The Daily Blues

Volley is still gone. And don't bring a hunter. Their AE spam isn't spammy enough.
Table of contents
Ghostcrawler
Ghostcrawler -- Volley, Round 2I know I'm going to regret posting in this thread again, but I think it's the right thing to do so I'll take one for the team. :)
We think Multi-Shot is a more interesting ability and can fill the hunter AE niche (along with Explosive Trap). We'll have to change Multi-Shot from the current version to get it there. I'm very sorry if for some unusual reason Volley was your favorite spell as a hunter. We've been trying to consolidate abilities and free up some bar space and having multiple AEs that competed with each other seems like a good area to hit up. The Volley and Multi-Shot niches were very similar, which resulted in the latter being dead. We wanted to pick one and we though Multi-Shot felt more huntery and less "clunky" (to use a favorite Wow forums term).
Do consider that you won't be AE'ing yourselves through Cataclysm content the way you do currently. When you do need to AE, hunters will have the tools to do so. In situations where you do have to AE, you are probably not also trying to CC. When you're back to the level of trivializing lower level content, nobody is going to say "Don't bring a hunter. Their AE spam isn't spammy enough." We don't consider easily breaking rogues out of stealth a good reason to keep Volley around.
I think that hits most of the reasonable concerns. I care much less about addressing the unreasonable ones. :)
As always, those of you whose sole contribution is to post very inane or derogatory things will be banned.
Man, have we come a long way from "AE is only for trash."
We think Multi-Shot is a more interesting ability and can fill the hunter AE niche (along with Explosive Trap). We'll have to change Multi-Shot from the current version to get it there. I'm very sorry if for some unusual reason Volley was your favorite spell as a hunter. We've been trying to consolidate abilities and free up some bar space and having multiple AEs that competed with each other seems like a good area to hit up. The Volley and Multi-Shot niches were very similar, which resulted in the latter being dead. We wanted to pick one and we though Multi-Shot felt more huntery and less "clunky" (to use a favorite Wow forums term).
Do consider that you won't be AE'ing yourselves through Cataclysm content the way you do currently. When you do need to AE, hunters will have the tools to do so. In situations where you do have to AE, you are probably not also trying to CC. When you're back to the level of trivializing lower level content, nobody is going to say "Don't bring a hunter. Their AE spam isn't spammy enough." We don't consider easily breaking rogues out of stealth a good reason to keep Volley around.
I think that hits most of the reasonable concerns. I care much less about addressing the unreasonable ones. :)
As always, those of you whose sole contribution is to post very inane or derogatory things will be banned.
Man, have we come a long way from "AE is only for trash."
Ghostcrawler -- Retribution paladinsQuote:
Regarding WoG, you said it is intended to be situational among other things. If so, do the developers still think the almost non-existant state of Ret combat healing is currently acceptable?
Regarding WoG, you said it is intended to be situational among other things. If so, do the developers still think the almost non-existant state of Ret combat healing is currently acceptable?
Yes. Many of the problems we've had with Ret are of the "one man army" category, where a paladin can do a lot of damage, then go defensive and heal themselves up. We love the kit of the paladin who can heal as well as do damage, but it needs to be tightly controlled. Word of Glory gives us that control. We have the room to make the spell really powerful because we know its on a tight cooldown and you sacrifice dps to use it. We can't do that today with say Flash of Light, because once you can cast one strong FoL, you can cast a bunch of them until you go OOM (at which point you Judge or Divine Plea, and you're going again). Similarly, we can make Selfless Healer nearly overpowered because you can't use it on yourself and because even with it you're not going to out compete a Holy paladin in healing. If you can occasionally contribute to group healing in tight spots, then that's great. That's some utility you can provide. (Note: Don't oversell this as "I'll get brought to raids because of my healing.")
Quote:
Less grating, but probably more important, Divine Purpose's rng on Holy Power generation could seriously mess with sustaining a rotation. A protracted dry spell will leave you out of usable spells for significant periods. I'm sure this will all balance out over the course of a standing fight but it will still be annoying and inconvenient.
Less grating, but probably more important, Divine Purpose's rng on Holy Power generation could seriously mess with sustaining a rotation. A protracted dry spell will leave you out of usable spells for significant periods. I'm sure this will all balance out over the course of a standing fight but it will still be annoying and inconvenient.
