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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsDrama Mamas: Vent troubles vs. That Guy
by Robin Torres 
Mar 25th 2011 at 2:00PM
The above video is not on topic. Anyway, let's talk about That Guy. He's always causing drama. Or is he?
Dear Robin and Lisa,
I recently found myself in an interesting situation: Running our guild second 10 man raid team. Or more accurately, finishing it off with two tanks, a healer and a DPS. Getting the DPS and the healer was fairly easy without going outside the guild or recruiting anyone. And I even convinced one of our officers to be the MT. This afternoon, at the spur of the moment, he (the MT guild officer) formed a Bastion of Twilight raid with most of the second team members in it, including me (shammy healer), along with a tank friend of his. So, we get there, join vent, mine is working fine (this is important) and we start the first pulls, things are going just fine and we get to the first boss. Halfus has 3 drakes available (twilight, slate and time) so after a short discussion in vent, a strategy is decided on and we attack the boss. Three wipes later, they down the boss, my first ever kill on Halfus. I even get this amulet drop which is a huge upgrade for me, so I am happy.
As we progress through the trash to the second boss(s) I notice vent is unusually silent, so I ask if anyone is saying anything in vent, I get a yes, along with a bunch of people saying "can you hear us say that ****" in raid chat, I say no, my vent must not be working right. The Raid leader(Guild officer MT) doesn't say anything, and proceeds to the next few pulls and we get to the second boss(s). I ask for a explanation of the boss in raid chat, I get a few disjointed "go left"' "they are usually on the north wall, go there" and "just follow the group" responses, nothing definite, so I figure its an easy boss, and we go with the pull. 10 second into the fight, I get yelled at in vent(in one of maybe a dozen or so shouted messages that got across) to "stand at the dragons TAIL ****" so I move there, boss then promptly turns and blasts me with fire, I die. A wipe ensues. I say again, "Vent isnt working guys I cant hear a thing" This time I dont get a single response in raid chat. Pretty much the same thing happens for the next 6 wipes, we go in, some mechanic/strategy was discussed in vent, I miss it, and it ends up in a wipe. After every wipe, I post almost exactly the same message "Vent isnt working guys, cant hear a thing, cant you give boss strat in raid chat?" And no one replies, finally after the 7th wipe, RL calls it and all but he and I leave, he asks me to stay.
He then starts telling me to "get better equipment" and "you are holding us back," in a cryptic sort of way that could mean several things: 1) improve my gear, 2) get a better computer, 3) get better internet, etc. And I get thoroughly confused, and begin thinking "WTF kind of guild DOES he think this is.....certainly NOT a guild trying to be #1 in the realm" Hell, we celebrated when we were in the top 50..... So I say something to the effect "its not my fault you Missed my messages for an explanation" He gave some lame excuse about his chat window moving too fast...almost as if he was monitoring more than 1 conversation at a time...IN a raid no less. So I decided to give him some sound, former raid leader(back when uld and ToC were new) advice: When leading a raid, block out EVERYTHING else in game except for the raid, and devote all your attention to managing the raid WHILE playing the game. And since he was not doing that, he failed to notice my repeated messages in raid chat that vent wasn't working and for raid explanations, and that him giving ME the third degree was uncalled for. He then said "I don't think I will be raiding with you again" and then proceeds to list my excuses, out of context, in guild chat. I try to explain things, he attacks me, I try to take things to whispers, he posts EXACTLY what I said in whisper in guild chat, and proceeds to taunt me about it. I try and pull a "w/e" statement and log out. Unfortunately, during the 20 secs for a logout, he posts something to the effect of "immature coward....idk how you all can put up with him...(missed the rest because of logout)."
