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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria news"The Exalted" title requirement change reverted
by Michael Sacco 
Feb 12th 2011 at 12:18AM
Right now, the devs are unsure as to whether the change can be applied with a hotfix, but they're going to attempt one and see if it sticks. If a patch is necessary, they'll let us know. There's some additional interesting information in the blue post, including the technical reasons why Blizzard couldn't grandfather the title to those who achieved it prior to 4.0.6. Full text is after the cut.
The Exalted TitleRecently we changed 'the Exalted' title to require 50 exalted titles up from 40, which meant those that had achieved it were now asked to get 10 more reputations to gain the title back. We felt this kept the title as a difficult reward given the additional reputations introduced with Cataclysm, and also avoided the problem of achievement inflation as the game continues to grow, devaluing the reward.
We didn't let people know beforehand that we were making this change. A pretty cut and dry error on our part. We take full responsibility for not communicating the change properly, and apologize for the frustration it added to the situation. Unfortunately, that frustration in some people's cases went to an extreme. Over the past couple days we've handed out innumerable suspensions to people who were unable to stay within the forum code of conduct while posting about this change. We of course understand passions can run hot, but some of the violations were extreme enough to remove people's posting privileges permanently. It's unfortunate because rational, calm, and constructive posting is the type of feedback that's taken, discussed, and can help encourage real change. For those that were able to adhere to those posting ideals, we truly thank you for your efforts in keeping your cool.
We took your constructive posts and points, and after discussing the change for quite a while with the designers, the decision has been made to move 'the Exalted' title back to require 40 exalted reputations. We're going to attempt this change with a hotfix, but are unsure at this time if it will be able to be applied through a hotfix. It's possible that a client patch will be required. (We'll let you know if it does.)
The 45 and 50 exalted reputation achievements will continue to exist, but for the time being won't provide anything beyond achievement points. As some have questioned why the title isn't grandfathered like 'the Loremaster' or 'the Explorer' titles, these function differently mechanically. While their requirements have changed, the actual achievement is the same. There's no tech currently that allows us to give a title for an achievement and then move that title to a different achievement altogether and have people keep them. We are however working on such a technology that will allow players to keep items or titles associated with achievements even if we decide to change that criteria. So, say if we eventually decide to move 'the Exalted' title to an achievement which requires 60 reputations in the next expansion (just as an example), players who already earned the title at 40 reputations will get to keep the title when the criteria changes. This technology would allow us to let players keep titles or items they've already earned, while ensuring we don't get stuck in a position where we have to continually generate new rewards just so those who earned them originally don't lose them.
Thanks again for your feedback.
We didn't let people know beforehand that we were making this change. A pretty cut and dry error on our part. We take full responsibility for not communicating the change properly, and apologize for the frustration it added to the situation. Unfortunately, that frustration in some people's cases went to an extreme. Over the past couple days we've handed out innumerable suspensions to people who were unable to stay within the forum code of conduct while posting about this change. We of course understand passions can run hot, but some of the violations were extreme enough to remove people's posting privileges permanently. It's unfortunate because rational, calm, and constructive posting is the type of feedback that's taken, discussed, and can help encourage real change. For those that were able to adhere to those posting ideals, we truly thank you for your efforts in keeping your cool.
We took your constructive posts and points, and after discussing the change for quite a while with the designers, the decision has been made to move 'the Exalted' title back to require 40 exalted reputations. We're going to attempt this change with a hotfix, but are unsure at this time if it will be able to be applied through a hotfix. It's possible that a client patch will be required. (We'll let you know if it does.)
The 45 and 50 exalted reputation achievements will continue to exist, but for the time being won't provide anything beyond achievement points. As some have questioned why the title isn't grandfathered like 'the Loremaster' or 'the Explorer' titles, these function differently mechanically. While their requirements have changed, the actual achievement is the same. There's no tech currently that allows us to give a title for an achievement and then move that title to a different achievement altogether and have people keep them. We are however working on such a technology that will allow players to keep items or titles associated with achievements even if we decide to change that criteria. So, say if we eventually decide to move 'the Exalted' title to an achievement which requires 60 reputations in the next expansion (just as an example), players who already earned the title at 40 reputations will get to keep the title when the criteria changes. This technology would allow us to let players keep titles or items they've already earned, while ensuring we don't get stuck in a position where we have to continually generate new rewards just so those who earned them originally don't lose them.
Thanks again for your feedback.
World of Warcraft: Cataclysm has destroyed Azeroth as we know it; nothing is the same! In WoW Insider's Guide to Cataclysm, you can find out everything you need to know about WoW's third expansion, from leveling up a new goblin or worgen to breaking news and strategies on endgame play.Filed under: News items
Reader Comments (Page 3 of 7)
Eccentor Feb 12th 2011 3:51PM
"We are however working on such a technology"
How about instead of spending resources developing new tech, just do what you did with Loremaster and Explorer: change the existing achievement's requirements. Something like "Reach exalted status with 85% of worldwide factions" (or whatever % you decide) would make it dynamic rather than static, and ought to make most everyone happy as long as it can't be "un-achieved".
