Know Your Lore: Honor, Krom'gar. Never forsake it.

I spent a very long time in Northrend, Krom'gar. I learned much about the Horde in that time. While there, a wise old war hero told me something that I would carry with me forever...
"Honor," Krom'gar, "No matter how dire the battle... never forsake it."
The Stonetalon Mountains, nestled in the heart of western Kalimdor, are one such location that's come under heavy fire from both sides. Formerly home to the Venture Company, the Stonetalon Mountains are now under contention by both sides, in an effort to grab what resources and land are immediately available. For the Alliance, it's a harder fight than previously thought. Not only is the Alliance dealing with Horde forces, they're also dealing with an ancient evil lurking beneath Stonetalon Peak.

What's interesting about Stonetalon Peak isn't just the story -- it's the shift in attitude. It doesn't just serve to highlight what's been going on in the Stonetalon area; it serves to highlight what's going on in the Horde itself. Gone are the days when NPCs quietly beseech you to help heal the Charred Vale. Now as a member of the Horde, players are expected to arm land mines in order to blow up any night elves encroaching on Horde outposts. The shove for supremacy is strong here, just as it was in the snowy hills of Icecrown.
In Icecrown, the Horde forces sought to not only wipe out the Scourge that served the Lich King, but also the Alliance forces, even though the Alliance forces had the same goal in mind: to destroy the Lich King and his army once and for all. The lunacy of the situation didn't occur to the Horde. It was simply a matter of wiping out their enemies, even when those enemies were at their weakest. Especially when those enemies were at their weakest.

Horde scouts reported that the night elves were preparing their own weapons of mass destruction and hiding them within an ancient tree to the north. Since the bomb could not be used on Windshear Hold, it was flown instead to Cliffwalker Post. Cliffwalker Post was a small tauren outpost situated high above Battlescar Valley, where fighting between the Alliance and Horde armies had reached a brutal climax. But upon arrival at Cliffwalker Post, a startling revelation was made by the tauren that called this area their home.
The night elves weren't holding weapons of any kind. In fact, the night elves of the area were young druids in training, and the ancient tree was nothing more than a druid grove called Thal'darah. Druids, both night elf and tauren, studied there together for generations, and there was no reason to suspect that these nature-loving creatures would do anything to destroy the fragile land around them. High Chieftain Cliffwalker tried to convince the Horde General of this, but General Grebo wouldn't hear of it, accusing Cliffwalker of treason -- and so the High Chieftain sent his son Orthus into the valley to speak with the night elves thereand prove that the druids had no weapons of any kind.

Players sent to meet Orthus manage to find the young tauren -- or what remained of him. The glade itself was full of frightened young druids, running in terror with nowhere really to go. Armies of Alliance and Horde surrounded the glade, and the sounds of battle ripped through the air, the little druid glade trapped smack in the middle of it all. Orthus lay dead at the top of the ancient tree along with several night elf bodies. There were no weapons in sight, no obvious signs of foul play, but Orthus' dead hand clutched an insignia. Not an Alliance insignia -- the insignia of a Krom'gar General. Grebo's insignia.
High Chieftain Cliffwalker was furious. His son had been betrayed, murdered by the Horde who supposedly followed an honorable path. He ordered his wife to leave, but she refused to leave her husband's side. After giving the insignia back to General Grebo, High Chieftain Cliffwalker let the general know that his lies had been exposed. Instead of apologizing for his actions, the general called Cliffwalker a coward, spineless and a disgrace to the Horde, and attacked the Chieftain and his wife. Forced to defend themselves, the Cliffwalkers killed General Grebo.

Cliffwalker's wife was the first to fall to Krom'gar's army, the small tents and huts at the outpost set ablaze. And as High Chieftain Cliffwalker watched in horror, Overlord Krom'gar ordered the bomb released to Thal'darah Grove, forcing the chieftain to watch as it detonated and destroyed the ancient tree as well as the few frightened druids that remained behind. Women, children, innocents ... all dead, and a smoking crater was all that remained of the druid's precious grove. And as Overlord Krom'gar gloated over his victorious plans, a newcomer arrived on the scene. Warchief Hellscream.
Overlord Krom'gar says: Warchief! I... I was carrying out your command!
Garrosh Hellscream says: My command? Was my command to murder innocents, Krom'gar?
Overlord Krom'gar says: Warchief... Sir... I...