When I joined this guild, it was for a place to level and alt while I raided on my main, it soon became the guild I went to for advice and help with things ranging from: family troubles, financial issues, relationship issues, and all around camaraderie. After the raiding guild my main was in fell apart because of drama(not unlike the above actually, only one person intentionally pitted players against each other) and the GM changing realms to get away from it, I joined my current guild with my nearly lvl 70 alt in it, and I have been there for nearly 18 months now. Shortly after my main joined, I got the guild raiding and progressing, and took them from a guild with under 5 OS 10 man kills and almost nothing else, to a guild with naxx 10 fully cleared, Ulduar progressed to Hodir and ToGC fully cleared in under 2 months, and when ICC came out, we jumped right in and got our first Deathbringer kill in mid January. However, in early March of 2010, I was forced to take a involuntary break from WoW, and was unable to get back in until October. In that time, my guild had progressed to downing every boss in Wrath, including LK, except for Yogg. And when I got back I was severely behind in gear, so I decided to wait until cata came out to rejoin the raiding scene with them. School however had other plans for me, and leveling to 85 took me some time, and gearing up took longer, and now that I am starting to rejoin the raiding scene with the guild, THIS happens...and I am a little afraid that the guild might not take this incident well, the officer is fairly prominent in the guild, and I haven't been as active in a LONG time...how do I handle this situation without making things worse? And how can I now run a raid team that has seen how things might go after a night of wiping? I really don't want to make things worse, but this officer has rubbed me the wrong way since he joined back in 09(November I think, just a few weeks after I did), and he doesn't pull punches when it comes to ... well, ANYTHING, regardless of the consequences.
Please help me,
Vent Troubles
Drama Mama Robin: Hey, Vent. Looks like you've got That Guy in your guild. And just like That Guy in your office and That Guy who married your family member or friend, you can't fix him and you can't make him treat you better. You don't have to put up with this behavior, however. And, more importantly, you can minimize the chances of becoming the brunt of another That Guy attack.First, let's deal with That Guy's behavior: His reaction was immature and drama-causing. You need to discreetly discuss it with your guild leader. (You might also want to drop the fact that he's running a raid without properly monitoring raid chat.) If the GL is okay with That Guy, then I highly recommend finding a guild that doesn't allow that kind of verbal abuse. Otherwise, trust the GL to deal with it appropriately and otherwise keep your contact with That Guy to a minimum.
Now, let's talk about you. I understand that this particular run was spur of the moment and you weren't leading the raid. But it might have helped if you had refreshed your knowledge of the bosses a bit during prep/travel time. We have a lot of general discussions as well as specific class strategies here on WoW Insider.
Or maybe you did read up. If so, great! I guess that still wouldn't have helped you hear whatever the specific strategies were for the fight. So, let's get technical.
It is your responsibility to make sure any technical problems you are having aren't affecting the rest of your group. Once you realized Vent wasn't working for you, the thing to do was announce your problem (which you did) and then announce that you were going to try some troubleshooting. They could then have chosen to wait for you or not. A few minutes trying to restart Vent and/or your computer would probably have solved your problems and allowed you to participate properly. And if you weren't able to solve it, then you should have asked if they wanted to make the exception of typing the instructions in Vent or have you drop out.
Of course, That Guy's not properly monitoring raid chat would have hindered all of this communication, but one of the people on Vent could have explained your situation verbally. I doubt you were the only reason for all those wipes, mind you. But fixing your technical issues or having the rest of the raid buy in to working around them would have kept you from being That Guy's scapegoat.
Regardless, you didn't deserve the treatment you got. "I don't think I'll be raiding with you again," he said. Turn that threat from him into a promise for yourself.
Drama Mama Lisa: Vent Troubles, I'm sympathetic to your situation. We've all been the one who's struggling to fix a technical problem and keep up with a fast-paced raid at the same time -- but I have to come out and say the obvious: Get a clue.After 7 statements about not being in Vent, isn't it obvious that nobody particularly wants to handhold you by typing strats into raid chat? After 7 wipes, isn't it obvious that your inability to hear the strategies is a major problem?A wipe ensues. I say again, "Vent isnt working guys I cant hear a thing" This time I dont get a single response in raid chat. Pretty much the same thing happens for the next 6 wipes, we go in, some mechanic/strategy was discussed in vent, I miss it, and it ends up in a wipe. After every wipe, I post almost exactly the same message "Vent isnt working guys, cant hear a thing, cant you give boss strat in raid chat?" And no one replies, finally after the 7th wipe, RL calls it ...
