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11-21-2010 @ 8:17PM
...Why does she need a man at all?
11-21-2010 @ 8:21PM
No kidding. God forbid a woman work through things or discover things about herself on her own.
11-21-2010 @ 8:31PM
Unfortunately, common convention in Azeroth seems to be of the opinion that women of any kind of noble birth are pretty much there to get married and have kids. You know, continue the family line and all that.Jaina's spent all of her life bucking the trend -- which is perfectly fine! -- but there's a part of her that still wants that conventional life, despite the other, much larger part of her that knows that would be idiocy on her part.
11-21-2010 @ 8:40PM
This.Jaina does not "need a man". No woman honestly, seriously "needs a man" 'kay thanks bye. (It goes the other way, too, but man-needs-woman has less unfortunate implcations of doom.) I thought that line of thought went out with terrifying and flammable polyester pants and the goldenrod-coloured appliance set. Apparently it has experienced a resurgence, much like said appliance sets and pants. Sigh.Jaina needs a vacation, yes. Jaina needs a break, so she can relax and be happy again (because while I dig Varian as a character, wrangling him has GOT to wear on the nerve endings something fierce). Jaina does not necessarily need a man to accompany her on this vacation.Jaina was a brave, independent and whup-ass character until...I don't know, until WoW's writers apparently got into Richard Knaak's terrifying and unholy stash of NOOOO and decided his way of writing women made sense..? I wish I knew, I really did. Blizzard, where went her spine? Why in the name of Kil'jaeden's fiery bojangles did you give her a spine-ectomy!? This angers me. The record for writing the franchise's whup-assed women is not good at this point (what the crap is this terribly-written thing with Sylvanas and WHERE IS TYRANDE, YOU FOOLS), and I am not an optimistic sort with regard to this.Honestly, I'd like to NOT see Jaina reduced to just the girlfriend. I'd like to see her having a life of her own again, and whipping ass and taking names in her usual elegant way. That said, I don't want to see her pointlessly paired off with Varian Wrynn. Let's face it, that'd be a detriment to both their characters, and...this is Varian, COME ON! He's NOT emotionally ready for it by any means.Believe me, leaping into a relationship facefirst when one is grieving is the worst way to start said relationship.
11-21-2010 @ 8:39PM
Not trying to be misogynistic here, but don't women need men as much as men need woman for companionship?
11-21-2010 @ 8:44PM
I think it was this particular line, "And if there's one thing Jaina needs, it's a man who can bring back the side of her that she shoved away when Arthas left her," that irked me. It's either from your perspective, in which case I disagree with the sentiment (that's if there's one thing she needs, it's a man) or you're writing if from Jaina's perspective, which I haven't seen and wouldn't agree with that interpretation of her thoughts--but then again, I've only read one of the books and none of the comics.
11-21-2010 @ 8:45PM
@Eli: But does JAINA need companionship? And if so, would it be the "one thing" she needs, as the article puts it?
@Anne: I can't speak for Oteo, but that sure as hell wasn't what I was talking about, at all. I was talking about the nonsensical notion that in order for Jaina to get back in touch with that mischievous, fun-loving side of her personality again, she "needs" a man. With all due respect, that's bullshit, and it's sexist as all get out.That line infuriated me because it basically sums up everything wrong with how female characters have been written in this 'verse post-WC3. We need far less of that nonsense in this game, not more of it. At any rate, I doubt anyone's going to be discovering any mischievous, fun-loving sides to their personalities with full scale war going on. Which is what Jaina needs to be focusing on.
11-21-2010 @ 8:59PM
I don't believe "need" should be taken too literally in that context... ;
11-21-2010 @ 9:00PM
@Oteo Perhaps I should have phrased it as "If Jaina needs a man, this is the kind of man she needs?"Regardless, Warcraft lore is full of women who have been nothing but prodigal babycannons since the story started. Fun stories, sure - but women in Warcraft have -never- been portrayed as being strong and self-reliant, when push comes to shove. The main exceptions are Aegwynn, who used a man to further her own self-interests, and Jaina, who is trying very hard to pave the way for other women, but also dealing with this feeling of misplaced ineptitude because she couldn't 'fix' the man she loved....pretty screwed up, huh?
11-21-2010 @ 9:04PM
Contrary to what some folks will have you believe, the 70 yr old woman that has had a very interesting life but is still single is not cool. She's lonely and sad. And often has a lot of cats.A being that lives only for their job ends up alone, bitter and depressed. Look at Aegwynn. She never had a love life, she had duty. How did she turn out?A great life requires some balance, some love that is returned and someone that is there with you through those battles that are hard.She may not "need a man" but she NEEDS a partner. We all do.
11-21-2010 @ 9:07PM
@AnneThe phrasing is better, although "If there's anything Jaina needs, it's a pitcher of margaritas" would also work.As for the rest of your post, I think it just goes to show that video game production is still very much a boys' club.
11-21-2010 @ 9:09PM
@Anne: Women have never been portrayed as strong and self-reliant in Warcraft, seriously?You mean like when Tyrande told her childhood companion and lover of 10,000 years to go piss up a rope and broke his brother out of prison anyway because she made a decision as leader of the Sentinels that Illidan's aid would be be needed in fighting the Legion? Or when Sylvanas outwitted Grand Marshal Garithos and a bunch of dreadlords to seize control of the ruined Capital City?Wow. Just...wow.
11-21-2010 @ 9:15PM
@Kylenne You mean the Tyrande they overwrote and completely obliterated from existence in favor of the Tyrande presented in the War of the Ancients trilogy and Stormrage? Because they're very different Tyrandes, and I can assure you that the totally badass one from Warcraft III is a thing of the past. Unfortunately.
11-21-2010 @ 9:30PM
Let's look at the "they"s that're being tossed around here. 'They' as in the WC3 campaign writing team, which portrayed a number of strong female leads in Tyrande and Sylvanas, or as in Golden, who built a pretty strong character out of Jaina in Arthas, I have no qualms with. But Knaak's treatment of women (in his work that I've read) has really irked me. Especially in Vereesa, and even more in the decimation of the foundation that was Tyrande's character.
11-21-2010 @ 9:36PM
Kylenne. Your chill-pills. ... Take them. O _o
11-21-2010 @ 9:52PM
@ Eli, To be completely misogynistic, A woman can have a woman for companionship, as long as I get to watch :p
11-21-2010 @ 10:02PM
So we can have future generations of Jaina Proudmoores, and so she can raise them to think more like herself than like human society at large. :-)Also, there is something to be said for Jaina's personality being SO extreme someone needs to check her. I'm gonna go in a limb and say not Varian. His foil is already Anduin. And Thrall is out (see Aggra). Maybe Genn Greymane has some as-yet-unintroduced heir. Who knows. But it seems a shame not to write this woman a mate who doesn't go all postal and try to wreck the world, if for no other reason than I'd hate to imagine a world where someone like Jaina Proudmoore can't find love and happiness after all she's done for every living breathing thing in all of Azeroth.
11-21-2010 @ 10:28PM
Both, Jaina and Tyrandal, have had a lot of trouble with their male partners, they should keep each other warm on cold nights (and use a hide made out of Knaak as a blanket).
11-21-2010 @ 10:29PM
Oh look, the feminist mafia. Burn 'em bras and grow 'em body hair!Kill the evil evil men, kill them all!Women need men and men need women. because there's nobody loving you personally doesn't mean that fact of life changes. Get over it instead of trolling a very nice story.
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