Garrosh Hellscream says: Am I a murderer, Krom'gar?
Overlord Krom'gar says: No, Warchief!
Garrosh Hellscream says: Then I ask you again: WHAT HAVE YOU DONE!
Krom'gar begins to cower before Garrosh.
Garrosh Hellscream says: I sent you into Stonetalon Mountains with an army. Your orders were to secure this land for the Horde. Instead, you laid waste to the land. Murdered innocents. Children even... I spent a very long time in Northrend, Krom'gar. I learned much about the Horde in that time. While there, a wise old war hero told me something that I would carry with me forever... "Honor," Krom'gar, "No matter how dire the battle... never forsake it."
Garrosh Hellscream says: Overlord Krom'gar, you have disgraced the Horde. You have brought shame to us as a people. By my right as Warchief, I hereby relieve you of your duty.
Garrosh picks up Krom'gar by the throat and lifts him over the edge of the lift bridge.
Garrosh Hellscream says: YOU ARE DISMISSED.
Garrosh drops Krom'gar off the edge, sending him to his death.
This is one of the pivotal moments of Cataclysm, because it highlights one of those changes that we didn't see in the end of Wrath -- the moment when Garrosh realized that the fighting he encouraged in the Northrend war was no longer an acceptable option, that it simply did not apply in southern Azeroth because there were civilians potentially at risk. It's one thing to be fighting an army that is prepared to fight; it's another thing entirely to attack a defenseless group of druids who not only are doing nothing to provoke an attack but also have no real way of defending themselves. The druids of the glade were not warriors; they were not members of the Alliance army. They were innocents caught in the midst of battle.

It may also very well be why Garrosh's reaction to Overlord Krom'gar's acts was so strong. The death of a tauren by orcish hands, and once again, that death was a dishonorable one -- it was an echo of the shame he felt when he learned that Cairne's death was not an honorable one and that he had murdered someone who couldn't fight back. This time though, it wasn't a treacherous Grimtotem who poisoned the blade and paved the way for his shame -- it was an orc Overlord who had been trusted with the position of command, an orc that Garrosh himself had placed in that position of command. There was no reason for Krom'gar to act the way he did, other than sheer bloodlust. And it is obvious from Garrosh's reaction that mindless bloodlust will not be tolerated.

Which makes the rest of Cataclysm even more interesting. Garrosh is learning, and Garrosh has stated that this kind of behavior will not be tolerated -- and yet that behavior is being acted out in other areas of the world, notably in Silverpine Forest and Hillsbrad Foothills, where the Forsaken have gone wild and ignore the Warchief's wishes. It may be that Garrosh Hellscream will soon discover what kind of strain Thrall was under as Warchief, that a Warchief's eyes cannot watch everything at once. How he chooses to deal with this knowledge is still up in the air; however, I don't think it's likely that we'll see Garrosh willingly give his position to another -- he's far too determined to lead, and lead the right way.
The eyes of Hellscream are upon us, but they aren't the eyes of an orc driven to bloodlust. They are the eyes of a cautious leader, a watchful leader, one who has a very defined line between what is honorable and what is not. Stonetalon remains as a cautionary tale to any who cross that line ... and they will learn in the instant before their death the folly of dishonor and what it means to cross a Hellscream.
For more information on related subjects, please look at these other Know Your Lore entries:
- Garrosh Hellscream
- High Overlord Saurfang
- Sylvanas Windrunner
- Current Horde Politics: the Orcs
- Cairne Bloodhoof
While you don't need to have played the previous Warcraft games to enjoy World of Warcraft, a little history goes a long way toward making the game a lot more fun. Dig into even more of the lore and history behind the World of Warcraft in WoW Insider's Guide to Warcraft Lore.Filed under: Lore, Know your Lore






Reader Comments (Page 5 of 6)
Ata Jan 16th 2011 4:43PM
Unfortunately, I think you might be missing a huge chunk of lore, like a lot of people, because of so much being put into books right now. Ashenvale is being invaded because the Night Elves, who had actually started to trade with the Orcs after Northrend, stopped because they were upset on something (I forget what), and the Orcs were struggling with a drought (like anything ever grew in Durotar in the first place) and needed food and wood and supplies. The Warsong campaign had technically been called off, there was a truce. But when the NE called that off and stopped trade, and then the Twilight Cultists started murdering people and making it look like the Horde did it (making even some within the Horde think Garrosh ordered it until the truth was found), open hostilities started again, and the Horde made a huge, and fairly successful, push into Ashenvale.
