Officers' Quarters: Impending doom

As the dawn of the Cataclysm era looms, new guilds have been springing up on every realm, hoping to tackle the expansion's challenges. Founding a guild is no easy task -- it requires dedication, patience, and hard work. How can you be sure it's all going to work out? Well, you never can. However, if you can identify signs of trouble early on, then you stand a much better chance of heading off some major problems later. This week's email is from a guild leader who's already sensing divisions in his fledgling community.
Scott,
I have been playing WoW for some time now. I had joined a guild last year and made several friends in it. However, we had several differences we felt over what we wanted and the direction the guild was going. So we parted ways with the guild, leaving behind many friends.
We started a new guild and are starting to recruit, establish guild rules and goals, etc. However, I am worried that differences among guild members and especially officers may become a problem. We have several very kind and patient officers and others who are less so. How does one manage the two groups (i.e., still get things done in a kind and patient manor and keep those with shorter fuses from turning off new members or current officers)?
If you are worried about these things already, Random Guildmaster, then you have a problem. You could be headed for what I call "The Big One," which is a massive, guild-destroying drama bomb that engulfs your entire membership, forcing them to choose sides.This is my greatest fear. Myself and several others have invested a great deal of time, money, and energy in this guild and I wish for it to be a success as far as progression goes, but more importantly a place where we can have fun and friendship.
Random Guildmaster
The good news is that you're aware of the issue, so you may be able to prevent such a disaster. Many guild leaders would ignore the warning signs and hope for the best. You can solve this issue, but not without effort or honest communication.
First, get all of your officers on the same page as far as raiding, progression, expectations for attendance and performance, and everything else you plan to do. You said you're working on rules and goals, and that's extremely important. Once you've hammered those out, you can all feel a bit more comfortable with the guild's future.
Even so, what's equally important is to establish among the officers the manner in which you will go about enforcing those rules and achieving those goals. In a previous Officers' Quarters column about the right way to give constructive criticism, I talked about a guild's "criticism culture." It sounds to me as if this is where the conflict lies. You have some officers who are kind and patient, and others who are less so.
Establish a culture
Keep in mind, you can't regulate personality. People are going to be the way they are. However, you can regulate behavior. If you have officers who are flipping out at members with no provocation or who lose their minds any time someone makes a mistake in a raid, then people are going to quit. No one wants to put up with that in their guild, and you shouldn't allow it to happen.
When an officer's behavior isn't so blatantly over the line, on the other hand, it's less clear what the appropriate response is, if indeed any response from you is appropriate at all. That's why you need to establish a precedent now for what's acceptable and what's not. Then, even when your officers get angry at someone, they will know the expected way to engage that member.
Your officers may have varying opinions about what's acceptable. Don't wait for a flare-up to discuss it. Have an honest discussion among the officers as soon as possible about how you'd like officers to treat members and how you'll handle situations such as when a member isn't pulling his weight in a raid. You'll find common ground when it comes to maintaining a respectful attitude, but you may differ in the extent to which an officer should discipline and/or criticize members.
For example, some guilds monitor their members' raid performance constantly and make suggestions. That's a proactive criticism culture. Some players can handle -- and even welcome -- that scrutiny; some can't. Other guilds are more laid back. Again, some players want that type of relaxed criticism culture; for others, it drives them nuts to see someone who's underperforming without officer intervention. It all ties in to exactly what type of guild you'd like to lead -- and what type of criticism culture you'd like to establish.
The fallout
This discussion will truly test whether the officers of your guild belong in the same community. It may turn out that you have wildly different expectations. If that's the case, then it's better to find out now. Hopefully, a compromise can be reached. Having a mix of personalities among your officers is not a bad thing. The good cop/bad cop routine, as cliché as it is, still works wonders to keep your members in line and working as a team.
The other issue at stake here is the membership. What are their expectations about raiding and about criticism? Talk to your members about that. If you have members with very different expectations, then you could be in for a rough ride.
That's why you have to establish a clear guild identity (including a criticism culture) right now, so that people can't say six months down the road that "this guild isn't what I signed up for" or "the guild's attitude has changed." Depending on the identity you choose, you may lose some people, but it's better to lose them now then to sit around and wait for The Big One to explode.
