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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsBioWare says WoW is the touchstone for Star Wars: The Old Republic
by Mathew McCurley 
Feb 14th 2011 at 8:00PM
Zeschuk said: "It [World of Warcraft] is a touchstone. It has established standards, it's established how you play an MMO. Every MMO that comes out, I play and look at it. And if they break any of the WoW rules, in my book that's pretty dumb."
What's interesting is how Zeschuk, sitting with Mike Morhaime at the keynote panel, gave WoW the reverence it deserves as the leading industry standard in MMO gaming. Instead of couching his remarks about the specific game he was in the process of making, he discussed how players expect a set of established standards that WoW has provided. Be it a sense of completion of polish, a game mechanic, core concepts, or even art direction and fluidity of art theme, World of Warcraft set the bar very high for other game developers and even Blizzard itself.
We know WoW is big, but I think we sometimes forget how important it is as well. Greg Zeschuk and the rest of the video game industry know this and acknowledge that breaking some clear-cut rules is a big mistake.
Filed under: Blizzard
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
jfofla Feb 14th 2011 8:10PM
To those looking for something different...
DOH!
Thyago Feb 15th 2011 8:28AM
Who the hell needs something different? I want an exact copy of my Worgen Warrior, but with a dual lightsaber and force powers!
xyna Feb 14th 2011 8:11PM
Bioware you are doing it wrong...
Kia Feb 14th 2011 8:11PM
This...sounds like complete and utter idiocy to me, and really knocks my respect down for Bioware a few notches. The MMOs I am most looking forward to are TERA and Guild Wars 2, both games that are almost nothing like WoW.
Conversely, the MMO I've recently found most dull is Rift, which is nothing but the same old same old with an admittedly much, much better class system.
Now, don't get me wrong. WoW does a lot of things right, and a lot of things that developers would do well to implement in their games. But this idea that it is the be-all end-all of the genre is extremely short-sighted and makes me really not look forward to TOR much anymore.
Ringo Flinthammer Feb 14th 2011 8:17PM
He didn't really say what you're objecting to, though. He's saying that there are MILLIONS of consumers out there whose expectations are based on WoW, and that failing to deliver basic expectations of how these games work -- as opposed to specific gameplay elements -- is a dumb idea that will hurt your product.
It's hard to argue that he's wrong. The things that kill highly touted MMOs are the things they don't do that WoW had conditioned people to expect: content at every level, the ability to play in short bursts, an availability of both hardcore and casual content, a lack of show-stopping bugs, the ability to play it on a wide variety of games.
The reasons that Age of Conan, Warhammer and every other "WoW-killer" didn't is because of a failure to live up to these minimum expectations.
People don't want every MMO to be WoW. They just want, realistically or not, for every game to treat the player at least as well as Blizzard does, in return for their dollar.
ToyChristopher Feb 14th 2011 8:26PM
I really look forward to both of those also. We already have wow, and wow is actually a pretty old game. MMOs need some new ideas and I applaud games that take a new direction.
ToyChristopher Feb 14th 2011 8:33PM
"It's hard to argue that he's wrong. The things that kill highly touted MMOs are the things they don't do that WoW had conditioned people to expect: content at every level, the ability to play in short bursts, an availability of both hardcore and casual content, a lack of show-stopping bugs, the ability to play it on a wide variety of games."
That's kind of criteria for any game, not just an mmo and wow wasn't even the first to do that. Many of the games like Aion, Warhammer, the upcoming Rift, City of Heroes, etc... all meet those criteria. Giving people what they expect I guess is one way to win some people over but I'm not sure how many people really want to play Star Wars themed wow, when they already have so much invested in wow itself.
Saisen Feb 14th 2011 8:58PM
reading comprehension, you missed the point entirely
Loopy Garou Feb 14th 2011 9:58PM
I don't think the OP missed the point at all. According to the version of this story over on Massively, Zeschuk was asked whether SWTOR is a WoW clone. This has become a increasing concern in the MMO blogosphere, not because Bioware simply embraces Blizzard's high quality standards and populist approach to game design, but because SWTOR's gameplay seems entirely WoW-derivative to a lot of folks who have played it. People are questioning whether Bioware's focus on story and voiceover will be enough if the gameplay itself offers little or no innovation.
That's why he was asked about it. If that's not what his answer was meant to address, he should've been more clear. As it stands, "established standards" including "how you play an MMO" could mean just about anything.
Oteo Feb 14th 2011 10:59PM
@Loopy Garou
I read this when it first popped up on Massively, and a lot of the comments thought that Massively took the quote out of context. There's a more in-depth summary of it than Massively posted on Gamespot, which I'll quote:
"Zeschuk began by noting that World of Warcraft remains the touchstone in the industry, and it proves that big games still work. He also said that because of WOW's influence, it is important to maintain the standards that the game established.
