Gold Capped News: Critical AH addons broken by patch 4.0.1
by Basil Berntsen 
Oct 8th 2010 at 7:00PM
If you were to install the PTR right now and try to post a batch of auctions for sale with your favorite addon, there's a good chance it wouldn't work. Blizzard has changed the way that addons can interact with the auction house so that it's no longer possible to queue up a large volume of auctions and let them post while you read my columns.
Both Auctioneer and Quickauctions 3 have been hit hard, obviously. These are the most commonly used addons for queuing up a bunch of auctions. The rule previously seemed to be that we're not allowed to buy in batches, but we are allowed to sell in batches. Well, it looks like Blizzard has decided that we can no longer sell in batches, either. In addition, QA3 has lost its ability to automatically cancel auctions that have been undercut. The new patch requires a hardware event per action, and this has not (at the time of publishing) been written into these addons.
So what is a batch? Since you can queue up multiple stacks of the same item using the default UI, that seems to be allowed still. What is no longer allowed is putting together a list of different types of items that you want to sell at the same time. Take heart, dear reader: There is a workaround!
First, the workaround is fortunately not to simply manually post all your auctions. When you have 300+ glyphs (for example) and dozens of types of cut gems that you probably want to be listing for all the new demand that 4.0.1 will generate, sitting there with the default posting interface does not cut it. It doesn't show you the similar auctions you will be competing with in the same frame, and it doesn't suggest a remotely intelligent default price.
That said, to fix QA3 (only, for now), simply download and install this addon. [edit: credit where credit's due. This was written by the awesome folks who spend their days at the JMTC forums, specifically Zerotorescue, the author of the QA-poster addon]. Without it, QA3 will just hang. With it, you're presented with a handy-dandy little box saying, "Do you want to post this auction?" It doesn't seem to work with Auctioneer (currently, the box comes up but doesn't seem to work when you click it), but I have faith in the Auctioneer dev team's ability to get a new build out fairly soon when its product stops working. Still, gems and glyphs are expected to be the big sellers come patch day, and those are both markets that QA3 does very well.
Apparently, addons are still allowed to automatically price for you, and that's one of the two biggest advantages that QA3 gives us, in addition to automated batch selling and canceling. The only change is that you need to click once for every group of auctions. Luckily, you can still keybind the action of clicking the Yes button: Simply create a macro with this line in it.
/click StaticPopup1Button1It will work for canceling as well as posting. Drag the macro to a button, keybind that button, and you're set. This type of automation was covered in another article: same principle, different application. It's not perfect, but at least it's better than using the default UI to post several hundred types of products by hand.
Why now?
I am not going to hazard a guess about what drove the fine folks at the Blizzard UI dev team to make this undocumented change to the functions used by these addons specifically to service the glyph and gem markets, but it's a little rough that it's happening simultaneously with a patch that's expected to drive more demand for them than any other patch in the history of the game. Patch 4.0.1 is drastically changing the desirability of stats to many classes in the game, and a huge number of people will be regemming from armor penetration to something other than crit (which is what ArP gems will give you after the patch). Also, now that we can learn every glyph in the game, there's going be a huge surge in demand for glyphs as people scramble to get one of each.
Maximize your profits with more advice from Gold Capped, plus the author's Call to Auction podcast. Do you have questions about selling, reselling and building your financial empire on the auction house? Basil is now taking questions for a special series, "Ask an auctioneer," at basil@wow.com.Filed under: Economy, Add-Ons, Cataclysm, Gold Capped
Reader Comments (Page 3 of 7)
bluerobin427 Oct 8th 2010 7:45PM
Whoops. Just checked*
Ez Oct 8th 2010 8:37PM
Not multiple stacks of the same item. He means queing up ALL of your auctions and then clicking 1 button to post them. I usually post each item individually but it is nice when you have a lot to sell.
Pfooti Oct 8th 2010 7:46PM
Despite all the self-righteous rhetoric in the comments here (*stare Darkdust*) and on the main forums, I don't think people really GET it.
These changes will not change the fact that there will be people posting lots of auctions and undercutting by camping, especially on the biggest servers. It's just that instead of this being a mostly amateur job, the role will fall to the real "criminals": people who are willing to violate the ToU by installing either a bot or just by paying third-world farmers to click the button over and over. If people leave the market, prices will float upwards.
So instead of fixing the real problems with the WoW economy, these changes (I predict at least) will end up with the consumer paying MORE for their items, and a larger percentage of those purchase prices going to goldsellers. Yay?
In a related thing, they also did a hardware event thing to PlaceAuctionBid, which means that while it's still relatively easy to post a bajillion stacks of one infinite dust, it is no longer able to automate the purchase of all those stacks with Auctionator or SimpleAuctions or whatever. You have to actually click for each purchase. And this is good because ... I dunno. But again: Yay?