That's the wrong view to take though. The equivalent would be "I'm balanced around getting a crit every swing, so when that doesn't happen, RNG screws me." You get a Templar's Verdict every 3 Crusader Strikes. Sometimes you get lucky and need fewer. You of course need to pay attention for when that happens and be able to react to it and alter your immediate plans. That right there is the element we think is most missing from today's Ret paladin.
Quote:
I don't have anything really useful to add, but I'm glad that someone at Blizzard understands that the word "judgment" is spelled incorrectly in-game.
I don't have anything really useful to add, but I'm glad that someone at Blizzard understands that the word "judgment" is spelled incorrectly in-game.
I've been tempted to change it soooo many times. :)
Quote:
The amount it heals is most definitely balanced around how good it will be for Holy.
The amount it heals is most definitely balanced around how good it will be for Holy.
Those numbers don't have to be the same though. The new talent tree design affords us a lot more flexibility in that regard. Part of the reason Word of Glory is so useful to Holy is because it costs no mana. Ret doesn't really care about mana, because it comes and goes easily, but a Ret generally won't be able to sit there and queue up several Holy Lights in a row. They will be able to sometimes use a Word of Glory though.
Other
Vaneras -- Forum watchThis week on the WoW Europe Community forums:
If you think of all the music currently in the game, what music is your favourite?
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=14332936670&sid=1
When it comes to professions, how are you preparing for Cataclysm?
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=14469477500&sid=1
To those of you with a sense of fashion, who like to gather stylish gear, we present to you the Equipment Show Off thread!
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=14469477209&sid=1
Speaking of gear, how would you prefer your class gear looks in Cataclysm?
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=14332817838&sid=1
Here is a question for roleplayers and lore-buffs alike: Which of the 10 playable races do you think is the strongest in terms of Military Might?
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=5226012572&sid=1
And last but not least, we have a special treat for those of you who have been following Alayne's Story - The conclusion to part III of Alayne's Story has just been posted, and it is most awesome.
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=983458507&postId=143316371567&sid=1#1240
Guides, Guides, Guides!
This week we have a small PvP FAQ for those of you Death Knights out there who like to spend your time in the Arenas
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?sid=1&topicId=14332865960
And for all the aspirant Moonkins out there, you might want to take a peek at this neat Balance Druid guide
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=13200549755&sid=1
Feel like rolling a Warrior, but not sure about the best way to approach the class and the task of levelling? Well no need to worry about that, because here is a nice Warrior levelling guide to help you.
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=14340386104&sid=1
Have a magnificent week everybody :-)
If you think of all the music currently in the game, what music is your favourite?
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=14332936670&sid=1
When it comes to professions, how are you preparing for Cataclysm?
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=14469477500&sid=1
To those of you with a sense of fashion, who like to gather stylish gear, we present to you the Equipment Show Off thread!
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=14469477209&sid=1
Speaking of gear, how would you prefer your class gear looks in Cataclysm?
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=14332817838&sid=1
Here is a question for roleplayers and lore-buffs alike: Which of the 10 playable races do you think is the strongest in terms of Military Might?
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=5226012572&sid=1
And last but not least, we have a special treat for those of you who have been following Alayne's Story - The conclusion to part III of Alayne's Story has just been posted, and it is most awesome.
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=983458507&postId=143316371567&sid=1#1240
Guides, Guides, Guides!
This week we have a small PvP FAQ for those of you Death Knights out there who like to spend your time in the Arenas
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?sid=1&topicId=14332865960
And for all the aspirant Moonkins out there, you might want to take a peek at this neat Balance Druid guide
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=13200549755&sid=1
Feel like rolling a Warrior, but not sure about the best way to approach the class and the task of levelling? Well no need to worry about that, because here is a nice Warrior levelling guide to help you.
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=14340386104&sid=1
Have a magnificent week everybody :-)
Blizzard
- World of Warcraft: Stormrage back to printing
- Blizzard announces StarCraft 2 Invitational at BlizzCon 2010
Filed under: The Daily Blues






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Samutz Aug 25th 2010 9:15AM
Kind of sucks to see Volley go because it was nice to have when soloing low level stuff.
