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The latest patch 5.4 newsBashiok comments on WoW's difficulty, accessibility
by Mathew McCurley 
Apr 11th 2011 at 3:00PM
Bashiok -- Old WoW
I understand and respect gaming masochism. But, I think that changing mechanics to be more reasonable and less punishing is an improvement, not a detriment, to games in general. Many of us Original Gamers pine for the days of D&D-based yore when games were seemingly intended to break us down into sobbing masses created by an uncaring necromancer of pain and suffering, or at least didn't try to avoid it. Overcoming all of the obstacles (I CHOOSE NOT TO SHOOT HER WITH THE SILVER ARROW... NOOOOO) was a big part of what gaming (I HAVE 1 LIFE!?), and especially PC gaming (HOW DO I LOAD MOUSE DRIVERS?), were about. But, I feel we're lucky to now be in an age where those ideals (intended or not) are giving way to actual fun, actual challenge, and not fabricating it through high-reach requirements (I NEED A FAIRY MONK WITH A MAGIC LOCKPICK?).
What we've always been trying to do, what WoW has always been about (and to which much of its success is due) is to make an accessible MMO. Anyone that looks back at the game at launch and wishes it was as challenging now as it was then is not aware of the painstaking effort put into making this game accessible as compared to its predecessors. Since release we've refined that intent, eventually evolving the very few masochistic designs WoW actually ever started with, but ideally still offering those same prestige goals that give that feeling of achieving something great if you're able to pull it off. We've made a lot of progress toward striking that balance and continuing to evolve the game, but it's not something we're ever likely to perfect, and we'll be constantly working to hit that elusive goal. Hopefully it's to the benefit of everyone playing and enjoying the game, and they'll continue to enjoy the journey that a living, breathing, persistent universe will take us on.
What we've always been trying to do, what WoW has always been about (and to which much of its success is due) is to make an accessible MMO. Anyone that looks back at the game at launch and wishes it was as challenging now as it was then is not aware of the painstaking effort put into making this game accessible as compared to its predecessors. Since release we've refined that intent, eventually evolving the very few masochistic designs WoW actually ever started with, but ideally still offering those same prestige goals that give that feeling of achieving something great if you're able to pull it off. We've made a lot of progress toward striking that balance and continuing to evolve the game, but it's not something we're ever likely to perfect, and we'll be constantly working to hit that elusive goal. Hopefully it's to the benefit of everyone playing and enjoying the game, and they'll continue to enjoy the journey that a living, breathing, persistent universe will take us on.
People have been bemoaning the rise and fall of difficulty versus accessibility forever, so it is no surprise that posts like this has come up. Cataclysm has made a good number of improvements to the reputation systems and the number of excellent rewards available to players in many different ways, and it has made accessibility a core value rather than a feature.
Bashiok comes from that era of oppressive gaming. Games were hard, in order to keep you playing as well as to provide a challenge. As technology and gaming philosophy change and the MMO genre evolves, the old, oppressive ways make way for the new challenges of MMO design -- namely, growing and holding on to a dedicated playerbase. WoW still has all of the same goals that you have to work hard for and put a bunch of time and effort into. Raiding is still the endgame and is still difficult; prestige gold items are still available and not in everyone's inventories; and, last time I checked, playing your class to a decent degree was still something to be proud of. Believe me, you don't want to go back to the salad days of difficulty.
WoW Patch 4.1 is on the PTR, and WoW Insider has all the latest news for you -- from previews of the revamped Zul'Aman and Zul'Gurub to new valor point mechanics and new archaeology items.
Filed under: Cataclysm
Reader Comments (Page 5 of 7)
Sky Apr 11th 2011 5:53PM
I don't know about your experience in your realm, but when pugging Raids in my server there certainly isn't a shortage of dps. If anything, tanks and healers should get bonus VP so that more tanks and healers can get to the gear level required for raiding. More geared tanks/healers will lead to more Pug raids and more gear (and skill) to go around
DarkWalker Apr 12th 2011 12:04AM
Sincerely, Cata LFD drove me off. During WotLK I would queue as a tank for at least 20 random heroics per week, whereas I couldn't stand doing even a couple Cata random heroics.
And I will only even think about renewing my subscription if I'm quite sure LFD heroics will be successful 90% or more of the time while taking 30 minutes or less. Otherwise, WoW will have lost me as a player permanently.
Arturis Apr 11th 2011 4:56PM
Bashiok promised my a Fairy Monk
Arturis Apr 11th 2011 4:57PM
...and WoWInsider promised me a comment edit tool. >_>
sullyXXX Apr 11th 2011 5:41PM
Wow, and here I am QQing that Heroics and Raids are less accessible than in Wrath :/ I miss raiding... I miss having the free time of a freshman as well!
PJ Apr 11th 2011 5:49PM
HC's still too hard. Move the hardness to the raids and make HC accessible.