There are 'unfair' attacks on both sides. The Alliance shoving its way into the Barrens and burning Taurjo to the ground to attempt to get into Mulgore was tactically a good idea, but brutal and murderous. The Forsaken still using the Blight in it's fairly pure form and not diluting it isn't exactly fair and was horrible for Southshore. The 'no wittnesses' attack on Thrall as he was going to -save the world- and blowing a Goblin ship out of the water despite it looking unalligned and realizing it was a slave ship...not exactly a nice thing. The Forsaken and their attack on Glineas...name one on one side, and you can name another example on the other.
Both sides have blood on their hands. I hope to quest more through Alliance things to see if there's examples of Varian growing up and not being as giant of an a$$ just like there are examples of Garrosh growing up or at least finding a better method for dealing with things other than 'Kill everything'.
BlindWorg Jan 16th 2011 5:28PM
What am i missing exactly?
What you pointed out was included on my original post. I compressed all you said about NE trading into the word ''strenuous''. Horde in lack of resources also i did mention.
Guess its my time to pick on your tidbits of lore you are missing :3
The TH ambush on representative druids from A and H trying some peace negotations was never solved in the book. Even Runetotem's survival only strengthed the impression that the Horde was behind the murders since he only witnessed Horde races ambushing.
Seeing you havent quested in Southern Barrens Ally side ill explain a few things about it. After the Great Divide splintered the Barrens, Allies launched attacks in the resulting confusion to seize land ( Not like the Horde would do things otherwise, remember the Broken Front? Also assuming that Garrosh had already begun seizeing land first in Ashenvale these assaults in the Barrens were justified counter-offensives ).
With Honor's Stand taken and Northwatch hold sending its own skirmishes in the coast of Northern Barrens, General Hawthorne, or ''Butcher of Taurajo'' as he was known to the horde via quests, was ordered or he himself made the decision to sack Taurajo. Lives were lost on the Horde side, no doubt about that, but it would have gone much much worse without our General here.
He issued the attack when the camps hunters were out in the field and deliberately put holes in the lines of his soldiers, to give a chance for the civilians for escaping. The lives lost in Taurajo were of those who fought and stood their ground, not the ones fleeing. The looters currently inhabiting the ruins are deserters from the attacking force and both the Allies and Horde are sent to deal with them respectively. Later on our good General was ambushed and hung from a tree by the Horde by his ''butchering''. Im not going further into that, with the Dwarves of Bael Modan accusing the Horde of destroying their stronghold which was not sanctioned by Horde authority. They balance each other out with both sides accusing each other of the wrongs they have done. That i will say is that whoever did the quest desigigning for this zone did an amazing job. Without doing both sides you would never know the full story going there.
About the Alliance ambushing Thrall and the Bilgewater near the Lost Isles, im inclined to say they didnt know it was actually Thrall. Their orders was just ''capturing the horde target at all costs'' implying they only knew it was a important guy, not the big-shot ex-warchief himself. Goblins stumbled in and retreated straight away and, as someone else here pointed out, they didnt give a white flag or surrendered. Besides, their goblins, mercenary/trade race knowning to have a closer affinity to the Horde than the Alliance.
Dunnik Jan 16th 2011 3:52PM
Excellent article as usual. It shows that Garrosh is not a bad orc, and tries to do the right thing by his lights. But it also shows he's a newbie leader and unsure of his position. Inexperience + hotheadedness = trouble.
Azizrael Jan 16th 2011 4:05PM
I've played through Stonetalon twice now - once on my Warlock working on Loremaster, and again on my Goblin on her way to the level cap - and this was where I realised Garrosh is sticking around as Warchief, and where I started to really like him as a character.
If you've picked up a sword to fight for the Alliance, you're an enemy of the Horde. Surrender is dishonorable to the orcs of old, so he's really doing you a favour if he kills you quickly. Being taken prisoner is far more shameful than being slaughtered, even if you were caught by surprised on a crippled ship.
Harvoc Jan 16th 2011 4:14PM
Good thing I'm a hunter, and I picked up a gun to fight my enemies. :)
Amaxe Jan 16th 2011 8:04PM
@Azizrael
I hate to invoke real world atrocities because people tend to start spouting nonsense like "Godwin's Law," but what you are describing here sounds very much like the perversion of Bushido used by the Japanese soldiers in the 1933-1945 period.