But I understand why they don't want players using it in the end game. I played my 80 hunter at the start of Wrath and back then, Volley just wasn't the norm. You had to CC and focus fire, using stings and shots and traps, and that was a lot more fun. I started playing the hunter again post 3.3 and found that if I didn't Volley in heroics, I would get called a huntard. I quit playing again after that. Spamming Volley just isn't any fun.
Stoop Aug 25th 2010 9:21AM
I keep seeing CC etc as the reason to remove volley. Why keep all the other class AoE's if this is the case? Are Hunters the only one's breaking CC? (Of course not, that there is a good ole rhetorical-type question)
I just hope they buff up multi and explosive trap to cover what Hunters are losing DPS-wise. Obviously they're not going to be as flexible as volley. ie Point-blank DPS.
Natsumi Aug 25th 2010 9:21AM
I like you, Samutz, you're a credit to your class.
AoE spam dies a horrible, horrible death, you gain 10k exp! Level up! Please visit your trainer Samutz to learn how to actually play your class.
And to all of the haters out there hating on GC and the Devs for removing Volley, your tears are tasty and only serve to make me stronger. Muahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!
Natsumi Aug 25th 2010 9:24AM
@Stoop
Point Blank DPS is WHY they are removing Volley. Hunters should be at a disadvantage in melee range, not able to just own anything close up as well as far off. You have escape abilities for a reason, learn to use them. Well, I guess you have to now. lol
Killik Aug 25th 2010 10:13AM
Samutz gets it.
Blizzard is trying to remove abilities that are so useful you are compelled to spam them, to make the game is more engaging to play. This is the point of that "thinking like a developer and not a player" thing; sometimes change is painful. Hunters will still be designed to be in the top four classes for dps.
Killik Aug 25th 2010 10:16AM
"to make the game is more engaging" Speaking the English good is me.
Noyou Aug 25th 2010 10:37AM
@Natsumi
#1. Grow up. #2. DPS is the reason to take away volley? Oh really? The only complaint anyone can have to volley is in Bg's and if you are in melee range using volley, while it would be potent you would be dead before you stopped channeling it. You say for someone to learn to play their class? Yeah. Learn to play a class before you try to critique it. If they don't buff up other spells/abilities hunters may drop down to the level of frost mages on the DPS charts.
thebitterfig Aug 25th 2010 11:02AM
Hrm. Part of me says I won't miss Volley, depending on how Multishot gets changed and so forth in order to provide our mainstay AoE attack for those more infrequent times when AoE is needed. I trust that Blizzard will balance hunters around being able to do well enough at AoE when we need to. Whether or not hunter pets will be able to withstand the aggro sent out by Multishot is another question, but that's a different problem entirely.
On the other hand!
Look at warlocks. They had too many AoE spells, but blizzard figured out how to make them simultaneously viable by allowing basically only one spec to really get full milage out of them (or at least so it looks in Cata). Affliction has SoC, Demo has Hellfire, and Destro has RoF. At least in theory. I hope that seed spam won't outpace them all, and that each spec's specific AoE is clearly superior for that spec, and the others are clearly inferior.
Why couldn't they have done this with hunters, and had only, say, SV with their magic-damage boosting mastery actually have viable Volley? Maybe add in a few other talent-based tweaks, a change in mechanics (Blizzard-like to Flamestrike-like? Short cast with ground dot rather than channeled?). It seems that would be the perfect solution, where the other specs would simply prefer Multishot and wouldn't want to use Volley. Heck, they could take it a step further and give hunters an ADDITIONAL AoE ability, an AoE version of Kill Command, which only BM would ever use in the end, except for leveling/soloing reasons. Then each spec would clearly have it's preferred AoE, and due to the finite resources of Focus would prefer to use only their own spec's AoE.
SamLowry Aug 25th 2010 11:43AM
Seed spam? Are you kidding? I had to stop using Seed of Destruction because no tank could hold aggro after it went off and I kept getting killed.
You know you've done something wrong when Mr. Boss runs 50 feet away from the three people meleeing him to beat you into the dirt.
Prances in Underpantss Aug 25th 2010 12:13PM
I'm happy GC came out and said Multi-shot will be changing to cover the AoE niche better.