Frankly, I don't blame the officer for blowing his stack and going off on you. It was a childish tantrum, true, and I don't condone his particular flavor of reaction ... But wow, you really set up this situation to fail. I don't think the guild officer is That Guy at all -- I think That Guy is you.
As you've noted, this unfortunate event occurred just as you came back and were trying to make a good impression with the guild. You're the newcomer here, and you barged in and made a mess of things by being so unprepared and not taking care of your business. If you want to continue trying to get this raid group off the ground, you're either going to have to man up and apologize to the officer/tank for your lack of attention to your problems and ask him if he'd be willing to give it a second chance, or you're going to have to find another MT. Either way, as Robin explained, you're also going to have to study up on the encounters, doublecheck your Vent stability, and ensure that you're 100% prepared for your next event.
Take care of your business, act like the returning newcomer you are, and remember that you're the one who needs to bend here as you seek to fit into the guild again. With a little care, you can get back into the swing of things without blowing up any more tempers or raids!
Dodge the drama and become that player everyone wants in their group with a little help and insight from the Drama Mamas. Remember, your mama wouldn't want to see your name on any drama. Play nice ... and when in doubt, ask the Drama Mamas at robin@wowinsider.com.
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Drama Mamas
Reader Comments (Page 7 of 9)
Gracandrea Mar 26th 2011 9:59AM
I'm curious as to this addon.
Please what is it?
Prelimar Mar 26th 2011 1:29PM
the one i use is called Boss Notes:
http://wow.curse.com/downloads/wow-addons/details/boss-notes.aspx
there might be others.
Materium Mar 25th 2011 3:56PM
I think there is two separate issues here.
VT, you need to handle your own issues in a raid, and not expect the other raiders to acquiesce to your vent problems. There is a multitude of ways you probably could have handled that better. Many of which have been offered up in comments, clicking not ready on a ready check, asking for 5 minutes to troubleshoot, politely removing yourself from the raid if the issue could not be fixed. You were expecting the raid to coddle you a bit there.
On the other hand, the raid leader fell down on his job a number of ways. First of which was if you not having vent working was causing wipes, was letting the raid continue that way. Second was not reacting in any way to your asks for strats in raid chat, even if that is a whisper explaining he does want to type all that out. On top of that he was a complete and total jerk after the raid to you. But, just because he handled that like an immature idiot doesn't change you could have acted better.
I am commenting for the first time due to Lisa's response shocking me. Been reading these posts for awhile and that is the most extreme post I have ever seen from her. But the more I think about, the more she is right in a lot of ways. And the more it makes me think she is teaching this guy a WOW life lesson. This raid leader is one of hundreds of thousands like him, and they are not going away soon. Just coddling VT about that won't do anyhting.
jfofla Mar 25th 2011 4:06PM
I have been in guilds where vent is a crowded party of immature catch phrases, even during the fight.
That kind if Guild NEVER reads Raid Chat.
I currently am in a 25 man Raiding Guild where only the RL speaks in vent, expect when critical information needs to be passed to RL.
That kind of Guild uses Raid Chat and the RL always responds to Questions in Raid Chat.
In my opinion if your Guild Leaders don't read GChat or Raid Chat, that is not a Guild you want to be in.
Galohalt Mar 25th 2011 4:09PM
There is an easy solution to problems like this. Since VT says they weren't responding to chat and you can't hear vent anyway, just restart the vent client... They won't notice you since it wasn't working in the first place. If that doesn't fix the issue, you need to help the raid leader find a replacement for you and drop group.