Things like the Bataan Death March and other brutalities against surrendered prisoners were justified under such a view of "honor."
The Horde players can support such a mentality if they choose of course, but the players should be aware of the historical precedents in the real world, and realize in the real world, there is nothing at all "honorable" about such a view.
arrowrest Jan 16th 2011 4:42PM
I'm still reserving judgment on Garrosh. Both Cairne and Vol'jin didn't want him for warchief for good reason. He's still pursuing this war and one sensible act of honor doesn't make up for all that has come before with his behavior as a character.
Don't get me wrong, I really like Garrosh as a character in the story because we are seeing his development into something more than just a one dimensional figure. I look forward to what Blizzard has in store but I not sure Garrosh will ever feel like a suitable warchief after Thrall. For instance, if there wasn't a war going on, what would Garrosh do?
Anne Stickney Jan 16th 2011 5:16PM
That's a really good question -- one we don't have an answer for yet. It'll be interesting to see, regardless.
Sintraedrien Jan 16th 2011 5:54PM
We know what Garrosh would do if there wasn't a war on: he would start one. After all, in his view, war is the only honorable occupation, and winning battles is the only way to prove yourself 'honorable' (and better and stronger than other people).
Somehow I suspect that in his mind, humans are by definition weaker than orcs, because if they weren't, they would already /be/ orcs. (He would also probably be quite happy with this circumstance) We can see from his treatment of the Tauren (specifically Cairne and then Baine) that he considers the Tauren to be roughly equal to orcs ("honorary' orcs, as it were) , because they have approximated the orcish ideals, single combat, strength, honor, and the rest.
He looks down on the trolls, because they /don't/ fit into the proper orcish conventions, e.g. his treatment of Vol'Jin and the troll/goblin areas of Orgrimmar.
AS I see it, if Vol'Jin had challenged him to Mak'Gora (?), then he would not have done so (segregated the trolls), because win-or-lose, the troll would have been behaving like proper orcs, but they didn't.
(Also, for my earlier comments, please understand that they were made "in character"- Sintra has her own issues with existence.)
Sintra E'Drien of the Ebon Blade, né Sindorei (are the Worgen recruiting? I'd go furry)
pietrex Jan 16th 2011 6:59PM
"What would Garrosh do?"
it's really simple. :) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6R4U6OdY64
Bumblebee Jan 16th 2011 4:57PM
The Forsaken have their own agenda, and they won't hesitate to leave the rest of the Horde behind if an opportunity rises. At this point the difference between Arthas and Sylvanas is growing thinner. It's pretty much only game mechanics that are keeping the Forsaken with the Horde, since they don't really feel that much loyalty to any living creatures. How Garrosh deals with them will be one of the biggest tests on him.
He has also managed to anger the Trolls, and that's always a bad move. He'll need to mend that relationship if he wants to ensure their loyalty to the Horde.
What happened with Cairne Bloodhoof is a burden he will always have to carry. Even though he wasn't to blame he's still responsible. IIRC he was the one who said "Let this duel be to the death then!" or something with that effect. He should've known better than to think Cairne would back out from that, but he was too cocky to realize he had challenged a better fighter, and what's more important, a man of principle. He would've lost the Horde already, if it was not for Baine, who was smart enough a politician to let his personal issues with Garrosh go in favor of his people.
I have no idea on what the Blood Elves are doing at this point, but apparently it's still in their best interest to stay with the Horde.
Garrosh is an interesting character and a very good story-telling device. I don't like the dude, but I like the way he can work as a story catalyst. So, even if I still don't think he is a great leader, he is no doubt a great tool to for the writers. I like that he is maturing a bit and is becoming a more rounded character. He is flawed, and that is the strength of the character.
Amaxe Jan 16th 2011 7:57PM
OK, so Garrosh offs Krom'gar for atrocities.
So when's Sylvanas going to take the same fate for far worse evils?
