Gold Capped: Ask an auctioneer -- auction house PvP

OK, last week I claimed that I'd eventually make it through my emails. I now realize that taunting you guys is probably a bad idea, because this week's inbox made it clear that I'll never dig myself out of the Sisyphean pile of emails I've accumulated. I assume that the winding down of this expansion has everyone trying to prepare themselves for the next expansion by hoarding gold, the only thing that will still be really valuable after the gear reset we have in store for us.
Snowmane writes:
I have around 1,100g, and though it fluctuates up to 2,000 at some points, recently, I'm at a low. I am a 450 alchemist and a 250 jewelcrafter, though that's on hold due to lack of funds to buy things to level with. I've looked at different ways of making money with my profession, but none seem to work. I just don't understand how people can make all this gold and easily equip themselves with things needed for raiding, when I can barely afford gemming and enchanting new piece of gear.
Snowmane goes on to give me the prices for herbs and consumables made from those herbs, and if I do the math, it appears that nothing is profitable. Here's the thing, Snow: It appears that you're only looking at a few of the ways an alchemist can make money. Potions and flasks may sell quickly, but you're right that they have an extremely low margin. If you want to make money that way, you need to get better at buying low and get better at selling high. The average price of materials is going to include times when someone dumps an entire week's worth of farming on the AH for a low price, and that low point is the only time you should be accumulating mats.
On the sell side, check out my post on market timing. Every market has demand cycles, and the consumables market has especially noticeable ones. Raid nights are your target nights, and you should try overcutting those nights to profit if your cheaper competitors run out of stock.
That said, selling consumables is only a small part of the money an alchemist can make. If you can transmute titanium profitably, you can make tons of money mostly AFK. Also, if you have a transmute specialization for the 20 percent yield bonus, you should seriously consider transmuting an epic gem a day, even if you have to sell it raw.
Both of these options (consumable commodities and transmutes) have one thing in common: persistence. You can't just splash into the market and expect an immediately noticeable profit; you have to do your tasks every day and make sure that your stock is always listed for sale. The other thing that I'd suggest is measure your success by profits earned, rather than gold in pocket. Gold evaporates out of your pockets, and even if you're making a decent living with alchemy, it may seem like you're pushing a boulder up a hill if you never seem to break 2,000g because you're constantly spending your earnings on leveling another profession.
Simon writes:
You're stuck in a situation that's hard to get out of, Simon. This actually came up recently on a Call to Auction podcast (episode 14, I think): Some people either have no life, or are botting on the auction house. I'm assuming that since he didn't answer your tells, he's actually AFK running a script. Aside from reporting him to Blizzard, there's nothing you can do but trust that eventually, whatever trick he's using to break the rules will be plugged up. I'd suggest trying to diversify into other markets if you want a low-risk method to continue making profits.I started to sell gems profitably on the AH, but soon this person came and started to undercut constantly by 1 copper. At first, I thought this was just normal, but now I see him online 24/7 all day, every day, and as soon as I put something out, he undercuts it straight away. I don't have the will to fight with this guy, as he is always online and undercutting. What should I do? I tried to talk to him but he doesn't respond. I used to sell lots of gems each day, but now I'm lucky if I get to sell 1. One day I even tried to undercut him all the time but in the end he put them out for like 30g when they are worth 100g. So how should I handle this?
Of course, you didn't expect me to stick with the low-risk option, did you? Here's what I think: He has a lot of stock and clearly is willing to move it at a very low price. Fortunately, he can't keep undercutting below the cost of the raw mats forever. You can do two things to attack his bottom line. First, if you really can get him to post a 100g gem for 30g by posting one for 30.0001g, then post that single auction, and keep buying his undercuts until he runs out of stock. He's an idiot for not programming a minimum price into whatever cheating program he's using, so take advantage of this, and once he runs out, get to work selling his 30g gems for 90g each!
Second, if he seems to have endless supply, consider also attacking his supply. You need deep pockets for this to work, but if you buy enough of the raw materials over time while listing a portion of your purchased items for higher than market price, you'll raise the market price. This means that he either has to pay more at the AH, or that his farmers may think twice before sending him their hard-earned mats c.o.d. at the same cost he used to pay. Honestly, this is not always going to work, and you may be stuck with a large amount of useless gems when Cataclysm hits. It's probably not a bad idea to buy out any underpriced mats you find, but that's always true.