Wheighty Feb 12th 2011 12:33AM
I'm more of the opinion of the initial response from Blizzard. Cataclysm brought 5 new factions and nerfed a lot of the older grinds.
Seems like some people are allergic to effort in this game sometimes.
MysticalOS Feb 12th 2011 12:47AM
cataclysm actually brought 7 new factions, just at launch, the increase of 10 though and not 7 is sensible considering there will be without a doubt new factions in 4.1 4.2 and 4.3 etc continuing to trivialize 40, which honestly is trivial. just as wrath added new ones or unlocked existing ones like silver covenant. who knows we could have "ragnaros offensive" factionin 4.1 or something, companying the new hyjal dailies and raid coming in that patch.
I earned it when 40 took actual work. but now having 54 exalted factions, the idea of others still earning it with 40 annoys me, yes poeple who previous earned it should keep it if they earned it PRIOR to cata. But i think anyone that earned it in cata doesnt deserve it unless they have 50. That's how i feel about it. Blizz clearly demonstrated they feel same way, they didn't want players earning it at 40 anymore, but mechnically couldn't reserve the title to those who earned it pre cata do to the lack of technologies to do that. But i still think they should have stuck to their guns, cause if anyone earned exalted when 40 was actually hard, i'm quite certain they already have 50 now. 5 people in my guild got exalted title and 50 exalted spam when they logged in patch day, and it was the people who i know for sure all earned exalted in wrath. not one person lost exalted who got it in wrath. Only people who happened to get it using the 7 cata reps. I honestly bet 90% of the complainers were those people.
LynMars Feb 12th 2011 1:03AM
There were also new factions at the end of Wrath; I had Exalted before Ashen Verdict was an option. They've removed a few reps, and made some easier to level.
The other problem was idea of losing the title every time a new expac came in; I haven't had the time yet to finish getting my 50 reps. It'll happen, but life first. But if earning a title to lose it, then earn it again, then lose it, every time, like a yo-yo, it'd be annoying. Especially since no one else really deals with it (Arena gets a new adjective every time!).
The people who got the title at 40 slogged to get there; some stopped, some kept going because they like seeing those bars filled with green. I'm like many, who are somewhere in the middle, limited by silly things like time. For a lot of us, getting to 50 reps, or 60, is going to happen anyway, eventually.
I do think a lot of the folks who earned it at 40 are good with the idea of raising the reqs to 50 now; it should still be hard, darnit! No one had a problem with that part. Losing the title that was a struggle to get THEN, if you didn't happen to have the time NOW, with no warning or reasoning, that was the frustration for many that I saw and spoke with.
Scunosi Feb 12th 2011 1:18AM
If I didn't have it I'd be happy to do 50 to get it.
The problem is from people who got 40 when 40 was the hard one, and then had that achievement removed. People who got "Hand of A'dal" didn't have it removed in Wrath when speed-running those instances was easier, so like people argued, it set up an ugly precedent.
Drakkenfyre Feb 12th 2011 1:42AM
The point is they didn't announce this change at all, pulled an Achievement and a title from people (something they have NEVER done before, with normal Achievements. Only PVP titles) then told people who complained "Sorry, we're changing it, deal with it."
It also adds in the idea of a rolling Achievement. What if you accomplished something, say clearing all the dungeons, and got a title for it? Then another expansion comes out, and they remove the Achievement and title from you until you complete all the new ones. Or you got a mount for an Achievement, then the next expansion, they add more to it, and pull the mount from you until you do it again?
xoxotl Feb 12th 2011 12:34AM
While I never had the title (grinding rep is about as exciting for me as watching grass grow) I'm glad that Blizzard stepped back from this. Not only did it rob players of hard-earned recognition, it also set a bad precedent.
gideon.alsierra Feb 12th 2011 2:49PM
They set a worse precedent by showing that they will cave on decisions if enough people QQ about it. Even if those whiners then take it to extremes by hijacking other legitimate threads and making personal attacks - they can still get their way.
Neirin Feb 12th 2011 12:42AM
I think they're doing the right thing by giving the title back, but I also totally understand where they're coming from on this issue. 40 exalted reputations isn't very hard currently, particularly for achievement junkies - the people most likely to have complained in the first place. It's really too bad they couldn't grandfather the title, because that really looks like it would be the only way to satisfy both sides.
The real problem here, I think, was the lack of communication. We saw it happen with the naxx proto drakes to a much larger extent, but this is a good reminder for blizz to have someone that's in charge of making sure that the patch notes are actually complete and changes that require time for people to adjust to should be announced in time for people to adjust to and/or debate them rather than letting the changes come out of nowhere.
