Breakfast Topic: What makes a great raid leader?
by Aiden James Kosciesza 
Feb 20th 2011 at 8:00AM
Raids are a tricky thing. You have to have good tanking, healing, and DPS in the right proportions, people who listen and prepare and pay attention. You have to get those people online and motivated at the same time, and you have to be able to learn from your mistakes and change your strategy for the better. Most important of all, I think, you need a great raid leader.
When I first joined a raiding guild in BC, I was thrilled with the raid leader. He was Australian, so it was great listening to his accent over Ventrilo. I remember him as being very cool-headed and completely on top of what was going on each pull. If we wiped, he'd tell us what had gone wrong and what we were going to do to fix it, and he led us to many victories. He played a tank, a tiny gnome warrior with a shield nearly as big as he was, but he had alts of almost every class and he knew all their abilities perfectly. When he eventually decided to leave WoW due to real-life issues just at the start of Ulduar, the guild tried to go on without him, but it just wasn't the same. I eventually left and went through a few guilds with mediocre raid leaders before finally founding my own. Now I'm once again lucky enough to have a great raid leader, a paladin tank who studies the fights, analyzes the data, keeps his cool and quarterbacks our raids to victory.
What are the qualities that you look for in a great raid leader? Do you need someone calm and relaxed, or does a fiery raid leader push your performance to the next level? Is raid role (tank, healer, DPS) a factor in a leader's quality?
Filed under: Breakfast Topics, Guest Posts
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 4)
hbias Feb 20th 2011 8:09AM
A strong liver.
CaryEverett Feb 20th 2011 8:09AM
Probably my favorite raid leader was this guy who was a tour director IRL. And he ran raids like that too.
As an example, "stack on the tank" becomes, "Keep your hands and legs inside the tank at all times"
Was fucking hilarious, and kept people from falling asleep while giving out instructions.
WaterRouge Feb 20th 2011 8:16AM
In my opinion it completely depends on the situation. A 10man PuG? Then a good raid leader is someone patient enough to recruit worthwhile raid members (meaning they're not known trolls/griefers) and the patience enough to commit through wipes and explain what needs to be done.
A 10/25man easy mode guild run with 60% or more of the raid being from the guild? Someone who knows the fights, and has run them, along with one who knows the strengths and weaknesses of each class. NOT just what class/spec has the highest DPS this patch. Easier said than done I assure you, I probably wouldn't have this knowledge if I didn't level each class (and played with each spec on the PTR) to/past Northrend. Patience is of course also required but not as much so because this is a mostly guild run so most drama you'd find in a PuG won't prevail here.
25man Hard Mode guild run? I honestly wouldn't know because I'm not in such situations. I feel like the above, along with EXTENSIVE knowledge of the fights, a detailed system for that raid, and some kind of pre-meditation would be required.
Most importantly I'd say is patience. The rest is situational.
WaterRouge Feb 20th 2011 8:19AM
Also, I forgot to mention this in my first comment but I feel like a raid leader NOT in the dps role is simply more suited for the job. Maybe it's because I never really got into raids on one of my DPS toons (probably because I honestly didn't do the greatest dps) but whenever I led or someone else led I just felt...right if they were the tank or healer. I guess it's because they have noticeably more responsibility and thus have a higher degree of interest in the overall success, not just winning the roll on that one trinket.
Winter Feb 20th 2011 9:24AM
I've seen fine RLs from DPS classes, hunters and mages who did great. Standing at range, they can watch the whole field of battle with greater ease than some tanks whose screen might be full of angry boss, or healers getting tunnelvision keeping everyone up.
Razzanor Feb 20th 2011 8:18AM
No matter how a raid leader says it, they need to be able to tell themselves and the other members that they suck, why they suck, and when they suck. Raid leaders need to view situations from a neutral eye; you can *never* be a successful raid leader if you have any type of relationship with any member of the raid that would stop you from booting and replacing them.
Ultimately, raid leaders need to be dictators. They need to be the ones to make decisions, and they need to possess the charisma to compellingly convince their underlings that their word is *the* word. A democracy is not a successful raid. Any raid member who is unwilling to accept the dictator's decision is hindering the group's progress as a whole.
...unless, of course, your goal is just to have fun with your friends rather than legitimately try to kill bosses. In that case, the "raid leader" holds no power, as he is simply the first person to start the invites.
Scard Feb 20th 2011 9:19AM
When I first started raiding back in the days of Kara, I was happy to be raiding at all. Our raid leader was a dictator. He screamed, yelled, and threw tantrums at people in vent and in chat. Loot mid-fight during trash pulls? Booted from the raid. He held people to one set of rules and lived by a completely different set himself. Most of us sucked it up, as we felt lucky to be raiding at all. There were more than a few who raid quit and /gquit on the spot. I wish I had done the same sooner than I did.
I have since moved on to much greener pastures. I found you can "have fun with your friends" and "legitimately try to kill bosses" at the same time. And it doesn't take a dictator to have both. I just requires the leader to earn your respect, both as a leader and as a person, and to give that respect in return. That way if he messes up, we can call him on it and not expect a diatribe about how it really wasn't his fault. If we mess up, he can call us out and we feel motivated to do better. In Wrath we were bleeding edge as basically a 10-man strict (one raider liked to do 25s on the side). In Cata, we've downed nearly all the current raid bosses. We have a hell of a lot of fun to boot.
Winter Feb 20th 2011 9:27AM
"Beatings will continue until morale improves" is not a winning strategy in the real world or in WoW. Leaders are those who make people WANT to succeed, intrinsically, and because they don't want to disappoint the team or their leader. Taking down bosses doesn't require being pushed around, belittled, and screamed at.