After the raid was called it seems like there was a lot of back and forth drama from both you and the officer. Why let it spiral out of control? Take the critique of your performance and improve for the next raid. Telling the ego-maniac officer how to do his job will only ignite an already tender situation. If you respond negatively to this performance review, the officer will only have more ammo for further salvos against your character.
If you feel the officer was out of line, don't guild chat war about it. Take your issue to the guild master. He'll either sort it out or tell you to shove off. If it's the later, guilds love healers and you could easily find a new home.
Whenever a player takes an extended break from the game and jumps back in, the climate, attitude, and even goals can change dramatically from when you first joined. The guild may not be a good fit for you anymore.
Huzurahh Mar 25th 2011 4:26PM
The officer was a jerk, but VT obviously wasn't the golden boy he made himself out to be since the other 8 people in the raid also didn't feel a need to come to his aid.
I see the situation happening like this -
VT complains about his vent. The RL has the group clear trash to the next boss, figuring VT is looking at *fixing* his situation. There is a decent amount of trash between Halfus and the dragons so it takes some time to clear. When they reach the dragons, VT is with the group and clicks 'ready' on the ready-check. RL assumes that means the vent situation is fixed. VT proceeds to noob it up and wipe the raid, and then gets all uppity when the RL suggests he fix whatever his computer issues are.
VT should have attempted to fix his vent problem, or should have asked to be replaced.
And if they weren't responding to raid chat, he should have moved it to whispers or guild chat. (I've run into situations where the raid leader doesn't read raid chat because he is busy with loot issues and explaining fights on vent and such, and sometimes you need to be more proactive about getting your needs met.)
bldavis59 Mar 25th 2011 4:32PM
I am in a tough spot on this one
as a former RL myself, im sitting here thinking "WTF was that RL doing not paying attention to R-chat?"
When I was leading ToC and ICC runs, i would turn off local, and sometimes even guild chat, just so i could focus on my raid.
but also, 7 boss pulls? and still havent fixed vent?
and if you are raiding and havent at least watched the tankspot videos for basic strategy, then GTFO.
knowing the basic strat was always a preeq for me.
you didnt know the basic, im not going to do your homework for you
if we do something different, ill explain it to you, but for the most part you should do your homework.
both parties are at fault here
but imho the RL should be removed from that position. If you cant pay full attention to your raid, you should not be the RL.
on the flip side, if you cant figure out that you need to fix vent in between pulls, then....are you sure you should be raiding?
i understand not being bleeding edge raiders, heck i just now have my warrior raid ready with her tanking gear. but if you are going to raid, know your class, make sure you have the gear, and make sure you know the basic strat so in case something does go wrong, you can fall back on it.
one last thing, if you cant figure out wtf to do after 7 pulls, i prob wouldnt want you on my raid team either
brainard Mar 25th 2011 4:43PM
Yeah there is nothing in the action of the "raid leader" that reflects maturity or leadership. I am an officer and a raid leader and his actions smell to me off someone who is too "leet" to actually lead. Why?
1 - Not following raid chat....obviously to leet cuz because he can't be bothered
I am at a loss as to why any raid leader would ignore comments typed in raid chat
2 - not stopping the raid when an issue is identified and dealing with it immediately....obviously cuz because Vent is a scrub
The raid leader should have immediately stopped the pull and sorted the vent issue out, and if he was confident in leading the raid without vent, used raid chat to communicate with that player
3 - not taking the time to explain the fights...because you should already know it you noob...
Any decent raid leader always summarizes the fight...even if you have one shotted the boss 10x before. Why? To get everyone focused on the task at hand.
This poor excuse for raid leading, followed by the open conversation in guild chat shows to me that this "officer" is That Guy. If he were in my guild he would have been /gkicked.
Lisa it's a shame that you showed less sympathy for the troubled teen last week than you showed this abusive officer this week. There is absolutely no excuse for an officer to ever behave this way. There is never a justification for name calling or character assassination. I am appalled at you advice and glad i am not a member of your guild where you would make excuses for this behavior.