That said, Zeschuk noted that anyone who plays Star Wars: The Old Republic will see that it is a BioWare game."
http://www.gamespot.com/events/dice2011/story.html?sid=6298424&tag=latestheadlines;title;1
Merus Feb 15th 2011 12:48AM
The problem with this argument is that Blizzard has had six years to understand and polish their game. There's six years of development here, driven by player feedback. If you make a game which is very much like WoW, and release it, you're not going to be as polished by definition. WoW was very shaky out of the gate, itself. I want to emphasise: the MMOs people are holding up as the Great White Hope -- Rift, TELA, TOR, Guild Wars 2 -- all of these games are going to have issues of some kind when they come out. It's part and parcel of building an MMO.
And so everyone's going to go "this is terrible" and WoW is still there, not going anywhere, with the network effects that come from having lots of players. Launch is the time when you have the best chance to make a good impression, and being a less-good version of WoW is not the way to go about it.
The only way a new MMO can possibly have a chance is to be *different* from WoW. It may not be as polished a game, players will think, but it offers something I can't get anywhere else. That way, players are likely to stick around for long enough for the development team to shore up the most glaring weaknesses, and, if they quit in disgust, more likely to give the game another go later on.
Krisbo Feb 15th 2011 2:22AM
Let's face it: to sit up there on that panel, next to Morhaime, and say anything other than what he said would have been total lunacy.
All due respect.
Jorges Feb 15th 2011 9:09AM
I know what you're saying but it's not what its meant to be understood from this. The main topic here is quality. Everyone knows how polished and top quality WoW is, even WoW haters know this, and most of them hate the fact that very few companies can keep up with the level of quality WoW has and everyone now expects.
Like the author says: "he discussed how players expect a set of established standards that WoW has provided. Be it a sense of completion of polish, a game mechanic, core concepts, or even art direction and fluidity of art theme, World of Warcraft set the bar very high for other game developers and even Blizzard itself."
The big problem is, like you said, when these standards lead to cloning WoW (Runes of Magic and RIFT comes to mind), even if they have their unique systems (like RIFT's Soul System). THAT is not a good a idea, and this is where I think NCSoft stands apart with Guildwars 2. NCSoft is a smaller company than Blizzard, but they have pretty high standars too and a great degree of polish. Their storytelling is pretty good and character design is amazing. They can not only live to the high standards established by WoW, but they're also bringing in (so far) something completely new. THIS is a good idea, and NOT cloning WoW.
Every site out there (except this one, thank god) is reporting "BioWare admits that TOR is a WoW Clone"... that's not a good idea either.
Loopy Garou Feb 15th 2011 10:01AM
@Oteo - Thanks for the link. It does give a little more context to the conversation. If he's really just talking about quality standards and broad design philosophy, I certainly agree with him on that subject.
But ... the growing perception that SWTOR is too WoW-derivative isn't just coming from this quote, it's mostly coming from people who have played the game at shows and such. I just wish Bioware would do something to address that concern. Seems like a lot of people are gradually losing interest in SWTOR as time goes on, and I think this is the main reason.
Fingal Feb 14th 2011 8:16PM
If they're going to make the game essentially WoW, they should let me port my toon!
totemdeath Feb 14th 2011 11:30PM
Tauren JEDI's FTW
Vespene -GameTrailers- Feb 14th 2011 8:17PM
Mike was probably laughing hysterically as he listened to this, thinking on how different Titan is going to be from WoW.
Ringo Flinthammer Feb 14th 2011 8:19PM
Titan isn't going to include content for multiple types of players, a great deal of content at all levels at launch, content that works without a huge amount of players to establish a critical mass for basic elements of the game and stable servers?
Because I'm pretty sure Blizzard understands how to give everyone their $50 worth, which plenty of MMO developers don't seem to get. That's all Zeschuk was saying.
ToyChristopher Feb 14th 2011 8:35PM
Plenty of mmo devlopers are doing just fine. Did they run wow out of business? No. Are they a commercial success and have people playing their game? Yes they do. You don't have to run wow out of business to have a successful, fun mmo.
aramis Feb 15th 2011 3:16AM
"You don't have to run wow out of business to have a successful, fun mmo. "
That's EXACTLY what I keep saying when new MMOs are touted as the "WoW-Killer". I'm like, why do you even bother? If you set out to gank WoW customers and bring down WoW, you've failed from the start.
Which is why I think it's funny that Rift keeps alluding to Azeroth in its ad campaigns. A good game will stand on its own without much comparison. Basic elements of an MMO should be the limit to comparison, while the story, art direction, and gameplay should be unique to the experience you're trying to give your customers. If you're constantly saying "We're WoW, but better," in my mind, you're not, and you probably will never be.
Just do your own thing, and we'll see if we like it. I don't know why that's so hard for MMO developers to keep in their mind. Zeschuk acknowledges WoW's influence, but doesn't go spouting off as saying "yeah, this game will one-up what WoW players are currently getting in 'their' game". For one, it's bold in that he must really think SWTOR is shaping up to be it's own force, and two, it's just good business practice to formally acknowledge the leader, while secretly hoping your game does at least equal the amount of business.
In any case, I don't think SWTOR is trying to be a WoW-killer, which is a great sign.