Zhiva Jan 16th 2011 8:18PM
A comment by nagaina_ryuuoh in wow_ladies LJ community:
He cherishes the _idea_ [of himself as an honorable leader] but he might be willing to settle for the _image_, also. Garrosh does nothing meaningful to halt the atrocities committed against the tauren and the kaldorei in Stonetalon...but he arrives just in time to make a show of how He Doesn't Tolerate That Sort of Thing Because It Besmirches The Honor of the Horde. _After_ the tactical objectives have been attained, and then _kills_ the only person who could effectively contradict the official 'rogue commander working without official sanction' line. In short: I think Garrosh may very well be willing to do a number of inhumane things provided he comes out smelling like a rose on the other side, and _that_ is the real lesson he learned from Magatha Grimtotem's rise and fall.
Ronin Jan 16th 2011 8:26PM
"What happened to Krom'gar?"
Garrosh: "I let him go."
Amaxe Jan 16th 2011 9:36PM
Sam and Garrosh?
Ronin Jan 16th 2011 8:31PM
"Stonetalon Mountains are now under contention by both sides, in an effort to grab what resources and land are immediately available."
It seems a little disingenuous to paint the Alliance presence in Stonetalon that way. While you could argue this in other places, it just doesn't ring true here-- especially in regards to the events told in this article.
Why try to make the two sides' motives and actions equivalent? Could it be an attempt to excuse the Horde, who are definitely there for one purpose only-- to acquire more land?
Pat Jan 16th 2011 9:25PM
I'm really starting to favor the Horde for the first time since picking up WoW, Alliance just appealed to me for whatever reasons (Dwarves mostly) but now with Hellscream in charge and that wimp Thrall doing his own thing I'm really considering either rolling an alt horde side or faction changing to blitz through the zones and experience all of this good stuff.
I did keep myself busy in Dec with a low level Horde alt that I took through Siverpine & Hillsbrad and those two zones were really interesting and enjoyable, Yes I read all the quest text and conversations :) That alt went Alliance though and is now in Outland ;(
Orcshaman Jan 16th 2011 11:48PM
This whole subject just makes me lose any faith I once had with the horde and why I spent years defending it.
At the base of everything, I felt like I was defending a faction that had redeemed itself from its past sins and actully had a hope it was better then it was. The odd dark or twisted quest giver didn't make me lose any faith in that.
But this now garrosh lead horde and its extention has just turned that right around, and from being a loyal defender of things like orgrimmar and horde camps, i've turned over to just saying 'let the alliance have it'.
Garrosh, is a terrible character. He's a steamrolled and retconned tool of a mechanic to make a war story in warcraft. And the sad joke is how many people fall for it so easily without seeing it.
The reason why the horde felt so much better then the alliance is because it's ideals were about real brotherhood and real honor, not divided morals or changing the meaning of honor to suit yourself. Its like 'I'm an orc, I can kill whoever I like now and call that honor!'. It was never about that, and yet its gone this way. Why are people so slow to pick up on this fact?
And by the share fact that Thrall banded the horde together as one, well Garrosh as divided the horde to the point of distancing the leaders from him, and at a time of great war, just shows how single minded Garrosh really is.
By all means, follow a tool of a character all you want just so it appeals to your lack of morals or decency, cause thats all Garrosh gives to this story.
SillyString Jan 17th 2011 4:49AM
Think you're taking a video game waaaaaaaaaaaaay too seriously. You've also seemed to ignore everything that goes against what you feel, which has been detailed in other articles and in the game itself.
The Alliance is in the same boat as the Horde, and Varian Wrynn has shown that he won't stop until the Horde (and the orcs especially) are either slaughtered or broken, and he's done his own share of underhanded things (SI:7's actions against Thrall when he's trying to save the planet, trying to assassinate one of his own allies).
Either way, you're playing in a crappy situation. Pick the side whose crap you prefer to soak in and enjoy the game.
Nick Jan 16th 2011 11:51PM
I gotta say first, I really used to hate Garrosh. Back when people were still doing the Argent Tourney and 3.3 had just dropped, I had had enough. Constant bickering with the alliance, ruining every chance Thrall had to make some kind of peace. However now that I'm in the Cata world I've had a change of heart. Garrosh is changing, Saurfang did his job well, but Garrosh is still new to Azeroth. He hasn't been here for that long, and he is just coming off of a huge victory in Northrend and now he is the WARCHEIF. He's come farther than I'm sure even he could have expected in the time its been. Stories have character development, and Blizzard wanted you to hate Garrosh, but hes not gonna stay the same. Don't hate him for his previous actions, judge him based on where he goes.