Matthew Apr 11th 2011 6:06PM
VERY helpful comments everyone. I was one of the healers in end-game wrath, and appreciate the insights you have given. Yeah, I sure healed my pretty nelf butt off!
ironfungus Apr 11th 2011 6:25PM
Bashiok isn't an old school RPG gamer; I don't care what he or anyone else says. Anyone who speaks "accessibility" and preaches about how lucky we are to be in a dumbed down, "stream-lined" age is no gamer at all. They're just normal people trying to be hip and cool by jumping on the video game band wagon, except those video games are redundant, boring, unsatisfying failures.
If they make Warcraft any more "accessible", we'll all be starting at the max level, fully geared and have the rest of the game handed to us on a damned silver platter. It's people like this is why WoW is the atrocity that it is today. It's people like this behind Blizzard that make it so we can never return to the actual FUN of WoW.
StClair Apr 11th 2011 7:56PM
Because for a Real Gamer, fun isn't what you have while you "play", it's what you have looking down on everyone else who isn't as Cool, skilled, l33t etc as you because THEY didn't spend every waking moment for two weeks killing internet dragons.
Rolly Apr 11th 2011 8:03PM
You have to remember all the old school CM's got turfed because they would call it like they saw it, Fangtooth, Cadiem, Tseric they are all gone they were the gamers. This new batch was hired for their PR skills not their gaming skills.
That's why we get nonanswers to questions and the annoying double speak about how what they've done is for "our" benefit. They think we're stupid enough to believe the crap was for the player and not to cut down on manpower overhead and make their job (the developers) easier.
Talent point trees are a perfect example.
"We want to make talents meaningful and cut down on cookie cutter builds" ummmm yeeeaaa right.
"We want to make healing fun and engaging for the player" so why the hell does every healer have the same spells with a different graphic.
And is it me or hasn't anyone else noticed the "secondary resource" is all 3's. again with just a different graphic.
Talitha Apr 11th 2011 6:33PM
I've seen comment after comment bemoaning the rudeness and elitism in the PuGs for the last... oh, four, five months.
I myself PuG pretty often - in fact, that's how I'm leveling up my healer, and you know what?
I rarely meet rude and elitist players (of those who I do, I could count on one hand).
Clearly, my experiences doesn't line up with other players, and after observing PuGs for the last several weeks, I have come to one conclusion:
Your attitude affects your experience. If you enter a PuG upbeat and friendly, people will either stay silent or be friendly right back. If you enter a PuG silent and remain silent, you won't have many problems. If you enter a PuG silent and turn nasty later (or start as nasty off the bat)... well, that's where the rudeness and elitism comes into play.
I'm sorry, people, but I have had met people who claim they were nice when they were not. Odds are, most of the commenters here who bemoan the rudeness and elitism are a bit rude themselves.
Chances are, I'll be downvoted, but I simply have to get this out of my system.
Want a great PuG run? BE NICE AND FRIENDLY ALL THE TIMES, even if it means pulling out your tooth. It's worth it. (Being nice and friendly means NO snarky, subtle, snide comments or being rude to one person while being nice to the rest. That's simply not nice.)
As my grandma used to say, "It's nice to be nice."
Sky Apr 11th 2011 6:42PM
I agree with you as well. Obviously, there is the occasional tool but most of the time people are friendly or at the very least quiet but know what they are doing. I think this whole "The random dungeon finder is full of the worst people in the world" sentiment is overblown where 1 or 2 bad experiences is cited as the example instead of the majority of runs that go smoothly. I also think that what people don't understand is that failing is part of the experience. Failing is a good thing. The time that every pug you join has a 100% success rate is the time that doing 5-mans start feeling like a chore instead of an actual challenge.
Soulestream Apr 11th 2011 7:21PM
I am not sure why the difference exists, but I think it has to do with the badge system.
I have 3 85's that I haven't played in weeks. I started a new warrior tank and have leveled mostly by running randoms (probably 95% of my XP) up to current level 62. I haven't run into hardly any unfriendly people and everyone is very cordial after a death or a wipe.
That seems to change at 85. I don't know if people are just burned out or if I just get a lot of "I'm only here for the end boss badges" people, but everyone seems much ruder at max level. I don't exactly know what the difference is. Heroics seem to bring out the worst in people. DPS that don't interrupt and blame the healer, tanks that don't mark, everyone who doesn't follow the marks and healers who won't heal you for getting accidental damage(not just standing in fire).
I've played all 3 roles at 85 and I just don't get the meanness. I miss the LK heroics for the fact that at least you get it over with in 15 minutes, instead of an hour of listening to whining and complaining, waiting for another healer after the last one vanished and DPS who decide once they enter the dungeon is a good time to "gotta go eat dinner, brb"
LK heroics weren't fun, but at least they weren't miserable.
Suss Apr 11th 2011 7:32PM
"[Cataclysm} has made accessibility a core value rather than a feature."