The central problem is that for two classes of items (glyphs and gems), there is a fairly large base of items in the class, each of which are important to craft, list and purchase. It's not like flasks where you just mostly deal in Endless Rage and Frost Wyrm, or 264 BoE craftables where the volume is so low that you just post one or two at a time. This is a market where you pretty much *need* to create many items and post them all. That's pretty much a structural requirement of the market. If blizzard didn't want this to happen, they shouldn't have made these markets in the first place.
I'm sure that JCs and Scribes in particular feel doubly-screwed by this announcement due to the way that they learn their skills. You have to run a LOT of JC dailies to get a reasonable number of profitable cuts, and you have to do a LOT of research to learn the good glyphs (and you can't even pick the glyphs you learn the way you learn JC cuts). Given that I put something like 60 or 70 days of my research cooldown into learning all these glyphs, why shouldn't I feel somewhat entitled to my profit margins?
Muse Oct 8th 2010 7:59PM
Because people who worked just as hard as you, but refuse to cheat, would like a piece of the action as well.
The main problem I have with the auction house addons is that while Blizzard is working on preventing them from doing the working for you, they still do all your THINKING for you. The rest of the game requires you to be an active participant in everything you do, it doesn't select the mob to hit, the quest to pick up, the talents in the tree and the spell to cast: You have to do that yourself, after putting some minor amount of thinking into what you're doing and why.
Pfooti Oct 8th 2010 8:21PM
Bah, I *know* I hit the reply button. Go ahead and downrank the other one. And this one, since I have an unpopular opinion, I suppose. I reserve the right to say, "I told you so" down the road.
I take offense at your implication that I cheat. I do not cheat, nor do I make use of any tools that are banned by the ToU. Those tools are widely-available, and if you took the time to learn them, they'd help you as well. I don't even use the questionable and exploitative QAPoster addon. So let's make this clear.
Current use of Auctioneer and QA3 is not cheating.
You also clearly do not spend much time doing real AH work if you think it's a thoughtless affair. You have to think a LOT about your timing, predicting market trends, and reading patterns into your opponents (even to the point of having to figure out who those opponents are, since everyone's hiding behind AH mules).
What I don't particularly want to have to do is say, "hmm, glyph of frost strike is currently listed with an 8g bid, 9g 51s buyout. I guess i'll manually type 7g50s bid/buyout into the two text areas and hit post" three hundred and thirty times (once per glyph).
I already say, "hmm, I'm down to two glyphs of crusader strike, but that one doesn't sell all that well, so that's fine. But I will create five more glyphs of raise dead, because that one DOES sell well, and my opponents tend to restock their glyphs on tuesdays but today is friday so I have a good chance of selling that stock".
What I do in managing my Glyph business looks a LOT like thinking. What I am going to have to do in the future looks a lot less like thinking and a lot more like fiddly make-work. Imagine in your example- you've decided to cast a spell with a 3.0 sec cast time, what if you had to hit the cast button four times (exactly) in order for the spell to work. Would that be "thinking" more? Because that's akin to what you're talking about.
Glyphwars also has a lot of mindless grinding (see also: buying 4,000 herbs, milling 4,000 herbs, crafting 800 glyphs, which requires approximately 1600 mouse clicks in the current environment, spaced approximately 3.0 seconds apart in time (not counting the one click to buy all the herbs which is going away and the 20 minutes to craft all the ink, also one click). This is a ridiculous grind as-is, and we're just looking at adding more annoying grindery to this process.
So: I do not cheat. Also, I think a LOT while playing Glyphwars. But like any other game, i'd rather if I could spend my time actually thinking instead of micro-managing things.
Rob Oct 8th 2010 8:22PM
I have no idea why this is downrated. Yes people who sit there and undercut all day really suck. But this is going to devastate the glyph market. Nobody wants to sit there and manually post 700 auctions, which is pretty much required if you want to cover (note i did not say 'corner') the market.
When people cry that there are no glyphs (or going for 10x as much, since time is money) then tunes will change. Probably the best feature in the game has been gutted, the ability to quickly and easily make alot of gold so you don't have to spend your entire freaking life getting enough gold to do your raids and so forth. Oh well, good thing I have plenty of gold.
Barvik Oct 9th 2010 1:27AM
While I SUPPORT this change, I agree with pretty much everything pfooti said.
The process leading up to posting the glyphs is where most of my work lies. No other profession really has that much extra work just to get to the part of having a finished product. JC comes in second with prospecting. So the only trade off for all that work is posting massive amounts of glyphs. Yes, I like using QA3 to sell hundreds of glyphs a week. And yes, it is very profitable even at the end of this expansion. BUT, I like that Blizzard is de-emphasizing glyphs for scribes. I would much rather work smarter than harder. Glyph CRAFTING is just dull. Sure, finding out which glyphs do well and finding untapped markets is fun.... it's just too much to keep hundreds of auctions up at a time to compete with my alchemist and JC, who don't spend nearly as long as my scribe does on their profession.
