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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsDrama Mamas: The combustible combination of minors and romance
by Robin Torres 
Mar 4th 2011 at 9:00AM
This week, we tackle a topic that I find rather scary, as a mother of a budding drama queen and gaming geek.
Hi,
This may be way beyond the kind of thing you can help with but my guild has recently suffered a few bits of drama that have revealed a worrying situation and I'm having a hard time working out what to do next.
About a month ago a young girl (mid teens) joined the guild, we don't have a specific age range although as a casual end game guild we expect a certain level of maturity. She didn't interact much with the guild although one guy who helped her out a bit she really latched onto. She wouldn't run heroics unless he was there and they often moved into different vent channels to be alone. After a couple of weeks we had to kick her from the guild as she simply couldn't take criticism. It also turned out that she had recently been pulled out of school due to depression although some of the higher level officers in the guild were speculating on if that was genuine or was an excuse.
So she was kicked, the guy who she had been hanging around with started complaining that she was stalking him, despite several people telling him he should ignore her he kept her on his real friends list. Then one night he got drunk and started harassing a female member of the guild basically acting in the same way he described the girl acting towards him. For some reason he ended up forwarding her an e-mail the girl had sent, she forwarded it onto the guild master and myself and he was quickly booted from the guild.
The reason for the boot was that the letter made it clear that the girl was obsessed with him (to the point of offering her virginity to him), the guy was nearly twice her age so this in itself was worrying. However, the main reason for the boot was the clear indications that he was encouraging it, including her apologizing for the times he said she was ignoring him. At that point we didn't want anything to do with him in the guild.
Since then we know that he is still in close contact with her, they can often be seen doing dailies together for example. The girl has clearly put herself in a very vulnerable position and all the evidence suggests that he is taking advantage of it. I have raised a ticket in game to see if they can contact her parents, I know they play the game but don't have any idea who their characters are but maybe the billing information will help. The ticket appears to have reached the front of the ticket queue and is presumably being passed around internally at blizzard as the estimated response time has said "soon" for over a day.
I'm not from the US so don't actually know what kind of laws or organizations there are for these kinds of situations. I feel it is very important to let her parents know so they can decide how to pursue it, but so far I've not been able to connect her name and e-mail address to anything that might give her parents name or e-mail address.
Any ideas how I can proceed? Or even if I should?
Hope you can help
Powerless To Prevent
Drama Mama Lisa: Powerless, the actions you've taken are entirely reasonable and responsible, given your relationship to the pair involved. That said, I don't think further action would be either reasonable or responsible.Despite the decidedly suspicious appearance of these former guildies' current behavior (somewhat complicated here by the fact that you haven't shared any details about "all the evidence" that you cite), you really have no proof that the guy hasn't decided to fly right and give this girl some friendly support. While I support your effort to contact the girl's parents based on the past warning flags alone, it's important to remember that you really have no idea what the current situation actually is. Nothing good can come from pressing on about a situation in which you're now completely out of the loop.
All that aside, the worst possible thing you can do right now is to create more drama. Please don't do or say anything to anyone involved in game. We all know what happens when circumstances and authority thwarts young love; don't build romantic walls this young lady will feel irresistibly compelled to scale.
While we obviously can't guarantee that Blizzard will act on your in-game petition, we've found that the company's been pretty responsive to situations that pose a real-life danger, especially when minors may be involved. You might try a final contact to Blizzard via telephone, where it might be easier for you to express the gravity of your reservations and more difficult for a rep to gloss over the situation.
Drama Mama Robin: I would like to point out specifically what made your guild's actions both reasonable and responsible, Powerless:
- Actions speak louder than words. You let the behavior of your guildies speak volumes. And you act when their behavior makes other guildies uncomfortable.
- You don't act precipitously. You gather evidence and make rational decisions.
- You went through the proper channels. Contacting a GM was the exact right thing to do. They have the information and the power to at least inform responsible parties, if not authorities.
Everything that Lisa says is correct, so I'm going to turn my attention to readers who are parents. How do we prevent our minor children from putting themselves in danger? We've seen many times before that online relationships can be intense for adults. They can of course be even more so for teens. After all, everything is more intense for teens.
- Ask to meet online friends. You ask to meet their offline friends, right? Since we've established many times that real people are real people no matter how you communicate with them, you should treat online friends the same way you do physical ones.
- Put gaming computers in a central location. Teens have been communicating surreptitiously since the dawn of man, but there's no reason to make it easy on them. You don't need to look over their shoulders every moment they are online, but this will put a damper on inappropriate relationships and behavior.
- Play WoW with your teen. I'm not saying to play together all the time or even that you have to group together. But do play on the same server with overlapping play times on a regular basis. In this week's letter, guildies were able to see the issues in this relationship long before the email was forwarded. You can observe interactions and behavior in the same way, without invading privacy. I wrote a lengthy guide on this subject a year ago, if you'd like to read more.
It's a fine line to walk between allowing children enough personal freedom to grow, while still protecting them from danger. If you are a parent, how are you dealing with protecting your teens online?