Adoisin Feb 20th 2011 11:14AM
A successful raid usually consists of 10 or 25 people working together, under the direction of the raid leader. It does not consist of the raid leader plus 9 or 24 morons that the leader berates, scolds, ridicules, and basically drags along for *his* boss kill. A decent raid leader remembers that there are actual people behind all the toons in the raid. Screaming put downs is not going to accomplish anything.
Instead of telling someone how badly they suck in front of the entire raid, why not take the chance to talk to them after, and explain the problem. Like "You seem to be having a hard time moving out of gross stuff on the ground, is there anything you think we can do to help the situation?" It may be something as simple as making an adjustment in the video settings, to be able to see the ground effects better. Screaming "you suck" at them won't get that fixed, and odds are you will lose what could be one of your top raiders.
TL; DR:
A good leader solves problems and accepts he isn't perfect either. A bad leader screams "you suck" and blames everyone else except himself.
Razzanor Feb 20th 2011 12:15PM
I don't know where in my original response I insinuated that a raid leader should be a raging bastard, nor where I suggested that everyone should ignore the raid leader's mistakes.
In fact, I do believe that I specifically stated, "they need to be able to tell THEMSELVES and the other members that they suck, why they suck, and when they suck". I also said, "they need to be the ones to make decisions, and they need to possess the CHARISMA to compellingly convince their underlings that their word is *the* word".
Note the CAPS. Please don't cherry-pick bits and pieces of what I stated to make it seem like I'm actually saying the complete opposite.
pr1me Feb 20th 2011 1:31PM
@Razzanor
You speak in absolutes and the tone of your OP certainly suggests a very specific personality type is required for the role. IME, the "dictator" raid leader is quite often a raging bastard. You don't generally get to be a dictator if that's not the case. The only raid groups I've seen which require that kind of leadership are either full of kids or trade chat trolls, and they're not going to be killing too many bosses anyway.
Ianmis Feb 20th 2011 1:36PM
@ Razz,
Not so much what you said as the way you said it. It may seem that "point blank" comments to people is the best way, but some trips are more fun when taking the "scenic" route. ;) I do understand what you are saying but if I may be so bold, you do not seem to have the "charisma" to make your "word" convince people that a leader must be a dictator. Please understand that I am not so much criticizing you as just trying to explain why people down voted you.
p.s. I didn't vote either way. ;)
Neuropox Feb 20th 2011 4:20PM
The point of correction: Reconciliation.
If i have to point out that someone did something wrong, i do it in a way that brings them back into our community of 9/24 other players w/o making them feel less about themselves. Yes they did something that needed to be corrected, but in the end i want them to have a good time with the rest of us. Yes sometimes it is necessary to remove someone for the whole of a community, but generally i try to fix it before wimping out and simply removing them.
Dustballs Feb 21st 2011 6:42AM
I agree with you. Not that the RL should be a raging basterd, but it is hard to make objective choices when there are RL friends/relatives/partners in the raid. So you need a basic structure on how to handle those situations.
Furthermore, the RL should be a bit of a dictator, in respect to the route you'll be taking as a raid. There is one road to follow and the raidleader tells you which road that is. Also in respect to how you handle your class. As long as you are good enough to also see this about yourself.
All in all, you are right, although you could have put it in less harsh words, that it is based on rules which apply to everybody, including the RL. And there is always room for discussion, as long as it is after the raid.
If you read between the lines to what Razz is actually saying, it makes a lot of sense. Nobody wants a raging RL, nobody wants to be belittled, but that is not what Razz is saying.
Garthix Feb 20th 2011 8:23AM
For me it's how you pass on information and handle people who might need a little more help
for instance I consider myself a good raider I read up on encounters well in advance and can usually tell why we wipe in an encounter
however I'm rubbish at telling people that info without it sounding like I think I know better than everyone so I pass the info to the raid leader who then puts in a way people will follow
exogenesis. Feb 20th 2011 8:23AM
I prefer the calm raid leaders. Our guild's original leader was very hot headed. Nice guy an' all, and brilliant at giving out tactics, but once we started wiping, he'd get more and more volatile, and eventually would start snapping at everyone for every little thing while his fiance tried to salvage the situation. His attitude as raids progressed through Ulduar and ICC worsened, and led to many people leaving the raid in order to avoid his ire. Those people usually got ragekicked from the guild as well. Very hot headed. He was a great leader when he was calm, but he degraded into the raid leader from hell once fights slid downhill.
Our current leader is a lot better. He's calm, helpful, and always has friendly advice for any tank, healer or DPS who needs it. He might not know how to play every class, but he does his research. He stays cool when we end up wiping for the sixth time, and never has a stern word to say to anyone unless it's someone's silly fault that everyone is dying. The guild enjoys raiding with him. He's also got a very classically upper class English accent, which is hilarious to listen to on Vent, and thus, also a plus!
psycho.knight Feb 20th 2011 2:43PM
Has to be very comfortable talking energeticaly and provide comic relief while keeping a cool head when we whipe. I couldn't do it
Windhorn Feb 20th 2011 8:36AM
Some one who isn't biased to one of the other members. I was raiding with the raid leader and at the start they said I could have the mount that dropped, no one had any objections, but when we got done, he gave the mount to one of his IRL "friends" who was also in the raid "because he asked" and he didn't know me IRL.
They lost a pretty good healer. I switched to another guild, and the one I'm in actually keeps their promises.
rmokeefe76 Feb 20th 2011 8:59AM
Aw, did little windthorn not get his mount?
cyanea85 Feb 20th 2011 9:03AM
Yes. That's what he said.
If you're gonna be a sarcastic ass, at least do it in a way that shows creativity.