Drama Mamas: The case of the gold-selling guildie

I received the gift of massive drama for the holidays, which is why we went on an unscheduled hiatus. But that hiatus ends now. The promised roundup post will be next week, which means there is still time to get us the results of a letter we answered should you wish to be included. Just drop us an email at DramaMamas@wowinsider.com.
In the meantime, we have what this week's letter writer calls a "dilly of a pickle."
Dear Drama Mamas,
I have a situation in my guild that I could use your advice on. I am a senior officer in my guild, and some troubling news came to my attention a few days ago. It seems that one of my guild members is selling gold in real life. He's been using guildies' cool downs and the other guildies' professions to make items to sell on the AH. Originally, I thought it was to make items for himself, but that turned out to be false. The dilemma is that he's been in the guild for a while. He was an original member, then left, and came back about 4 months back. The other thing is that he's not selling the gold on a website. He's selling it to his real life friends because he's on work disability and his disability money will not allow him to play WoW, so he supplements his income by selling his WoW gold.
Thank you.
There are plenty of reasons this situation stinks:
- It sounds as if the guildies whose cooldowns and crafting time are being used may be in the dark about what their efforts are actually funding.
- It wouldn't be hard to raise $15/month. Where's the extra money going, and how does your disabled guildie rationalize that part of the equation?
- You have a guild to run, and encouraging anything sheisty is extremely counterproductive to the health of the guild.
- How long is this gonna go on, anyway?
Taking advantage of your guildmates for profit is downright sleazy. Even if they're aware and willing, selling gold is against the game's Terms of Service. And then you have the feelings of anyone who's participating but perhaps reluctantly, or anyone who's heard about it and disapproves. Don't condone this; it's a time bomb of anger waiting to blow up in your face.
Game time's cheap. If this guy's earned the kind of real-life guild rep and loyalty you seem to feel is there, why not just make an effort to round up some game cards for the guy?
- My first reaction: Eep! He's disabled! Does that make this okay?
- My second reaction: "Work disability" = short-term disability = he's recovering from an injury or illness and most likely has his job and a return to prosperity to look forward to in the very near future.
- My next reaction: It's only 15 bucks a month.
- My final reaction: Even if he is disabled for life, it still doesn't make it right to abandon ethics and morals.
Of course, if we misinterpreted the letter and the guildies are consenting to have their cooldowns used for his profit, it does change things a bit. If he's been up front about that, he's not really harming the guild with his abuse of the Terms of Service. I'm not saying you should condone the gold selling, but if he's just selling it to friends and not supporting the hacking sites -- well, he's really only causing his account potential harm. I would still ask him to stop or leave the guild, but you're not really going to be able to prove he stopped if he stays. It really doesn't sound like he has the guildies' consent, however.
Justice is really the best way to prevent drama in a guild. And injustice (perceived or real) is the best way to cause it. I'm all for taking a collection for the guy (in game cards as Lisa suggests, not cash). But separately, I think he has to be given the ultimatum to stop both the exploiting and the goldselling, or he will need to leave the guild.
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Drama Mamas
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Reader Comments (Page 2 of 7)
Celldweller Jan 14th 2011 5:14PM
I know what it means, it means I've already received a message stating I've been reported. Meaning that they used information sent over their website.
Hangk Jan 14th 2011 5:27PM
He seems to be confused as to the difference between supporting net neutrality and tolerating gold selling. I suspect many people here join me in being pretty hep to the former, not so much to the latter.
All non F2P MMOs have a pact with their users that the monthly subscription fee is all the cash outlay you need to excel in the game. (Riding a sparklepony != excelling at WoW.) Gold selling violates that pact: all other things being equal, the person who buys gold has a meaningful in-game advantage over the person who does not. When you sell gold, even if you earned that gold yourself "legitimately" rather than through exploiting, you are creating unfair conditions on your server. I think this is why people want to vote you down.
monkeyhouse Jan 14th 2011 5:28PM
so "they" are out to get you huh? despite the fact you publicly admit you have been breaking the TOS and have finally been caught, you still think that the writers of this blog had anything to do with it? paranoid much?
also, you definitely have no idea what "net neutrality" means. i would look it up if i was you...
Celldweller Jan 14th 2011 5:31PM
Anyone who thinks that an online forum is 'public' has to get their own facts straight. Every website has a privacy policy, and in violating that, they run into legal recourse.
humperdinck Jan 14th 2011 5:33PM
Yeah, you still don't know what "net neutrality" means. Look it up. While you're at it, look up "Terms of Service" and "ethics".
Léona Jan 14th 2011 5:40PM
Net neutrality is about the free flow of information through different comanpies' servers. Pfft.