Filed under: Economy, Wrath of the Lich King, Cataclysm, Gold Capped
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Reader Comments (Page 2 of 3)
Valtor Sep 1st 2010 8:26PM
Yea, the shuffle and some other JC methods have been doing quite well in making me a fair amount of money, but a certain person recently noticed he has competition in the Skyflare department, got extremely pissed and has started shoving massive amounts of Chaotic's for 25g a pop and before then average price was about 37g,
He's basically shut that market down, I don't see how he's making alot of profit either unless he was just sitting on a ----ton of supply
Rob Sep 1st 2010 8:50PM
Also very solid advice.
I never did the shuffle (much), but I think this is the scheme according to zamboni from just my two coppers (which is the best site to discuss making wow gold).
Buy sarnonite CHEAP.
Prospect for green quality gems. Cut or dump any blue quality gems (these will be also be worthless come cataclysm).
Make level 400ish rings using saronite and said green quality gems.
Either vendor the rings or disenchant them (hint, stockpile the materials until just before or after cataclysm, the price should increase as people try to level their enchanting).
The real critical thing is that the amount you buy the saronite for has to be less than what you can vendor the rings for, else you lose money. You'll get money back from the blue gems but not all that much.
Bronwyn Sep 7th 2010 2:57PM
I cannot agree with this enough. It's the same thing as real life- sure, you can make big money without diversifying but eventually that's going to dry up and if you only had that option, you are SOL.
Also, in response to the release of Cataclysm what I'm trying to do is not keep a stock of any epic gems, and I'm getting rid of my blue gems as fast as I can, though that's working out less than stellar due to slow sales on the blues. Epics I can usually get outta my bags within a week's time period (I have a transmute master and generally those are the only epics I bother with, though occasionally I'll spend some extra honor on gems here and there), but the blues keep piling up and that can be frustrating. Still, if worse comes to worse I'll unload them onto a lucky guildy for JC leveling- Though I try to sell everything, I'm not above a little charity ;)
jslim419 Sep 1st 2010 9:08PM
and here i thought this was going to tackle the recent pastime of the enemy faction camping the AH npc's making it impossible for anyone that does not have the remote AH, or is an engineer to use the auction house.
ah well.. serial undercutters piss me off too.
MazokuRanma Sep 1st 2010 11:56PM
About the only way you can almost completely avoid this is to use your own abandoned cities. For Horde, go to Silvermoon, and for Alliance, go to The Exodar. I guarantee you'll have almost 100% uptime of your auctioneers in these two cities. Secondary options are of course Thunder Bluff and Darnassus, also relatively deserted places the opposing faction has no desire to run to.
Vladeon Sep 2nd 2010 2:50AM
On my realm, The Exodar is a horde city. Since there's no alliance there, you'll often find horde just hanging out, killing guards and any low level alliance unlucky enough to try to take them on. Some people really like killing those auctioneers because there's no lvl 80s hanging around to kill them.
Josin Sep 2nd 2010 8:45AM
One of my guildies came to the defense of the Stormwind Auction House a few days ago. A blood elf paladin ran in and started slaughtering the auctioneers, then threw up a bubble to hearth out.
A Shattering Throw later, the BE Paladin was making a nice long corpse run.
Rajinnu Sep 1st 2010 8:45PM
I agree, anything risky with gold right now is prob not worth it. WOTLK mats are also not worth holding on to. Get rid of them for as much as you can get.
In 2 months you will be able to farm the hell out of mats that will make you serious gold.
I mean I was selling stacks of frostweave cloth for 250g on launch day and had a whole team of farmers selling it to me for 50 - 70g. chaaaching
Rob Sep 1st 2010 8:54PM
I am thinking frostweave bags will be in demand come cataclysm, i think the cataclysm bag is using the same scheme (enchanting material + cloth), so they will still be expensive.
Anything that leveling toons will use, especially level 1-20, will be in high demand, I think. I may be wrong!