Dodge the drama and become that player everyone wants in their group with a little help and insight from the Drama Mamas. Remember, your mama wouldn't want to see your name on any drama. Play nice ... and when in doubt, ask the Drama Mamas at robin@wowinsider.com.
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Drama Mamas
Reader Comments (Page 3 of 4)
Enkylanos Mar 4th 2011 11:50AM
Just to be clear, are you implying that it could be good for a 15 year old girl to sleep with a 30 year old man that she only knows through the internet?
As a 30 year old man, I think I can safely say, "Thank God you *don't* have kids."
Tirrimas Mar 4th 2011 12:12PM
The big key in this situation is the 15-year old is still underage and considered a minor in the US, and is granted certain legal protections.
No, I have NO problem with large age gaps. However, I do have a problem with ANYONE boinking (IRL or virtual) my soon-to-be 16-year old.
Mortenebra Mar 4th 2011 12:47PM
Terms like "cradle robbers" and "cougars" have plagued us for a while and encourage the idea of dating within a certain age limit.
This is a matter of legality. By law, a person under the age of 18 (or 16/17 in some places) is considered a minor and needs to have all sorts of things supervised or signed off by an adult. That also means no naughty-time with anyone who's no longer considered a minor, which includes interactions between, for example, a 17.5yo and a 19yo. The law has all sorts of names and terms for things that happen between a minor and a non-minor. The consequences include jail time and getting their name on a list.
Trust me... All sorts of people raised heck when I was 21 and finishing college when I met my husband via WoW, and he turned out to be 34. That's not the issue at hand here. This is a legal problem that may translate into bigger things.
Besides, can you imagine all of the hype that will follow the headline, "Video game ruins life of teenage girl!!"?
adamjgp Mar 4th 2011 1:12PM
What's the difference between someone who is 17y 364d old and someone who is 18y old? You can't tell me that 1 day is the difference between someone who can care for themselves and someone who cannot. I understand that you have to draw the line somewhere, but the line seems completely arbitrary.
This discussion is on a very slippery slope. If you involve yourself in this girl's life, doesn't that mean that you have to involve yourself in every minor/adult relationship you encounter? How do you choose which ones to involve yourself in and which ones not to involve yourself in?
I agree that notifying a GM so that they can notify the parents' is the appropriate course of action. However, what if the parents don't give a f*&k? Is it then your responsibility to intervene and see to the well being of the child?
There are only so many things that can be done in this situation, and I think Powerless handled it appropriately. The point of this post is to point out that there are many situations similar to this one in the world, and if you feel obligated to involve yourself in one of them, then why don't you feel obligated to involve yourself with all of them?
Again, I'm playing Devil's Advocate here, and I agree with the steps taken to ensure the well-being of the girl, but please realize that there are many situations just like this one that you are not involved in. Does that make you a bad person?
wow Mar 4th 2011 1:30PM
I also don't have a problem with age differences, as long as both parties are adults and can account for themselves. My wife is 11 years younger than I am and we are happy. However, if I ever found out that an adult was seeing my under age daughter, I'd definitely call the authorities and cut off the guys @#$%@# and feed it to crows so he couldn't do it again to another child.
With that being said, I also agree with the Mama's, that Powerless has acted the best he could within his scope and evidence at hand as Guild Leader. As a Guild Leader myself, I have to make decisions based any evidence I had obtained. Luckily, our guild hasn't had problems like these. Being a mainly Social/RP Guild I always ask, if they are underage, if they have their parents consent to join a guild.
Thanks for reading me rant.
Shinanji
Lemons Mar 4th 2011 1:34PM
"if you involve yourself in this girl's life, doesn't that mean that you have to involve yourself in every minor/adult relationship you encounter?"
It was kind of thrown in their face with that e-mail, it would be negligent for them to ignore it.
And I don't run into a whole lot of adult/minor relationships irl or on the game so that really isn't that big of a problem. It's not like I wake up in the morning and look outside and say "shit, another adult/minor relationship...hey! Break it up! Break it up!...don't make me come out there."
bldavis59 Mar 4th 2011 12:02PM
I completely agree with everything lisa and robin said
given the warning signs, i think the guild did the right think by contacting a gm
robin suggested playing wow with your kids, and this is something i support 100%
i met my fiance in wow, and my step-sons play wow as well
but in meeting thier mother in game, i know how fast relationships can change, so i want my sons to be protected and not getting involved in anything until they are mature enough to deal with it
blood and gore? honestly they see much worse on the news most nights
hawt npcs that are scantily clad? again they see the same things on tv, just in commercails
so if i am playing with them, i dont see much problem.
when they do play solo though, they have all of the chat options turned off, and either i or thier mother is around and checks on them
it sickens me to know that there are people that think just because its the internet, they can do whatever they want, to whomever they want.
when ever i hear stories like this, i want to go up to the person taking advantage of the younger one, and ask them if this was irl, and not on the net, would you do this? would you encourage her obbsessing over you?
didnt think so, now pull your head out and realize these are REAL people!