Summation: Breaking batch posting is good, overall. The glyph market is broken in it's current state, so taking the focus off of glyphs and giving scribes other things to craft is good. Participating in the glyph market(current) takes a lot more work than just clicking "post" and "cancel." People complaining about undercutting(aka lower glyph prices) is hilarious. If you are a consumer, lower prices are a positive. And if you are an AH PvPer, you learn to adapt to the changes in your server's market.
Long-ass "summation," lol.
Sinthar Oct 12th 2010 4:43AM
Just love the automatic assumptions
1) If prices go up then its goldsellers that profit?
Reasoning please.
If prices go up its usually because the botted farmers have been banned - so gold profit goes to the true farmer - a toon that actually picks herbs.
2) The hardware event - is to block bots - so yes 'YEAH'
3) you moan about JC's and scribes having vast volumes to post....well rejoice cos as the functionality changes so do the vast volumes - as they shrink to (more) managable volumes in Cata. So as they break the funtionality - they also stop the need for it (as much).
Pfooti Oct 12th 2010 10:43AM
Sinthar: "1) If prices go up then its goldsellers that profit?"
Not what I said. I said, if the market becomes hard to automate legally, some legal players will leave the market in frustration (so prices will go up), leaving behind the illegal automators to reap even more gold from the AH.
Sinthar: "2) The hardware event - is to block bots - so yes 'YEAH'"
True, except for the part where it blocks illegal bots. I hope Blizzard couples this move with some extra-special diligence in removing not only bots, but toons that are actually played 24/7 by a coalition of low-paid farmers, because neither of those types of rule-breaking farmers are really affected by this change.
Tangentially, if this is indeed Blizzard's secret plan, this could be the coolest change ever. A super-subtle goldsink: get more gold from the economy in the hands of goldsellers, and then confiscate that gold. And that's why old weather flying is so cheap in cataclysm.
Srinthar: "you moan about JC's and scribes having vast volumes to post....well rejoice cos as the functionality changes so do the vast volumes - as they shrink to (more) managable volumes in Cata. So as they break the funtionality - they also stop the need for it (as much)."
This is simply a false statement. I don't know what else to do with it. There will always be large volumes in the game. Consider that, post-patch there are approximately 334 glyphs in the game. If you want to provide those glyphs to players (new players still need glyphs, as do people returning to the game after hiatus, and people who don't buy one-of-each on launch day, but instead wait until they want one), for which the demand will be existent but lower than before, you'll need to post at least 334 individual auctions every 2 days. This could be done under the old regime in an easy 10 minute batch, or it could be done the new way.
All of this is kind of moot though. The changes (we assume at least) have gone live in the patch. We'll see how things play out. They will definitely break the QA3Poster addon, which even I agree was egregious (I never used it either). As collateral damage, they'll make the life of every rules-abiding AH player a bit more difficult. The end.
jakedamuss Oct 8th 2010 7:51PM
Damn you blizzard, why?
as some one who always has 150-500 auctions this really annoys me. Are blizzard trying to break the economy? Its us auction house PvPers who keep the economy going. We buy lots of auctions that would not otherwise sell (for disenchant/prospect ect)
I get so many in game mails of people thanking me for buying all their auctions (and some times angry people that I have some how pushed out of the market)
An other way we keep the economy going is by posting so many damn auctions, we are the ones who know whats on demand and try to keep up the supply.
Seems to me like blizzard want a overpriced, low supply economy so that not one can afford anything
Luftwaffles Oct 9th 2010 8:41AM
Uhhhh, the economy is not going to change AT ALL. In fact, 95% of auction addon functions will still work. The only thing they changed was the ability to mass post items, and/or have programs auto-remove auctions which were undercut. The difference between 4.0.1 and now is that you have to hit the post button 5 times for 5 items instead of once.
If you're too lazy to hit buttons repeatedly (as if that's a foreign concept to this game) or actually monitor your auctions afterward, that's not "Blizzard killing the economy."
bluerobin427 Oct 8th 2010 7:52PM
Hmm, maybe I don't fully grasp the change, but can't you currently post multiple stacks of the same thing with a single click on live without any addons? And shouldn't the addons be allowed to tap into that functionality?
(sorry if this ends up being a double post)
bluerobin427 Oct 8th 2010 7:53PM
Ack and there's my first post. Downrate/delete please.
icepyro Oct 8th 2010 7:58PM
I'm a touch confused.
Given that I can set to post X number of stacks of the same item in default UI
Given that you state we can no longer batch auctions.
Does this mean we will have to accept every auction we create (like we do when buying)...
or...
Does this mean we will have to accept to post X auctions of each item Y?
