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The latest patch 5.4 newsBreakfast Topic: Would you list WoW leadership on your real-life resume?
by Aiden James Kosciesza 
May 7th 2011 at 8:00AM
I've been to a few resumé workshops in my time, and as a professional writing tutor, I've sometimes been the one helping people with their resumés or CVs. Beyond the listings of education and job history, the section that seems most relevant to employers is that of job skills. Most of us have a number of special skills and talents gleaned from experiences outside of our day jobs, whether in church, volunteer work, coaching a local sports team -- or in my case, in Azeroth.
I run a guild in World of Warcraft, and like every leader in every type of community, be it virtual or actual, I've realized that it takes a lot of skill, attention, and balance to do it right. I have to coordinate events, scout and recruit new members, evaluate the performance of current members both individually and as a team, keep the lines of communication open, and treat everyone diplomatically and with respect. These skills, honed in the virtual world, are extremely relevant to many real-world jobs. The question is, how do I list them on my resume? Should I? Would potential employers be scared away by the knowledge that a job candidate plays World of Warcraft?
I decided to list my experience not on my resumé but in my cover letter, mentioning that I had experience managing a group of people, organizing events, and facilitating group communications. Sure enough, I was asked about that experience in an interview, and I had to come clean. I explained that I had taken on a leadership role among my peers and that I felt I'd learned a great deal about coordination and group management. The interviewer seemed to like my answer, and sure enough, I got the job. Go figure!
Would you list WoW leadership experience in your real-life resume or cover letter? How would you describe it or discuss it in an interview? Do you feel that you've leveraged your WoW experiences for real-world success?
Filed under: Breakfast Topics, Guest Posts
Reader Comments (Page 5 of 6)
Fefferman May 7th 2011 1:42PM
While I won't ever list it on my resume, I will be bringing this sort of thing up at my next employee review. My company has recently changed the way we are rated in reviews and we are now judged on the contributions we make to our community. What we do around town, so to speak, will have a direct impact on our rating - the higher you rate, the better chance you have at getting a raise. Between two jobs, a slightly active social life, family obligations and of course WoW, I don't have time to go out and be a Girl Guide leader, or coach little league or be a Big Sister. Nor do I think it's fair that I'll fail a section of my review because of that. So I decided that instead of listing things I do in my physical community, I'll just list the things I do in my online community. My online community being WoW!
I'm not sure how I'm going to word it yet. "Organizing weekend dungeon runs for newbie guild members" probably won't cut it but I've got a month before my next review to figure it out.
paraka321 May 7th 2011 6:19PM
"Organizing weekend excursions for new team members." Is a decent start. I'll keep working on it and see if I can come up with something else.
Hopefully this will only fuel more ideas from other people.
Jenni May 7th 2011 1:43PM
Before I played WoW, I reviewed applications for a summer internship program with a strong emphasis on leadership. One guy's only example of leadership was running groups in WoW. I rejected him and would again; a computer game is not an effective leadership example in the real world.
Trisnic May 7th 2011 7:23PM
You have no idea what you're talking about but please keep being prejudice and ignorant.
Of course this type of prejudice is very common and is mentioned many times on this thread. I wouldn't recommend putting WoW on a resume but I would recommend trying your hand at running a business if you are good at running a WoW guild. As a business owner for 8 years I can say that running one was very fulfilling, and by being your own boss you won't have to deal with arrogant recruiters such as the one above who have no idea what they're talking about. :)
oMeN May 7th 2011 2:13PM
First thought: No!
After reading the comments: iffy
Re analyzing everything: Yes, I would include this in my resume. Why? WOW and gaming in general is such a big part in my life that I rather not work with people who do not accept who I am.
Tim May 7th 2011 2:26PM
As a hiring manager I don't see a lot of upside as listing WoW, even though I play. It's a little like, if you have enough room on your resume to list this, then there's some serious short comings. On the other hand, if you were a Raid Leader or GM of one of THE TOP WoW guilds, then it might be something to consider bringing up in the interview based on the conversation. Even then, I wouldn't put it on the resume and clearly wouldn't read like
2005 to Present - GM in the most popular MMO on the planet.