/salute
Filed under: Officers' Quarters (Guild Leadership)






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
BlisaedMusic Nov 22nd 2010 2:15PM
Starting a guild is a full time job, but has its benefits. When recruiting, you never know who you're getting until they stick with ya for a while
spookykabuki Nov 22nd 2010 2:21PM
sounds just like the guild I'm in. Me, the raid leader, and our guild leader are having a lot of issues with the new versus old. Hoping no bomb drops on us
soumeian Nov 22nd 2010 2:34PM
If I may add another point: A lack of open communication will break apart the guild faster than you can say 'He said, she said'. While private conversations are fine (everybody needs to vent), hold as many conversations in open forums as possible, to allow everyone a voice and head off any suspicions of favoritism towards one viewpoint or the other. If one particular side feels they aren't being given equal time--or that a clique is developing that they are distinctly outside of--bitter attitudes will magnify and most likely end in a giant drama bomb. include as many people as you can in discussions, particularly officers, and try to see things from both sides of the coin as much as possible. More often then not, simply being heard and understood (even if you don't go one way or another) can go a long way towards soothing wounded egos or letting them accept another outcome.
For that matter, watch out for cliques in general. While people will naturally group up with people they're closer to, this kind of opposing-view will lead to battle lines being drawn. When the two sides start antagonizing one another (you will notice the more voca members of such group getting more venomous, even if others remain diplomatic), you know there's more going on under the surface. Find out what, and quickly.
dengarsw Nov 22nd 2010 5:17PM
I'm going to both agree and disagree here.
I agree with the open part, since in all honesty, hiding arguments is never helpful. I'd restrict this, however, to arguments/issues concerning more than 2 people. If 2 people are arguing, have them take it to PMs, or moderate a discussion between them. However, as soon as it draws others in, it's best to address is sooner rather than later.
Now, the clique issue is where I'm going to disagree a bit, since cliques can be beneficial as well. When you have cliques and people join the guild, a solo-member who joins up with that clique is going to be more willing to stay in the guild than someone in a void. What you need to do is get the cliques working together and with you, rather than vice versa. Even if they're opposed to you, you may be able to figure out how to get them to work FOR you (i.e. if they want to do things a bit differently in their own raid, give them recruiting powers to bring in more members so you can potentially have a second raid that the current leadership won't have to moderate).
Claire Nov 22nd 2010 2:37PM
"If you have officers who are flipping out at members with no provocation or who lose their minds any time someone makes a mistake in a raid, then people are going to quit. No one wants to put up with that in their guild ..."
Well, unless it's really really funny, e.g. http://www.blogcdn.com/wow.joystiq.com/media/2006/12/sebspeakerwg2.jpg.
Jake Nov 22nd 2010 3:32PM
That was some funny shit right there.
WowMom Nov 22nd 2010 2:42PM
We have a guild with over 500 characters and over 200 members that play everyday. Last summer we codified our guild culture in a Declaration of Purpose and Principles. The original was drafted by a committee of two attorneys, an anthropologist, a dedicated non-raider, a dedicated raiders who's been raiding since Vanilla, our guild founder. As guild leader I simply oversaw the process. Once we had a rough draft, all the officers and then everyone in guild had input. I am very proud of what we came up with.
http://wrecklist.wowstead.com/declaration-of-our-purpose-and-principles
Spriestess Nov 22nd 2010 3:14PM
Very classy and well defined 'mission statement' for your guild :) You're right to be proud!
tenjackten Nov 22nd 2010 3:45PM
Politics first, gaming second. Bleh.
REDMJOEL Nov 22nd 2010 6:09PM
If you can't do politics then you have no business running a guild. More than 2 people always leads to politics
spookykabuki Nov 22nd 2010 2:45PM
I agree with you completely. The problem our guild is facing is we weren't a raiding guild and have since started running them. It started off slow but had snowballed Into a monster. We went from a small group of raiders to enuf to fill at least 3 10 mans. Problem now is all the new people who joined are raiders and don't understand the guilds purpose of helping your fellow guildie. Its drawn a line in the sand of those who built the guild, 500+ members I might add, and those who have no care of where we came from and where were headed.