I completely disagree. My guild crapped out at 11/12 because everyone burned out on the non-raiding activities. Even with LotD, healing a pug in a heroic is much more challenging than healing my guild in Al'Akir. The grind has driven away a large portion of the core guild with amazing efficiency, and now I'm burning out trying to replace them. What's amazing is that this group was much less burned out when ICC was 10 months old. It's not the age of the game, it's Cataclysm.
Kazidd Apr 12th 2011 12:13PM
Oh boo hoo cata is hard and I can't get my welfare epics. Too bad. Instead of whining put in some effort, stop being bad, and learn to follow the mechanics of the fight
Plastic Rat Apr 12th 2011 2:08AM
Totally agree with you, but WoWInsider appears to have become a haven for the entitlement crowd. I'm giving it about 3 seconds before they descend en mass and downvote your post into oblivion.
Grak Apr 12th 2011 6:15AM
Actually historicaly the WoWInsider readers upvote all kinds of contrary opinions, both casual and hardcore. What they do systematically downvote is the inability to express an opinion with civility and a little openmindedness.
Your comments are perfect examples of anonymous keyboard warriors, who see anyone with a different opinion as "the enemy", that needs to be insulted and belittled for not viewing videogame pixels the same way you do.
You're not in /trade chat or Xbox live here boys.
Sky Apr 12th 2011 1:36PM
@Grak
Show me 2 or 3 comments that favour the casuals that has been downvoted and I will believe you. Even my posts that were properly explaining why Cata isn't hard were downvoted. The comment system is a popularity contest and since there are more idiots here who just want their welfare epics instead of actually playing the game and getting better at it.
danawhitaker Apr 12th 2011 9:50PM
"Oh boo hoo cata is hard and I can't get my welfare epics. Too bad. Instead of whining put in some effort, stop being bad, and learn to follow the mechanics of the fight"
I'll be sure to get right on that - as soon as I find people to replace all the people who left because they hated the grind of gearing up tediously in heroics that we'd end up spending 2-3 hours doing (for just one dungeon).
I can't stop being bad and learn to follow the mechanics of a raid fight because I can't even *do* a raid in a guild group. We've lost almost half a dozen people since Cataclysm launched. If not for two people we recruited well after Cataclysm (who were regular PUGgers from Wrath whose guild had imploded) we would have three people on each day. We spend raid night 4-5 manning the weekly Wrath raid and then running BC content because no one has the motivation to run yet another heroic.
This isn't about players being bad. This problem stems from the fact that the time investment to get back to raiding makes it, for smaller guilds that flourished under the Wrath paradigm, almost impossible to even get started in Cataclysm. I was the first 85 in my guild. One person dinged 85 within the next day, then the rest of the people slowly started getting there. We started doing a few regulars, to get to 329. I only have time to run one dungeon a night (if that, depending on my schedule the next day). Let me do the math on that. It was two weeks in before we were even trying to do heroics regularly. And then, as the first batch of people to run and gear off heroics finished and were raid ready, they had to sit and twiddle their thumbs and wait for the slower members of the guild to get leveled. Then they started trying other games and let their subscriptions to WoW lapse. I'm not going to quit the guild I helped found with my friends in 2007. I'm hoping with the new guild recruitment functions in the next patch that it'll be easier to find some people who are around the same gear level and can play at the same time of night that we do, but I don't have a ton of hope on that prospect. The most exciting part of my WoW experience the past two weeks was finding Pattern: Star Belt and Enchant Shield: Lesser Block on the AH.
Alternately, I saw some people virtually vanish from the game after the changes to old world. They want no part of that. They want the original world back. Those people aren't coming back at all because they feel like Blizzard stomped all over all the things that originally made WoW what it was. I find it hard to disagree with them at times. I had my first experience in the "new" Sunken Temple recently, and it made me sad to see all the uniqueness sucked out of that dungeon. I really wish they'd at least left the original versions of some things around for nostalgia. Some of those people are probably the same kinds of people who would have fallen back to leveling alts, but now they even find doing that undesirable because they don't want the new 1-60 experience either. And now, with the change to Zul'Aman, I find myself wondering whether I'm going to have to worry that every content patch is going to bring a new change to old world or BC that I'm going to have to farm the heck out of to finish before it's gone.
Aladeran Apr 11th 2011 8:44PM
I have always been more interested in crafting items then any other activities. Crafting in Vanilla was hard (because of the variety of reagents and the difficulty in obtaining them) and rewarded the crafter with an item representing the effort put into it. There was a clear seperation between a green, a blue and an epic item, with the ultimate legendary being the dream.
When Wrath arrived, I saw the era of the easy and simplified crafting system at its best. You could now craft a blue with a few bars of worthless saronite or an Epic if you add a little more to the mix. Epics became a Walmart commodity and that made me feel cheap as a crafter.
Yes, I do miss the days of drooling at the idea of making an Epic, sweating to craft a blue set for my Rogue ... it took ages, but it was rewarding. I agree that some of it was too hard at the beginning of WoW, but the other extreme is not better. On a lighter note, I saw hope when a looked at the Vial of the Sands in Cata ... that is what crafting should be all about.