Breakfast Topic: Do you like the changes to classic holiday events?
by Aiden James Kosciesza 
Apr 25th 2011 at 8:00AM
I distinctly remember the time of year that I started playing WoW because there were Halloween decorations all over the game world. It was October, and Hallow's End was in full swing. Perhaps because of this, I've always looked forward to holiday events in-game, though they've changed over the years. Naturally there was no Headless Horseman boss back then, nor any holiday boss. Noblegarden was a one-day egg hunt in which roleplayers and completionists scrambled to find an Elegant Dress. Stormwind Guards received Valentine's cards during Love is in the Air rather than becoming convenient targets for chemical spray, and the Lunar Festival elders were generous with XP, reputation, and gold when you paid your respects.
Of course, there were no achievements, either.
I think I liked some holidays better the old way. Sure, the RNG problem with many holiday achievements is gone, but it's been replaced by a tedious and time-consuming grind that makes the event feel like more of a chore. I felt the same way about Lunar Festival when finishing it up on my alts. Without the rewards, the only purpose to visiting all the Elders is to tick their names off on the achievement tracker. I happen to like the new Noblegarden format, but I know some people tear their hair out over the egg competition. Brewfest and Pilgrim's Bounty, the new holidays designed with achievements in mind, are more successful in my view.
Do you like the revamped classic holidays? Do achievements make them more or less fun? Did you even do holidays before achievements? How could Blizzard improve its holiday events?
Filed under: Breakfast Topics, Guest Posts
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
Kal Apr 25th 2011 8:17AM
Honestly despite playing for around 6 years, I don't fully remember how the holidays were in Vanilla. They only really got my attention after achievements were released, so I guess technically I like them more now than before.
Noyou Apr 25th 2011 9:05AM
Yep. I do like the new format. One thing that has been a huge factor is flying in Azeroth. Once you hit 60 it's a brand new world. Especially for trickier events like midsummer where you get flagged. Even for the lunar festival where you had to go into enemy capitals you could fly right down and hover over the elder - no dismount and complete the task. Now for children's week you will still have to brave the PvP battlegrounds. But if you do it on the first day or so there will be plenty of horde (maybe not on all servers) who accommodate you in the first few minutes. I have learned there actually are good sports on both sides.
Draelan Apr 25th 2011 1:56PM
You've got to be joking. Good sports on both sides for the BG achievements during Children's Week? Not from what I've experienced. I've tried doing the achievements right away, waiting a few days, and tried getting them done closer to the end of the week. The only difference I've seen is that closer to the end of the week, people tend to stop doing stupid things... like gathering around the flag in the middle of Eye of the Storm, desperately trying to grab it, while the other faction CONTROLS ALL THE TOWERS. Ugh.
I think one of the few "cooperative" things I can remember is the one time in EotS where one guy on Alliance side grabbed the flag and ran to a tower, but refused to cap it until Alliance was winning. After several minutes of arguing with people who just wanted their achievement, a horde DK ran up, PAST the flag carrier to the cap-point, then Death Gripped him over to it to force him to cap it. I think that DK got more than a few cheers from people who just wanted to get their achievement so they could leave the BGs to the PvPers.
Ice Apr 25th 2011 8:20AM
I think they are allright..
But they still need something to do "after achievements".
I think achievements made the holidays more tedious and grindy, like the post said. "Gotta do daily every day for this item that is part of this achievement...must..do..daily..aaargh"
After you do achievements the game is basically telling you "Ok you just did EVERYTHING we have to offer, no need to do this ever again!" and thats what it does, you have NO reason to do it again next year unless you want some mount or vanity pet/item from RNG boss drop.
For example I'm not even interested on noblegarden because I have every item, every achievement it has to offer... why do it this year I ask?
There's no community reasons unless you are in RP realm (and even then its maybe one "party" event in some place not week long actual holiday). Theres no items you should get if you get all one year. No achievements to go for. No loot.
I think it would be important to have even small community reasons to keep these interesting.
I mean lets face it, what keeps things interesting in the game in general? Community. Players.
If players make events inside events its way more interesting than "gotta do daily and pick eggs!1". I think thats why "boss" holidays are intresting because you can do it with guildies and maybe have little competition who does most damage or maybe can you do the boss naked and maybe get mount for it.