I'd like to point at the controversy surrounding "The Insane" right before cata where blizz announced it would be unobtainable, but because there was adequate time for people to give feedback and debate the change, blizz left it in, satisfying the players, but modified is slightly (removal of Shen'dralar) to satisfy the dev team. Communication done right saves lives (and forum bans).
Neirin Feb 12th 2011 12:47AM
I think that last paragraph technically works grammatically, but it's really poorly written. I'm so sorry for my bad use of punctuation.
Matthijs Winnink Feb 12th 2011 12:44AM
Yes, Happy to see it come back to us, but more important issue: Keymaster achievement...please give it back to us. Pretty please? Sugar on top?
Jason Feb 12th 2011 12:47AM
While I understand the frustration of this entire issue, I have to agree with what Bashiok said about forum users, albeit he said it much more politely than I would've. It seems as though whenever players may not like a change to the game, they often take it personally and overreact. I am surprised players weren't grandfathered in as wa done with Loremaster, but to be honest, I hit 50 Exalted reputations after just two Cataclysm reps.
I guess the whole thing just reminds me of a kid in the grocery store who whines until he gets the candy at the checkout.
Neirin Feb 12th 2011 12:49AM
But they have the KING SIZE Reese's by the checkout stand.
thpthpthp1 Feb 12th 2011 2:26AM
You can have the fun size and be happy about it!
danawhitaker Feb 12th 2011 2:53AM
Not so much. It's more like the kid who's told if they behave during the shopping trip they'll get a treat, then their parents buy them the treat, then take it away and say, "But you have to behave on the next shopping trip too, didn't I tell you that?"
40 exalted factions was the first (and only) thing I really worked on on my main for about six months after I hit 80. I got it back in 2009. I did Shen'dralar to get it. It was my pride and joy, next to Loremaster. Having it stripped from me was not an enjoyable experience. I'm at 49/50 right now, I know I was very close to getting it back, but I don't like the precedent it set that achievements/titles could continually be taken away when something new comes out. At some point, you wonder why you're bothering to even work at an achievement, because you feel like your progress might just disappear. That's not a good way to keep people grinding.
Utakata Feb 12th 2011 12:49AM
Michael Sacco wrote inpart:
"...saying that while they were disappointed that it resulted in so many forum code of conduct violations.."
I suspect the other shoe being, there was like a few subscription cancellations as well over this. So the swords where likely swinging both ways.
...but either way, I am glad they wisely returned it backed to 40. The technical information about why they couldn't of grandfather'd it would of been helpful with the discourse when they first confirmed this issue. This is the first time many of us...even all of us ever heard of this. Perhaps the passions would of not been so heated if they layed those cards of the table at first. It is a reasonable explanation.
But's it's done. They've acknowledged and apologized for the error and retracted their original descion. It's the least I could ask of them.
adaystrom Feb 12th 2011 2:26AM
Really people leaving over a title I doubt it.. I think its more over trying to lower bitching and moaning on ever subject on the boards..
Utakata Feb 12th 2011 3:04AM
Of coarse, no one in their right mind would leave over a title. I know I wouldn't.
But an accomplishment they're originally worked very hard to get, that was unceremoniously stripped from them in a stealth nerf, for dubious reasons that are outside of cheating and bug roll backs. And then told to put a sock it in by the game company after voicing their concerns about it or face dire consequences. Players affected at this point are showing considerable restraint if they're not hitting the unsub button. Especially those who have other issues with Blizz...
...but so you know, perspective is eveything. Just saying.
Blayze Feb 12th 2011 5:52AM
Then again, more than a few people would have looked at this change, seen the reply of "tough, we're gonna do it" and thought to themselves "what else are they going to remove from me and make me re-earn?" and came to the conclusion that there was even less reason than before for them to continue paying good money for this game.
LynMars Feb 12th 2011 12:53AM
People who earned it in Wrath at 40 are among the first to say it is way too easy now with the rep grind changes. Still takes time, yeah, but also way easier. An update to the requirements was expected and welcomed. Losing what they'd worked for wasn't, when no one else lost their rewards due to updated content (well, besides keymaster; I don't know why that's not a Feat of Strength yet either, after I got all those blasted things on the way to rep grinding...).
If they had communicated the technology limitation issue beforehand, the backlash wouldn't have been nearly so bad, I think. There still would have been some shouting, but not nearly the number of bannings (those folks have no one to blame but themselves though). People could have offered ideas and feedback, and the whole change/change back could have been avoided.
It was bad customer service, really, in both the failed communication and then the apparent blow off after. I don't know if it's enough for those who canceled their subs over this to regain trust and enjoyment (when other things have also likely led to such a choice), but it helps some of the players.
I do hope they figure out how to make the reward shift with new requirements while letting those who earned the title when it was still a time-consuming grind keep what they have. And that next time, they are more clear on what and how they're changing those rewards, instead of blindsiding players.