lot of wholes in this theory...like why haven't' we seen parts of this Old God in other regions, especially Underground, and how come Saronite is only in Northrend, if the blood of this Old God is the same everywhere. Of course, some things are strictly for gameplay purposes, and as we've seen before, Blizzard retcons a lot when it's needed. Cthun's presence in Silithus is vastly inferior to that of Yogg's, which stretches all over Nortrhend...it doesn't make much sense, unless Cthun IS actually a separate entity, and simply weaker than Yogg.
Overall though, while there's a lot of wholes in the 'all Old Gods are one entity' theory I've found, I think it would be nice to see it play out that way, and see how we deal with it :D.
Suzaku Aug 12th 2010 10:09AM
That's certainly an idea, but the Old Gods in WoW are based heavily on the Old Gods of the Cthulhu Mythos. The Old Gods are huge, and do spread far beneath Azeroth, but they are probably individual entities with unique traits (such as having a thousand maws or a thousand eyes).
As for the layout on the map, it looks an awful lot like the Elder Sign from the Mythos.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_RNrl2Gr0VwI/SW2XdXP1FrI/AAAAAAAAAjc/Y_liZtHCf_o/s400/elder+sign.jpg