Lissanna Nov 22nd 2010 2:57PM
My guild had a major split a couple weeks ago. The leadership of the new group is fairly unified, which means that our current 25-man raids are much stronger than when the previous leadership was split. We left the people who didn't agree with our new direction, and have built a group that is strong now. If you split, but brought a leadership team with you that doesn't agree on the direction of your new guild, then you are pretty much setting yourself up for disaster.
jfofla Nov 22nd 2010 3:07PM
Did I miss it, or does it not say where in SoCal?
Meiji Nov 22nd 2010 3:08PM
One thing I've found to be very important in dealing with other people, particularly in an organization, is to set expectations and a clear purpose for the group.
A common mistake that I see is people who start guilds that attempt to be all things - raiding guilds, leveling guilds and social guilds all rolled into one. This seems like a great idea on paper but in reality, these are oftentimes conflicting goals. While not impossible, a successful combination of these elements is generally the exception rather than the typical outcome.
Chris Nov 22nd 2010 3:13PM
I would recommend focusing on goals first and making sure they are realistic and achievable. Then share these goals with the guild and gauge reaction. A good goal would be like 'down Lich King in 10 man normal in 2 months.' or 'down Marrow in 20 mins." If the guild is mostly enthusiastic about the goals you are off to a great start. Be willing to accept feedback and make adjustments to further a sense of Buy-in and ownership from the whole guild.
Once you have this, THEN focus on rules. Make sure the rules support the goals. If a rule doesn't support the goals then ditch them. Most guilds I've seen seem to focus on rules more than goals, which is NOT a team but more a dictatorship. And far too many guilds simply ditch an under-performing guildie before even understanding why the performance is lagging to begin with and attempt to address it, which I find very cowardly.
Having well established goals and buy-in from the guild is also one of the greatest tools when giving criticism or making plans. It allows you to de-personalize the criticism and make it more about one guildie trying to help another so that everyone achieves what they agreed to.
The best guild leadership I've ever seen was not from someone who just dished out carrots and sticks. In fact, that's a bunch of crap anyway. The best leadership came from leaders who were able to politely set expectations (over and over again) and were able to dissect the problems facing a guild, create plans to address them (like practicing techniques needed to down a boss on similar weaker bosses - like maximizing DPS on the move), then implementing them.
John Nov 22nd 2010 3:37PM
Spookykabuki's GM here... told me about this thread. Definitely sounds similar to what we're dealing with. Somewhat of an inner struggle of power... Lot of the newer wave of people truly don't seem to care where we came from and what we see in the struggle over the new and old. One member has even become somewhat of a focal point that the two sides discuss, as his behavior is rude on the surface, but with good intentions. We've dealt with a very similar personality that ruptured our guild a few years back, leaving literally myself and one officer, and maybe two dozen inactive characters. Those on the new end of things do not see what we're seeing-- the fact that this person could easily do that same thing, and I can foresee it. Spook and I can see the other perspective, but it comes from inexperience with dealing with these sort of delicate matters.
John Nov 22nd 2010 3:41PM
I should say it was originally one person that was the problem, but he has 'infected' other members in a sense over time. A few now seem to enjoy his rude behavior, and he continually brings in a few other raiders to the guild. Hence the aforementioned 'line in the sand' as Spook put it (paraphrasing).
Whispness Nov 22nd 2010 4:34PM
I think that this is something that needs to be watched and members who cannot fit in with the guild and it's visions need to move on.
I actually had a "big one" in my large guild, which I am the guild leader of, just last week and I think that this is definitely the time for this. There were a few issues that were just so far apart from me and two of my officers that a significant portion of the guild split. It was done in a way that was unethical enough that some members who would have chosen "their side" stuck with us due to our handling of the situation. Basically it was done through trash talking myself and other leadership and lies about the direction of the guild when I actually would have encouraged it if it had been done right. Knowing those on the side that split, however, this kind of thing does not surprise me.