For instance, I tend to post 3 of each kind of glyph I want to post, all in single stacks. So when I post 3 Glyph of Thunder and 3 Glyph of Obliterate, is that 6 clicks or 2?
Also, any chance that addons will be able to use whatever elements the default has? If I break up a stack, right now Auctioneer breaks it up and posts individually, but if I post using the default, it simply magically detracts from my bags.
I suspect that the ability to use the methods the default ui uses will hopefully be the key to making my example 2 clicks instead of the quick and dirty method it employs now which will likely mean 6. It will also mean an actual decrease in my posting time overall as I can accept 2 clicks and it go to town that way faster than accepting 6 clicks with it breaking the stacks for each click and then posting and may even be faster (since it doesn't have to break stacks) than current.
Either way, as long as I don't have to go back to old school before i discovered addons auctioning, then I'm happy.
originaltdiddy Oct 8th 2010 8:11PM
6 clicks.
icepyro Oct 8th 2010 11:12PM
Okay then.
Dear Blizzard,
In your regards to break addons from posting insane batches, may we please allow addons to access the methods and calls that the default UI does? Thus while my addon forces me to click a submit button to post, it can use your batching process for addons to post items of the same kind? I find it rather of ill taste to give the default ui a better functioning system than addons. I can probably live from 4.0.1 to 4.0.1a since this is rather hastily enforced, but I would appreciate disabling this double standard, at the very least, before Cataclysm.
Thanks,
-amateur entrepreneur wishing to learn the ways of goblins
Pyromelter Oct 8th 2010 11:37PM
Wait... that's not how I read it. Maybe the function in auction mods is broken, but Basil says it up there...
"So what is a batch? Since you can queue up multiple stacks of the same item using the default UI, that seems to be allowed still. What is no longer allowed is putting together a list of different types of items that you want to sell at the same time. "
I think what this means is that addons should be able to post multiple auctions of the same item with one hardware event; but you can't post multiple auctions of different items.
This will obviously hit the glyph market the hardest. While it may affect gem sellers, I've personally done okay with not queueing different gems to be listed (listing all my gems with different settings). With glyphs, there are just so many of them, I can see where this would be a bit of a pain. Fortunately, in the expansion, selling glyphs likely won't be a huge money maker, and Scribes will be able to make money with a smaller pool of items.
In other words, in your example ice, it should be 2 clicks, not 6. I think what is being stated though is that is not functionally working in Auctionator, Auctioneer, and QA3 on the PTR (which means it needs to be re-coded into those addons).
Assuming the add-on programmers can get that functionality working, I feel that overall this change will be a good one. The big impetus for this change is likely the current function in QA3 which automatically cancels and then posts auctions undercutting competitors. I'm seeing that on my server just tonight... within 30 minutes of posting an enchant scroll i'm seeing about 20 scrolls undercutting me, and re-undercutting themselves.
Anyway I don't think it's going to be the armageddon everyone is thinking it will be (again, assuming the addon programmers get that functionality working to be able to post multiple stacks of one item with one hardware event).
ColbyWolf Oct 8th 2010 8:07PM
Why? why god why?
*sniffles*
I just.. I don't get it. Why does blizzard make a tradeskill where there are nearly 300 useful items? I can't casually list items on my crafter... I cant craft once a day and be done with it. I can't remember "pillars of might sell nicely"... because there are 300 items to keep up with. I have a bank alt devoted entirely to listing glyphs and she's running out of bank/bag space.
Blizzard is taking away the repeat customers. They're making every individual glyph cost three times as much. and now they're going to make me spend 20 minutes pushing the 'yes, post' button? Nevermind that in order to compete on my realm, I'll need to do that several times each day..
Yes, I understand, my tradeskill is OP. It makes me too much money.
But for fucks sake blizzard. Take all of my glyphs away and make it so I make 'Minor Paladin Glyph' instead of Glyph of Sense Undead, Glyph of Blessing of Kings, etc etc. Make it so I Have to keep 3 items on hand for each class, rather then 20+. make it POSSIBLE for me to have a life and still make money with my profession.
Because if this stands... I forsee the death of glyph making except for the 'most popular' glyphs.... and I see the prices being jacked way up high for the few glyphs that are listed.
No, the QA method of posting autions is game breaking and bad, but it's one of the only ways to manage the only tradeskill in the game where a bank alt is required due to amount of inventory and accouterments.
*grumbles* Maybe I should give it all up and become a blacksmith.
originaltdiddy Oct 8th 2010 8:13PM
Blizzard doesn't want you to make money with your profession. They make gold sinks like expensive mounts, etc to keep you poor so you play the game more. Clicking for every post on the AH will make you play the game more.
F. Somalia Oct 8th 2010 9:57PM
"make it POSSIBLE for me to have a life and still make money with my profession"
hear, hear!