MusedMoose Apr 25th 2011 8:43AM
I agree. It would really be nice if there was a bit more to do, both for people who already have the achievements and those who don't care to get them. I have the violet proto-drake on my main, so I've been through pretty much everything the holidays have to offer. Aside from going through them to get specific titles (Flame Warden on my fire mage, for example), there's really no reason for me to participate.
And yeah, having the bosses on some holidays is nifty and makes them more worth it, but it's not like they can do that for every holiday. Although it'd be hilarious to see what they came up with for some holidays... A reskinned infernal made of eggs for Noblegarden, maybe?
loop_not_defined Apr 25th 2011 9:55AM
Well...what would encourage you to participate further beyond Achievements and vanity items? The one suggestion you offered was yet another mount.
I'm not being rhetorical. I'm honestly curious what would keep people playing that doesn't have a definite end to it, like drops and Achievements.
loop_not_defined Apr 25th 2011 10:11AM
I just thought of an idea that I would like to see: Scoreboards.
My absolute most favorite holiday event is Brewfest, entirely because of Ram Racing. I love trying to maximize the number of tokens I can get in a single run, often keeping track of my personal best. What if there was a Brewfest Scoreboard that showed up during the event displaying both Top 10 Ram Racers (2011) and Top 10 Ram Racers (Ever) for your server? It would also display your personal bests.
I was thinking that maybe Blizzard could expand the Statistics to track cool stuff like this, but really, the Statistics feature is so heavily burdened by useless and uninteresting info - especially when you consider all the bugs it's plagued with (data resetting or displaying inaccurate numbers). Statistics are also largely inaccessible when trying to figure out things like Server Bests.
Thundrcrackr Apr 25th 2011 10:30AM
Personally, I DON'T want another reason to do them. Once was enough for me. They're kinda fun, but not that fun. While they are a welcome break from the daily routine for some people i find them to be more of an annoying interruption. I'm trying to get gear and mounts, i don't want to sit around and camp eggs all day, or try to find that elusive race/class combo. But i guess it all comes down to personal preference.
Hal Apr 25th 2011 10:59AM
@loop
Gold and XP are obvious things to bring back. This would get people to run holidays on their alts if they have already completed it on their main. Of course, for a holiday like Noblegarden, people dropping out of the action is a feature, not a bug (unless you like competing with 27 other players camping the same egg spawn).
Another thing to do would be scaling rewards that players of all levels can appreciate. Let's say that if you participate in a group event (like the defense of a village against the Headless Horseman), you can choose a flask that gives you a scaling buff, or perhaps just a buff from the event itself. Max level players appreciate the bonus, but it benefits everyone.
I don't think it's impossible to add such things in, and I'm sure Blizzard has plenty of ideas lined up for these things. But I think, as is usual, it probably falls into the category of "We have higher priorities."
gamerunknown Apr 25th 2011 11:04AM
I'm glad they don't force you to do them again. Camping eggs was torture, having more competition would just be a pain.
Xantenise Apr 25th 2011 1:16PM
But the point of having more to do that doesn't result in achievements is so that if you WANT to do it you can, and if you don't, you can sit out without losing anything.
Ice Apr 25th 2011 3:39PM
@gamerunknown and Thundrcrackr
I understand that, and I have same feeling. I dont want to pick eggs every single year or have more reasons to do so.
Heck, I think noblegarden is the worst holiday because all you do is camp at egg and pick them up and compete against people with 310 INSTANT flightform who can pick stuff while flying on that said 310..
HOWEVER, that is problem of the holiday itself not the whole picture.
If you actually had something else to do apart from achievements and grind, something that would change every year. Something that would keep things interesting for week.
It would be great! Something that DOES NOT involve current holiday mechanics (like getting xx amount of eggs, xx amount of brewfest coins etc..)
Like lets take example:
This years brewfest would have Brewfest food theme! You would have special epic, long quest chain to cook/make some brewfesty food, like rare ale-sausages! You would have to go to blackrock mountain, discover mysteries and all that, at the end you would have like the Sholazar basin quest where you add stuff together and release pressure valves etc.
You would get special recipe for it that would appear on next year too so those who were left out would get it.