I'm going to list the issues that we had that caused our split:
- Maturity, the guild has had policies about guild chat a number of times. Some members felt that being very immature in guild chat was the way to go. Maturity in guild chat/on forums/in trade etc is something as a policy in our guild. I had warned them and was going to kick them if they continued, most of my officers stuck by my side but one of my officers had a problem with this and felt that these immature members were good guild members. He was very insulted by the idea of me removing them.
- Casual vs hardcore, the people that left were actually our more casual players. They liked doing stuff like not following calendars (including the officers that started this whole thing, who ignored their own calendars). They were also not very skilled. Our guild has stated that coming into Cata we are going to be more hardcore then ever. Thankfully they decided to break and not our "hardcore" members as I definitely fit into the "hardcore" mold which I think the members of my guild know...
Which leads up to the one thing that I will admit and that it was that these members may have been feeling a bit like second class citizens. They wouldn't get raid invites etc even to the alt run at times because they were just horrible. Every person who left was invited as a pvp member or a friend and not as raiders. They were expecting raid invites when we told them over and over that this could not be expected from these ranks.
- Overrecruiting - The officer that left brought in almost everyone who applied, regardless of skill. He refused to explain why he brought them in as well. I told him to stop doing this (almost took away his ginvite priledges) and this caused some frustrating with him in the way things were run. We were filled, to the brim.
Anyway that was the main things. The guild is actually very healthy now and was honestly getting too damn big. We have around 120 accounts and 290 members now - that is enough. We lost around 30 actual accounts and 80 members. The members that have stuck by are better players, more mature and are getting to know each other better as our members felt the guild was too full. We are still getting a lot of apps but have stopped recruiting for the most part. It is working out.
We have changed the way we tell people about our guild and promote it as we do not what to attract the kind of people who left. After this happened we had a guild meeting to make sure our remaining members were on the same page as us. We also will not trash talk this new guild in any way. If anyone asks I just say that they decided they had a different direction and we wish them the best of luck.
Strangely enough the other guild that was formed is very bitter and likes to do things to try to upset us including trolling us etc. There isn't much to be said about this, but I will just wish them well.
Point is I would really, really highly recommend that guild leaders and officers encourage people who are not fitting in with the guild mission and goals to just leave. It's sooner better than later. In my case I should have removed this officer long ago. It was a mistake I made and will not repeat. The members who have stuck with us I can trust a lot more now and that is a great thing going into Cata.
transrelativity Nov 23rd 2010 1:28AM
Though our guild is new and small, we have a simple, clear Guild Charter that all members are required to read and agree to before they join. It's a little slower to recruit people when they have to fill out an application and agree to certain principles, but I feel that it makes the guild happier and stronger as a whole to be composed of like-minded people.
http://www.hardcoeur.enjin.com/charter
rukamich Nov 23rd 2010 10:12AM
I'm a member of a Vanilla-WoW era guild (we formed a couple of months after launch) and while we've had drama in our hearly-6-year-existence, we've maintained membership and respect on our realm (Ally and Horde side alike, as we are bi-factional ;D ).
I would suggest to the OP that they quickly develop and express a standard for his/her guild: and get that up on a website. Have a guild breakdown on what you're about and what you expect, and set boundaries and do's/don'ts. If you establish that you are a casual guild with raiding aspirations, or a raiding guild with a spattering of pvp, it'll be understood from the get-go and will (hopefully) eliminate some of the basic drama. Get all of your officers on the same page and maybe have a couple of tiers of officers--those that can invite folks and promote, and those that will have an overall "final voice" (in our case, we have a GL, but two other officers who she selected to make difficult decisions in her stead, and then we have officers who can invite/kick and be called upon to settle disputes, et al).
Just my 2copper. :)
(Personally, I'd be leery about having officers with "short fuses", tho. it's one thing to have a bad day and get cranky, it's another thing to have people who routinely ignore, yell at or kick guildies because THEY don't want to deal with an issue. Guilds need officers who can look at things objectively and take advice/criticism as easily as they can accept compliments, otherwise, you could risk a shattering of your own...)