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1-29-2011 @ 2:13PM
I haven't been able to find solid confirmation on whether or not the Darkmoon Card: Volcano proc procs ignite yet. Or if it's effected by any other fire mage talents. Can anybody confirm this yes or no?
1-29-2011 @ 2:55PM
Another mage in my guild tested it a few weeks ago and it is affected by Fire mage talents as well as SP buffs like AI. I *think* it cannot proc ignite but I'm not positive.Its definitely a very very good trinket.
1-29-2011 @ 5:05PM
:\Dang, the ignite proc was the thing I most wanted to know. Thanks for the info, though.
1-29-2011 @ 9:59PM
Problem with ignite is, last I checked, it was still getting munched like crazy. You probably don't want it to proc to be honest, lest it munch a FFB/FB/Pyroblast crit.I did a lot of data crunching, and found that I lost around 60k damage in a 30 second bank of ignite - that's 2k dps. Getting munched on a possible ignite proc from a nuke can be a serious blow to your dps, so you might not even want DMC: Volcano to proc ignite.
1-29-2011 @ 10:10PM
Ah. Either that was a freaking huge crit or I read an earlier column wrong, but don't ignite DoT's sort of cummulate/average eachother if they get munched? It's some really complicated algebraic formula. They don't just plain kill each other and take eachother's place, I know that.
1-30-2011 @ 5:18AM
Cloud, it's a bit involved. I took the data I did during my guild's final raid in wrath of the lich king, for deathbringer saurfang... and I'll explain why in a second.The way ignite works, is that it creates a "bank." On your first crit, you are supposed to start a 4 second countdown, with 2 DoT ticks, each 20% of the crit damage you did. Your initial crit is a number (lets say you crit for 20k, so you have 8,000 total damage for ignite to do over 4 seconds). If you get another crit within that 4 second window, the ignite damage is "banked" and you then have the counter reset to above 4 seconds, and ignite will now tick 3 times, once at 4 seconds, once at 2 seconds, once at 0 seconds.The problem is that there is an internal cooldown on ignite. It's not likely intended, but results from server lag not adding it in. Every single crit you get can possibly refresh ignite, except for the ignite tick itself (which cannot crit). That means every FFB tick, every LB tick, every combustion tick, and every pyroblast dot tick, potentially can crit and add to the bank. So where this becomes an issue, is, let's say you get a pyroblast DoT crit for 3000. Not bad eh? So, if we add that to ignite, you add 1200 damage to the ignite bank.Now, what happens if, .4 seconds later, your fireball crits for 28k. What is SUPPOSED to happen is that the game SHOULD add 11,200 damage to your ignite bank. HOWEVER (using caps cuz i can't italicize), the server does NOT add that to your ignite bank, because you just had a crit .4 seconds ago. This is called "munching." Since my effective critical strike at the end of wrath was something like 70%, I could easily see it. I actually took that log of that last Saurfang fight I did, and I sampled the first 30 seconds of it. I made a whole chart and everything, where I calculated what should have been in my ignite bank, and what was actually output in the ignite dot. At the end of 30 seconds, I had lost about 60k damage.I haven't bothered to do this since, but the mechanics of the game have not changed (this was a raid in 4.03, just slightly before cata dropped - but the mechanics of how ignite works have not changed at all). The internal cooldown of ignite is somewhere between 1 and 2 seconds. And with all the dots that fire mages have, that means there is a good chance that 30k fireball or pyroblast crit you just nailed the raid boss with didn't refresh ignite and get added to your ignite bank, because your smaller living bomb or pyroblast dot was added instead.Like I said, it's a bit complicated, but I hope that helps.
1-30-2011 @ 10:05AM
It does not proc from dots.That is however, fixed in next patch.
1-30-2011 @ 9:12PM
Ice, it does proc from dots. Ignite procs from any fire damage crit, including DoTs. This is actually a BAD thing though, because your fireball and pyroblast crits can get munched by all those dots that are popping and refreshing ignite.If you don't believe me, I went to WoL and picked a random mage in the top 200 of the Argolath encounter. The first damage that shows up is a living bomb DoT tick (not the explosion, but the tick), that crit for 11426. Before his next crit, an Ignite tick shows up for 2913 (it's higher than the expected 20% which would be 2285 because of mastery, which does affect ignite).Now, I'm hoping this doesn't get overly mathy for everyone, but look at this sequence right here, which shows ignite munching I think to a T:[23:56:50.029] Tirsten Combustion Argaloth *16084*[23:56:50.284] Tirsten Living Bomb Argaloth *8476*[23:56:50.629] Tirsten begins to cast Fireball[23:56:50.844] Tirsten Combustion Argaloth 8062[23:56:51.661] Tirsten Fireball Argaloth 14972[23:56:51.661] Tirsten Combustion Argaloth *16084*[23:56:52.573] Tirsten Pyroblast! Argaloth 1547[23:56:52.597] Tirsten Combustion Argaloth *16084*[23:56:52.785] Tirsten begins to cast Fireball[23:56:52.785] Tirsten Living Bomb Argaloth *8476*[23:56:53.045] Tirsten Ignite Argaloth 2162 ------------------- Ignite[23:56:53.362] Tirsten Combustion Argaloth 8062[23:56:53.669] Tirsten Fireball Argaloth *29577*[23:56:54.234] Tirsten Combustion Argaloth *16084*[23:56:55.013] Tirsten begins to cast Fireball[23:56:55.013] Tirsten Pyroblast! Argaloth *3085*[23:56:55.013] Tirsten Combustion Argaloth *16084*[23:56:55.044] Tirsten Ignite Argaloth 2161 -------------------- IgniteIn a span of 5 seconds, we have 9 separate critical strike hits. But as you can see, the damage of Ignite is the same (2161 and 2162 can be considered the same from rounding up and down). The next ignite tick in this log is this:[23:56:57.044] Tirsten Ignite Argaloth 1965Which means that all of the combustion plus that 30k fireball crit got munched, likely by that pyroblast dot crit you see for 3085. Had the fireball crit been added instead, that next ignite tick would have been closer to 6000, not the 1965 that showed up. And had ALL of those crits been added, we would have seen closer to 18,000 damage per ignite tick added.Because of munching, this guy lost a total of 52k ignite damage (before mastery) in this sequence.These numbers are reproducible, and you can look at any mage's log on a single target encounter and find the same phenomenon.If you understand what I'm saying, you are probably as sick to your stomach as I was when I looked at how much damage is being lost by ignite munching.
1-30-2011 @ 9:17PM
Apology for the wall of text, there just isn't a tl;dr way of describing munching. I just wanted to add one thing, regarding the trinket:I don't know if http://www.wowhead.com/item=62047/darkmoon-card-volcano can proc ignite, but there is a very easy way to find out. In your fire spec, just spam cast ice lance or frostbolt on a dummy. When it procs, if it crits, you should be able to see ignite or not.
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