"if I didn't Volley in heroics, I would get called a huntard"
I hate what the hunter class (and everyone's opinion of it) has become. I don't even get to use my serpent sting (or any other shots for that matter) anymore except for on bosses. Volley got too big in Wrath, and a lot of people rolled hunters just so they could spam volley and do big DPS. I'm happy they took it away. Maybe this will weed out the bad hunters.
Aaron Aug 25th 2010 1:05PM
@Natsumi: What. Is. Wrong. With. You? You go crazy on every hunter article. While I agree with some of the points you make, the immature approach to these topics makes it hard for myself or anyone else to take you very seriously. =S
Jawn Aug 25th 2010 2:51PM
I'm feeling like Samutz, here, i'm sad to see volley go, because i really liked it when i needed it, but things have ended up where my hunter is just a volley bot. And that, i think, is something of a failure, and that's what the devs are addressing. Even in heroics, i instinctively use my single-target abilities on the tank's target, put that caster over there that's casting at us asleep, but then everyone's AOEing, breaks the sleep, and.... aw man! [Volley].
*sigh*
Now when there's an accidental "Holy big pull Batman!" moment, then.... no questions asked: it's volley time. But seeing as that was effective, it's now become the to do things.
Volley is a victim of it's own success. I'm not going to look at other class' AOE and cry over it. AOE is just not intended to be 'our' niche. Might turn out that we be one of better - if not ~the~ best - CC classes in Cata. Well just have to see, now, won't we?
Rob Aug 25th 2010 4:27PM
"holy big pull - bring out the volley". Actually that's the #1 reason to get rid of volley. Some idiot pulls everything in the hallway, the tank picks it up. At that point, there are two issues. #1 tank picking up everything. #2 tank not dying. #3 healer not pulling aggro. DPS living is far down on priorities.
Now, see volley doesn't help any of this. Traps, pet tank, misdirect, etc helps (maybe you could argue that nowadays a misdirect before volley helps slightly with tanking, but a explosive trap is better IMO). What really helps is focusing the target of the tank and burning it down quickly. What doesn't help is all the freaking mobs dying at the same time, meanwhile I as a tank am pulling out all the stops and the healer is pulling out all the stops to help me live.
Volley helps on things like onyxia whelps, when there isn't as much of an issue of the tank living and holding aggro. Volley has been so abused in wraith (due to its buff), i really wonder about blizz's notion of buffing it in the first place. Yeah, as a guy with two 80 hunters, I highly approve of getting rid of volley.
Gryph Aug 26th 2010 8:40AM
I aggree with (almost) all posts above. It's sad to see Volley go because it's a nice tool to have when taking down low-level content (like BWL trash) but the playstyle of all trash pulls in end-game right now is AoE spam. Put down an Explosive trap and bring forth volley for the next 30 seconds and you top dps at 30-40k on every pull. Even when there are 4-5 mobs. Using a standard prio-rotation with Mutli-Shot instead of Aimed-Shot is only viable when there are 2-3 mobs. It's hard to not fall asleep between bosses.
Possum Aug 25th 2010 9:31AM
Always entertaining to see Ghostcrawler bitchslapping the noobs. Someone should make a drinking game out of it.
Deavande Aug 25th 2010 10:57AM
And you should be the first one he slaps.
Terrant Aug 25th 2010 9:41AM
I know language is alive and always evolving, and English has no academy attempting to regulate it, and legibility isn't an issue between the two... but I prefer "Judgment" to "Judgement" and that extra "e" drives me crazy for some reason!
nasumhabeo Aug 25th 2010 9:47AM
I personally prefer the "extra e". Three consonants in a row just looks weird to me.
Gallifrei Aug 25th 2010 9:52AM
On the spelling of Judgment: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judgment_(law)#Spelling
And for your reading pleasure: "The spelling judgment is found in the Authorized Version of the Bible. As a result, it is the preferred spelling in a legal context throughout the common law world."
Now I'm not sure about the Bible thing, but as a recently graduated law student, I can vouch that it is fact that in the legal world, the word is CORRECTLY spelt, "judgment," not "judgement." I think, then, that this makes sense in the context of a paladin, who is called upon to met out justice (the law). So there.
Dreamstorm Aug 25th 2010 9:57AM
Law?
Lawl!