No achievement (maybe feat), no brutal grind, no dailies, long quest chain that would change every year. No camping in spot for eggs or food materials.
razion Apr 25th 2011 8:25AM
I'm torn. I feel that adding the rewards and achievements into the mix of the holidays just make them feel like something you feel like you have to do as opposed to something you do because you want to enjoy the event. More specifically, the two events I did because I actually legitimately liked them was Hallow's End and Brewfest.
Brewfest I would drink and listen to the background chatter and try to figure out how the bloody rams work and so on. Everyone stayed at the grounds to defend against the invasions, and they were always talking, while general was filled with nonsensical tomfoolery. This made the event very fun for me.
As for Hallow's End, I remember there being (pardon my French) ass-loads of people in Goldshire defending against the Horseman's fire. Not because they needed a stinking achievement or anything, but because it was a regular hang-out spot for everyone and because, well, it was enjoyable.
The events are still enjoyable when people are together for the first day or so, but it just seems like no one goes there anymore after that day because it feels like the events are set-up loot piñatas as opposed to creations to have *fun* in.
I hope they can make more events in the game later on (or update the Faire, hint hint), and focus on them being purely for entertainment, as opposed to rewards.
velutina Apr 25th 2011 8:30AM
I stopped doing holiday events once I got my violet proto-drake on my main. I can't face doing the events on alts -- especially since I could buy 310% speed flying if I wanted.
Noyou Apr 25th 2011 8:55AM
I thought that way until the next holiday came up which was midsummer festival. It's just so good for alts who are leveling. I said torch juggling would be a sticking point- if I could do it on a particular toon I would go and do the rest. I actually got good at it and did it on 3 toons. "School of hard knocks" is another sticking point I will have to endure. Again. But if that's all that stands between me and that violet proto- then I will battle.
zubbiefish Apr 25th 2011 8:57AM
Same here.
I slogged my way through every holiday, doing every achievement, until I earned the Violet Protodrake. Then I stopped. I'll do a holiday boss if it drops something I want. For example, I'll be doing Brewfest, to get the ram I've never managed to get. Sometimes I'll do the holiday bosses on alts, sometimes I don't. it depends if they need the gear, becasue my main usually doesn't. WoW's holidays have lost a lot of their appeal, it was a ton of grindy work to get Strange Trip, and it's not a fun thought to repeat that. Once was enough.
That said, I do participate in Children's week. I do the quests on several characters because it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy.
Neirin Apr 25th 2011 8:36AM
In general I like the holidays, but some of the achievements are real buzz kills. In particular the do "X to Y class of Z race" achievements just bug me.
I do think some of the smaller holidays like children's week really benefit from the achievements (even if School of Hard Knocks is silly) just because it draws more attention to them. Heck, I know 1-2 people who never even realized children's week was a thing until achieves came out. We just need to be careful that the achievements don't completely take over the holiday. Doesn't it seem weird that a holiday gets spent grinding chocolate eggs rather than doing more engaging activities?
MusedMoose Apr 25th 2011 8:45AM
Oh gods, yes, the "X to Y class of Z race" are bloody stressful. @_@ I've never fretted so much over achievements as with those. They're even more difficult now that people don't hang out in Dalaran much, making those of the opposite faction even harder to find.
For "Love" this year, I had to go searching through the Horde areas for what I needed... Ended up swooping down on a level 8 troll rogue, throwing flower petals at him, and disappearing because he was in a town and guards were coming after me. Still can't help wondering what he/she thought of the whole thing. ^_^
shogunsherra Apr 25th 2011 11:21AM
I will often divebomb Orgrimaar for such combos, and if I die before I find one I will wait to res near my body to wait for one to come along.
Once I died near the warrior trainer waiting for an undead warrior, one came along, I ressed, smacked him with flowers, then was immediately pounced by the guards. The warrior was only lvl 11 or so I wonder how it must have felt.
Adrianne Apr 25th 2011 1:30PM
My female orc has been being dive bombed already by people with bunny ears. Last night I ended up sitting in Org for a little while so people could do it. Then I sat outside of a smaller town still in Horde territory so Alli could come by and hit me with the ears too. I guess orcs of 'legal age' are in short supply on my server.