All the criticism of Vent seems to amount to - bad players should be better. A true leader gets them there, not calls them names.
Odinfrost Mar 26th 2011 4:35PM
@ brainard
I am totally with you on this one. To quote Lisa Poisso “After 7 wipes, isn't it obvious that your inability to hear the strategies is a major problem?” Yes it should have been and the fact that the Raid Leader did nothing to address this clearly shows him/her to be the weak link in the chain, hell this should have been addressed by the second wipe. When a raid member types in raid chat that “I have a problem” that is when the party needs to stop pulling and solve the problem period.
Now regardless of whether the solution is “you have five min to troubleshoot and if you can’t fix it we need you to leave” or if this impromptu raid is made up of “GOGOGO!” types “you need to leave now because we don’t want to wait” it is up to the Raid Leader to address the problem before attempting to proceed with the raid. The fact that they didn’t shows incompetence on the part of the Raid Leader which is forgivable but needs to be pointed out.
If Vent isn’t telling the whole story, or is to blame for not knowing the fight, or really any other shortcoming it is STILL up to the Raid Leader to sort this out before continuing because there are (in this case) eight other raid members counting on him/her to lead them to success in this endeavor. The failure to address any issue before continuing is again incompetence on the part of the Raid Leader.
Now when we comes to the posting of an argument in guild chat by the Raid Leader and dragging this into an open guild channel, that should be a g/kick right there and sure as hell would be in my guild. I don’t care if Vent is the most obnoxious self entitled little jerkwad in the world, as an officer you do not pull that kind of childish crap. And that right there is the biggest reason why RL is in the wrong.
@ Lisa Poisso
“After 7 statements about not being in Vent, isn't it obvious that nobody particularly wants to handhold you by typing strats into raid chat?... Frankly, I don't blame the officer for blowing his stack and going off on you.”
Not only do these statements show you have no concept of what a Raid Leader is or what they should be doing but it also shows you to be the type of guild member that would be bringing unwanted drama to the rest of the guild…meaning you are in fact “That guy/gal”. I think I can safely speak for the rest of my guildies when I say we are all very glad that you are not a member of our guild because not only do we not tolerate the type of childish B.S. you seem to be ok with but your attitude would cause us to have to g/kick you in a rather short amount of time. I pity the other members of whatever guild you are a member of…hopefully they will find another guild to go to that won’t put up with the kind of behavior you seem to be defending here.
TL;DR version:
Brainard = Right
Lisa Poisso = Drama mama of a different type than advertized.
GhostWhoWalks Mar 25th 2011 4:46PM
I'm sorry, but...what? His Vent's not working, the rest of the raid can't be bothered to tell him the strategy they're developing...and that's somehow his fault?
Now, I can't speak as a professional raid leader, as I've never been part of a hardcore or progression raid. My only experience with raid leading is with the semi-casual guild I've been a part of, but even then, I had a responsibility to the raid to be flexible.
We used Vent, but sometimes people didn't have Vent, so when we were discussing strategy SOMEBODY had to give those out of Vent the cliffnotes version so that they were on the same page. We weren't holding their hands, but...seriously, come on, don't leave them completely in the dark.
Sure, they could go look the strategies up on Wowwiki or Wowhead or maybe even a Tankspot video, but it's one thing to read about/watch someone do it and ACTUALLY DO THE FIGHT. The group composition isn't always the same as the people who wrote the strategies, so when they say "this boss puts down a disease, make sure to dispel it" and you don't actually have any healers in the group who can dispel disease, well, your group is going to have to make some adjustments. And when you do, guess what, you have to tell the people out of Vent what strategy changes you're making so they know what to do.