Heavenfury Mar 4th 2011 12:41PM
As the Father Gamer of a teenage gamer-girl, I was glad that I follow Robin's tweets. Great advice!
Heavenfury of Kael'thas
Yada Mar 4th 2011 12:41PM
I protect my children by not letting them play WoW. Seriously. And I've explained to them why I don't want them in the game -- there are just too many sickos and plain old rude people. When they're 21 they can play WoW. Or Titan. Or whatever. As long as they still have real lives and straight-A averages.
Nina Katarina Mar 4th 2011 1:30PM
I think that keeping your kids from playing is a bit short-sighted of you. Playing with and near my daughter has deepened our relationship in many ways, and improved her patience, her language skills, her logical skills, and given us a great reward for good behavior/punishment for bad behavior. She knows my friends, she has a feeling of accomplishment, she has shown me things about the game I never would have noticed.
And she's a great ore farmer. Oops, did I type that out loud?
Saeadame Mar 4th 2011 1:42PM
I'm sort of halfway between both of you. I think playing video games with your child can be fun and beneficial, but I probably wouldn't start off with an online MMO. When they're younger, I would just play a two-player game for the Wii or something. I think I would be okay with them playing WoW at about 10 or 12, but I probably wouldn't let them play unless I'm there for quite a while.
But I don't actually have kids yet, so someone else is probably a better authority.
BubblePriest Mar 4th 2011 5:58PM
@ Saeadame
I'm not a parent either, but I'm wondering what your reasoning is.
I can see some advantages to having an older kid play MMOs. They get the social interaction. I could see how letting them join a low time commitment but high performance raiding guild could actually be good experience for them to learn how to meet other people's expectations in a low risk setting. (After all, getting kicked out of a guild doesn't get brought up in job interviews; getting fired does.)
On the other hand, while console games can be a fun activity together with your kid, the time spent together seems to be the biggest benefit. That and some improved hand-eye coordination and an introduction to common fantasy tropes that is.
Yada Mar 4th 2011 6:09PM
I have many many activities with both of my children, and I play Wii and PS3 with them as far as gaming goes. Warcraft is an "adult" game, and since there is no attempt made to keep creepy predators and sociopaths from the game, my children don't need to be exposed to it.
Oh, and to the original replier -- if you seriously believe that the only way to have a relationship with your children is to play Warcraft with them, then you really need an intervention yourself.
danwaythom Mar 6th 2011 10:47PM
I agree.
I keep my daughter safe from the filthy little boys on the street and on the interwebs which we all know are just a collection of pipes. CRACK pipes are just pipes too! My lovely daughter spends her days chained in safety to a desk in my secret soundproofed dungeon (in case any perverted police hear her screams of happiness) and she will never have to deal with the real world or the consequences of making a decision.
EVER.
Parody-ingly yours
Joseph Fritzle
(cutaia) Mar 4th 2011 1:17PM
Maybe they should call The Police, so they can set up a Sting operation?
No, but seriously, I love The Police, but good lord that music video is awful. If you're not gonna give the drummer any drums, don't give him any drumsticks either.
What were we talking about here again?
Robin Torres Mar 4th 2011 1:29PM
Top three reasons why this video is not awful:
3. Sting is in it.
2. Sting is in almost every scene in it.
1. Sting takes his shirt off at the end.
Saeadame Mar 4th 2011 1:37PM
Definitely agree with Robin's reasons. The video is awesome.
Sunblade Mar 4th 2011 1:19PM
Interesting subject. A while back there was some kick-off in an rp guild about how a new rp'er had reached rank of officer within a couple of weeks or so. Then on the forum screenies appeared of the girl being offered the rank in turn for her female belf toon doing 'sexual favours' for the male troll guild leader. This was followed by screenies of it happening in an instanced location, all posted on the guild forum, albeit briefly before the officers removed them.
Trouble is, this girl was just turned 14 irl and the GL knew this. Her parents (who I know) played wow and although not in the guild, a guildie knew enough to inform them of what had happened. They thought the guild a family-friendly rp guild and their daughter in a safe environment. And yes, the PC was in the front room of the house so that aspect was covered by the parents and as they both work in IT, they had done the talks on online behaviour and other people.
The mother took this up with Blizzard via a ticket, concerned on this GL's behaviour (he was 22 at the time) and although they said they would look into it, there was never any indication that anything happened. In the end she had a talk with the GL himself, who by this time had been demoted to rank of officer within his guild, but still allowed to stay. He promised it was an error of judgement and she had no option but to let it go. Anecdotal evidence shows that he still approaches female players, the older ones know of his reputation and do tell him where to go however.
So, if you do want action then you may have to pursue Blizz, unless things have improved significantly in the past 3 yrs.
BubblePriest Mar 4th 2011 5:38PM
The difference between your example and the original post is that in your example the parents are aware and are presumably requesting punitive action. It makes sense to assume that Blizzard would handle the situations differently.
Lemons Mar 4th 2011 1:19PM
I pretty much knew this article was going to turn into "To Catch a Predator" when I heard the words "girl (mid teens)".