Celldweller Jan 14th 2011 5:46PM
Terms of Service and Ethics? Have you ever let a friend make a character, if only to try the game for a few minutes? You broke ToS, have you ever used a name that was loosely based upon a historical character? You broke ToS. Have you ever gave someone ingame gold? That can be seen as a ToS break.
The fact that Blizzard doesn't punish every single person is their choice, but I don't see how helping out real life friends and me being able to afford to give my wife a present that isn't bought with her money is bad. If I was to sell to a website, yeah that's bad, but basically giving a friend some gold isn't. Anyhow, I've had my fun trolling for the moment, you guys need to learn to think about all the sides and not just live in your black and white lives. Nothing is simply black and white.
Aruhgulah Jan 14th 2011 5:49PM
>>since it's odviously not net neutrality friendly
Galestrom Jan 14th 2011 6:04PM
You know what this situation calls for?
A tin foil hat.
Delcoro Jan 14th 2011 6:28PM
Wow. It's nice to know there are MULTIPLE aspects of the law you are completely ignorant about. It would be funny if it weren't so pathetic.
Bouncing Gnome Jan 14th 2011 6:30PM
Throwing in my own 2p I'd like to:
a) Support Celldweller in his comment "a conversation requires both sides to give input".
b) Suggest that the most important part of every discussion is finding out *why* people do as they do.
Only a very, very tiny minority of people do harmful things because they enjoy being harmful. The vast majority of people either don't see the full impact of their actions, or believe that they are making an overall non-harmful set of actions. This last point is phrased in a slightly confusing way, so to clarify I am talking about people who do the "lesser of two evils", or talk themselves into thinking "it isn't all that bad really".
Conclusion: Celldweller, please take note of *why* people are giving for downrateing you. I think you're in a worse position than you think you are. Everyone else, please don't dismiss Celldweller so quickly. He has a very valid point of view, and learning from his point of view will give the rest of us better verbal armaments against other casual gold-sellers.
The Giant Jan 14th 2011 8:21PM
Cell, ol' chap, this calls for a switch to a new MMO, DC Universe Online. You'd make an excellent Captain Panic.
/popcorn
Celldweller Jan 14th 2011 10:33PM
Captain Panic happens to be a personal hero of mine, I may just take you up on that. On a side note, net neutering is still wrong.
Drakkenfyre Jan 14th 2011 11:01PM
Net neutrality refers to the ISP not being able to be biased against or for data. It means aboslutely nothing about you being judged by your opinion.
Drakkenfyre Jan 14th 2011 11:05PM
Celldweller, just what in the hell are you talking about here?
You said you sold gold. You got downvoted for it. The USERS of the site are voting you down. The editors are not.
If suddenly you got a message in game saying you have been reported, unless you gave out your name here, that can't happen. No one violated your "privacy". Maybe the gold selling caught up to you?
kingerz Jan 14th 2011 11:09PM
Cell is dead right, we need both sides of this debate to see the big picture. Closing your eyes and humming 'lalalala' means you'll never have an open mind. This guy admits to selling gold, you should listen: that's exactly what this drama is about!
Snuzzle Jan 15th 2011 12:14AM
http://wow.joystiq.com/2011/01/14/the-lawbringer-net-neutrality-and-mmos/#continued
How timely.
Fierna Jan 14th 2011 3:17PM
Ouch that is tricky. Even if people who are letting him make use of CD's know where the money is going are they doing it to help or because they feel guilty?
I think you raise a great point about how long this will go on. I could see people pulling together to help out a guildie in the short term, but to have to do it over and over again would become draining. I'd see him come online and probably wince. People in Azeroth are there to play a game and it''s unfair to exploit them.
Also... doesn't the knowledge that this is going on make this guild complicit in violating the terms of service? Is it ever fair to put your guild in that precarious position?
Scooter Jan 14th 2011 5:04PM
Look there really isn't much to argue here. The guy's arrangement is breaking the rules and his methods are abusing trust. If you want to help him then do so under an arrangement that does not involve an in-game benefit. His actions could get these people in trouble so it's time to put a stop to it.
It may seem awful but if this guy is disabled temporarily or permanently then he needs to focus on how to improve his standing in life instead of having other people toss him an excuse to do nothing.
If you want to help him then find out about his problem and make sure he see's someone appropriately trained to help him.
Fierna Jan 14th 2011 5:43PM
The problem becomes when to say "No I can't do this anymore." If the guild allows him to continue they are making that tough call up to the guild members.
Will I feel like a jerk for saying no?
It's a bit like that guy who is always asking you for a ride home. It's not too far out of your way, you won't get home much later, but for crying out loud after a while you are tired of doing it and want him to get a ride home himself!
If the guild officers say "This cannot continue" it relieves guild members from feeling pressured. If they really really really want to help the guy they can send him a message and help him but if not they can say "Hey Officer X said no can do."