Babelicious Sep 2nd 2010 1:30AM
I absolutely disagree. A lot of WotLK mats are going to go UP in price come Cataclysm, such as Cobalt, Saronite, Infinite Dust, Cosmic Essences, and probably Frostweave Cloth. Eternals and Abyss Crystals you can safely dump since they'll be mostly worthless, but the things I listed are worth hanging on to for future sale.
Hih Sep 2nd 2010 7:48AM
@Babe: While their price will go up, their demand will fall sharply and you wont be able to sell nearly as much of them. The only buyers will be people leveling professions.
Puntable Sep 2nd 2010 10:44AM
Cata will have new races + new race/class combinations + an all-new 1-60 leveling experience. There will be more alts than ever that will need profession leveling mats. Here is what will happen:
First, Everyone will try to dump their "worthless" WotLK mats and the price will go down, since the alt army is not high enough level yet to need them. Then, after a month or so, the price of WotLK mats will skyrocket, as the alt army will need them and they are not being farmed anymore because everyone is in the Cata zones.
jon.hartzler Sep 2nd 2010 11:21AM
I think you can see how this will play out now by looking at the prices of BC mats now. On my server there are huge swings on leveling mats (at least on my server). For example fel iron ore and bars will make 7g swings very quickly. When I sell I will easily sell for 6 -8 a piece what i can buy for 1g (usually goes better in smaller groups like 5 - 10 at a time). Herbs and enchants are almost exactly the same. I expect post cata that you will see colbalt do the same thing but that saronite will be ok but not quite as good just like adamantite is good but not as good as fel iron.
Bru Sep 1st 2010 9:20PM
One major moneymaker right now is stupidly easy to get, but the money for it is through the roof: Wool Cloth. I've seen stacks of 20 average 16 gold each. Considering the amount of time it takes to get several stacks of 20, you can make a tidy little sum that can help you level up other moneymakers, like JC. As Cataclysm draws near, all cloth is going to be in demand (much like it was at the start of BC.)
In fact, most low level raw mats are going to be decent moneymakers. If you don't have a character with mining/herbalism, make a DK and put both on him. All of that prebc stuff he can get without any trouble will soon sell for a crapload.
alabngpuso Sep 1st 2010 11:59PM
Don't listen to this guy!
Sssssssssssssssssh!
Durinthal Sep 2nd 2010 1:54AM
For the Horde, wool can get up to 20g/stack on my server. Alliance, not so much; due to easy Stockades runs, I imagine. If you have two accounts or a buddy, make an Alliance DK and farm wool in the Stockades and move it through the neutral auction houses for a profit Horde-side.
That tactic may or may not be legal, so you might want to research that first.
Neirin Sep 2nd 2010 3:15AM
I wish my server was like this, wool cloth averages about 2g/stack. On weekends it can hit almost 4g sometimes.
Kenny Hopkins Sep 1st 2010 9:26PM
Look for botters dumping goods I bought 150 lichbloom stacks from a guy for 10G a stack sold them all for 30 gold today.
RogueJedi86 Sep 1st 2010 11:26PM
Also be wary that sometimes people selling mats for cheap might be goldfarmers who hacked an account and dumped their guild's bank onto the AH. We had a guildie get hacked once, and half our gbank was on the AH. If you see cheap gems o nthe AH, look at other categories like shards and minerals/herbs, stuff that would be in a gbank, and see if the same seller is selling them. At the least it'd be useful for noting to let peopel in trade know who's selling items that may've been taken from a gbank.
Otherwise yeah, if they undercut for 30g and you sell for 100g normally, just keep buying their stock. They gotta spend 100g to buy your stuff to resell for 30g each time, while you only gotta spend 30g each time to sell for 100g, so you're gaining a profit and they'll go broke.
Jezper Sep 2nd 2010 1:59AM
Interested in the reporting of AH botters. I don't bother reporting them anymore on my server after doing so for a month (6 or 7 times). The person was clearly botting/running a script, (the one where they run backwards to the mailbox and keep the linear route back to the AH). The GM's try and make you feel good about yourself but in reality the botters don't go away. Perhaps they got a 2 day ban IDK but it seems you need to be inventive to get rid of them. Or hope they stupidly admit to their BS tactics :P