Example: my guild was doing ICC and we got to Dreamwalker. We told one of the healers that he was on dragon-healing duty and to go in the portals when they show up. We went into the fight, but Dreamwalker wasn't anywhere near full health when we were finally overwhelmed and wiped. This was odd, since the healer we'd assigned had previously displayed that he was an amazing healer and could put out monster numbers. So we asked him what was up and it turns out he'd never done the fight before and didn't know he had to grab the orbs when you go through the portal. WE wiped because WE assumed he knew what to do without making sure. So we filled him in on the information he'd been lacking, went back for round two and bam, finished the fight with flying colors. See? Simple as that. We didn't have to hold his hand, we didn't have to guide him through every step of the fight, just take a minute to explain to the new guy what he needs to do and get on with it.
So first off, the entire raid deserves a black mark for being so uncooperative. I mean, really? You give him some vague instructions and they when they prove to be insufficient to keeping him in line with the rest of the team (woah, big surprise there) you don't say ANYTHING to him?
What I find to be even more outrageous is the MT's behavior after they'd gotten out of the raid. If Vent Troubles did actually need better gear, then fine. But trying to use that as an excuse for leaving him completely in the dark for all 7 wipes? Then he turns around and starts intentionally taking statements out of context to make VT look bad in public? Then when VT tries to take this into a private discussion to keep a lid on the public drama, the guy has to repeat it in public to ENSURE that VT is ridiculed as much as possible? Uh-uh, no way. That is so completely out of line that we can't even see the line anymore.
In short, I'm going with Robin on this one, but even then, I fear that serving VT his helping of Humility Cake is ignoring the bigger issues here.
Huzurahh Mar 25th 2011 4:49PM
'I don't like Lisa's response at all. The least that the raid leader could have done would have been to at least give Vent Troubles a couple of minutes to get his Ventrilo squared away'
VT did have time. The raid was clearing trash. There is a decent amount of trash between Halfus and Valiona's room - clearing it is more than enough time to restart vent or computer.
Khirsah Mar 25th 2011 4:50PM
I don't get it. Were none of the raid group watching raid chat? After 6 wipes, nobody initiated a ready check? If indeed that was the case, then VT has every right to be pissed about his treatment.
But I'll bet we're missing a lot of the story. I'll bet he was clicking ready when he wasn't, or confirming in raid chat that he understood the strat when he didn't even hear it. There is no way that a raid leader or mt would continue to pull after a bunch of wipes and not be checking his raid chat for inidications of a problem.
If nothing else, VT could have not rezzed and that would have made people pause to see what the hold-up was.
Dekured Mar 25th 2011 5:00PM
I read " I don't blame the officer for blowing his stack and going off on you" as " I don't blame the officer for blowing his sack and going off on you"
...Am I a bad man?
lethian Mar 25th 2011 5:04PM
Well.. speaking as an officer of my current guild... as well as having been in this situation.. i agree with robin and cannot stand lisa's response. imo the officer should apologies.. when i blow my stack regardless of who i think was int he wrong.. i apologies.. him being an officer is something he should NOT take lightly. he has a responsibility to treat everyone with respect.. that officer is the kind of guy i wouldn't get along with. ive gotten on my own friends who are officers for what i consider a unfair response or abuse of a punishment.. while he should have fixed his vent that officer was completely in the wrong on every area of how he handled it and on the handhold point.. they could have responded in raid and told him to fix it also so that does not hold water. idk lisa's response seemed overly harsh
Eirik Mar 25th 2011 5:06PM
IMO, the crux of the problem, the turning point, was that VT did not make an issue of his vent troubles. That is, compelling the raid leader to acknowledge the issue and make a decision on what to do. All else that followed (the failure to explain "the strategy THIS time", the raid being called, the revelation that the raid leader having poor people-management skills) ... followed.
Compelling the raid leader to choose: replace VT, assist VT in getting Vent restarted, or explaining the strategies outside of Vent needed to be done. VT called it out in raid chat, but no action was taken. The next logical step would be a) /tells to the raid leader, b) spamming raid chat, or c) physical dislocation - making it obvious you were not ready to participate in the raid.
This is specifically a "confronting authority" event, and people sometimes need to work themselves up to it. And there IS an aspect of "get a clue" to this: Recognizing the necessity of a confrontation is a skill people should cultivate.
The problem I have with D.M. Lisa's response is that confronting authority is even harder for a newcomer. They may have no particular gauge on what reactions of other people in the raid USUALLY are, so they don't know if any particular (re)action is to be expected or not. As well, they haven't built up any social credit of their own with the others; to establish a baseline of their own personality or value to the group. So telling someone to "act like the newcomer you are" is, I think, counterproductive for this particular scenario. Better, perhaps, to "act like a seasoned raider" and Get 'Er Done, even if it means asserting yourself when other people are concentrating on other things.
... after all, Get 'Er Done was what both Robin and Lisa recommended.
Drack Mar 25th 2011 5:08PM
I've been coming to the site a year or two now, and until this day, I have only disagreed with a Drama Mama once, and even then, I didn't disagree with it enough to reply to it.
Lisa... wow... I just... wow. Your reply makes me wonder if you've actually been in this situation before and acted the same and your trying to justify it.
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"After 7 statements about not being in Vent, isn't it obvious that nobody particularly wants to handhold you by typing strats into raid chat?" After 7 statements about not being in Vent, isn't it obvious no one cared enough to say anything? Should he have taken a minute to try and fix it? Yes. Could he have taken a minute to try and fix it? Maybe, maybe not. Maybe he didn't know enough about Vent to try and fix it, maybe the group was going to fast for him to do so. I don't know, you don't know, none of us except him and the rest of the group know.
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"Frankly, I don't blame the officer for blowing his stack and going off on you."
WHAT?! It was a childish little tantrum that I'd hold above anybody older then eight. Vent tried to help him out (or at least claims to in the letter) and he attacks him like he insulted his mother after killing his puppy.
--------------------------------------------
Now comes the part where you tell him to act like he's little more then a whipped child.
Seriously? Just because he's come back means he has to back out of any confrontation with an officer? All guild members should treat each other with respect. Guilds are families, not a Russian army.
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In short, I am incredibly dissapointed with you today Lisa. You should show more compassion and understanding then that.
P.S.-Don't mistake me here, Vent WAS at fault in this, but not intirely and most certaintly not enough to even begin to justify RL actions.
Drack Mar 25th 2011 5:16PM
Also, video at the top is awsome beyond all comprehension.
Wolfwings Mar 25th 2011 5:12PM
That guild member had no right to act that way, regardless of making a troubleshooting mistake. Vent troubles came here looking for help, trying to help solve a conflict- they are trying to resolve this and are looking for advice while the jerk in their guild was just being a drama brat. Supporting his bad behavior is completely uncalled for, I'm very disappointed. No one deserves to be treated that way.
blissfire Mar 25th 2011 6:22PM
I don't know how the RL's actions post-raid can be excused or how anyone could "not blame him" for his own behaviour. Posting private conversations to guild chat for the purpose of taunting? Calling him an "immature coward" in front of the guild (public name-calling, really?) and then proceeding to bad-mouth him to the guild after he logged out...
Whatever Troubles did or didn't or should or shouldn't have done during a single raid is absolutely irrelevant - because there's no excuse good enough to justify treating a fellow player like that.
Personally, I'd eat Don Carlos' Famous Hat before I'd *apologize* to that guy.
TheTraveler12 Mar 25th 2011 5:37PM
some people are elitists... nothing you can do about it.. id give that guy another chance to lead a raid.. if the same thing happens or... hell.. if you ask a question regarding the fight.. there should be SOMEONE in the raid who will answer... that the point of a !@#$ing group. collective knowledge to better the end result. reading and watching videos can do only so much. and seriously... if he asked.. what drakes are up.. someone should have answered.. not saying he did ask.. but if he had.. im hoping someone would have answered with which ones.. not.. you should already know that dude.. that kind of attitude turned me off to the game a while back. i play now but took a long break.. this isnt wrath kiddies.. no faceroll success here