Managed a large team of diverse people across the world. Responsible for recruiting, firing. Excellent organization time management skills and an elixir master to boot. Max level in all professions. Manages a stable of alts for any situation.
It's funny how sports teams, colleges, other hobbies etc. are relatively fair topics of discussion, but there's a little stigmatization with games and MMOs and I'm sure as the population ages and every hiring manager has played WoW, in 10-20 years, if any WoW players have jobs then, it might be different.
Patrick May 7th 2011 2:52PM
No you shouldn't, although during an interview you might want to bring it up (if you are feeling good about the interview) that you did run a guild and successfully.
Being a former GM myself, it's taught me a lot about leadership, organization and finding the resources to get things done on a tight schedule and budget (people). Employers who understand that would value this.
However, it's almost imperative to indicate that you aren't a GM anymore. People who understand the skills you acquired will appreciate them only as long as you aren't *still* a GM. If you're going to be working for someone, then last thing they want to hear is that you spend a bunch of your time managing a guild, as obviously you will be doing guild admin stuff on your spare time even at work.
Mark May 7th 2011 3:05PM
As someone who does work in HR, has interviewed people for different jobs and does coach his staff when they apply for promotion; would I put guild leadership on a CV? Probably not but if someone I was interviewing used it as an example in a competancy based exercise they I would look upon it no less favourably than those using examples based around 'real' sports or other hobbies.
RetPallyJil May 7th 2011 3:29PM
Things I'd mention at a job interview:
1 - 1000 everything else
1001 - I led a WoW guild for four and half years
1002 - I went bankrupt a few years ago
Does that answer your question?
Nipah May 7th 2011 3:30PM
Unless the question "How are you at dealing with irate, irrational, unsociable, egotistical, stubborn, rude people?" comes up, I wouldn't bother.
Sally Bowls May 7th 2011 4:02PM
Of course not.
Darasen May 7th 2011 4:39PM
No. Sorry but there is a large difference between dealing with people in a game and leading people IRL.
paraka321 May 7th 2011 6:32PM
If you're doing it right, they're actually quite close.
It also depends on the work environment. But working as an officer in a guild has felt like the jobs I've worked in the past...Only online instead of in person.
Trisnic May 7th 2011 6:44PM
I would not list my guild leadership, which has most definitely improved my leadership skills, on a resume, because I realize that the majority of people do not understand what it takes to leading a stable, progression raiding guild, let alone what it even is.
I would list my 8 years of running my own business. Actually, I may list leading a WoW guild as a hobby but even then that is a lot of explaining so I would probably leave it off.
Jabadabadana May 7th 2011 8:49PM
I keep being bothered by the responses here, and I think I can condense it into one issue:
RL vs WoW.
Basically, for many people here, the other players in this game are digital avatars. Despite knowing that they themselves are a human being, they don't really extend that same belief to the other players around them. Things have to be physical to be real.
Of course, other players are in fact physical, real life people, with real life issues and concerns. However, a recurring theme in the comments is that people, even gamers, don't believe that about their fellows.
I find a great many issues in real life that have exact parallels in how people interact in game. Group dynamics operate under similar methods because at the end of the day, people are people. Anonymity and lack of repercussions, do in fact change how we act on the net, but it also makes the system purer. Those who can hold the attention and lead 9-50 other human beings have to be able to do it in an environment in which those people can walk away.
As for using WoW as on one's resume being grasping for straws... it probably is.
But how much of the player base is 16-25, and thus has little or no real job experience to list? The old Catch 22 of need experience to get experience applies here, and I would ask a reasonable human being which is better... no experience, or non-standard experience?
Hylson May 7th 2011 9:54PM
This is a huge Catch-22. As one of the multiple folks here who've have done hiring before, I'd suggest the following things:
1. Don't mention WoW specifically. Say you'e a Community Manager for an Online Community with X people involved. (e.g. you guild of ten doesn't really matter much, but if you're organizing events for 100+ people, it's a big deal). This goes for any game, really. Abstract out the really important parts. You managed schedules, resources (material and human), and so forth. Make sure they're quantifiable and linked to the job you're applying for.
2. Do not put an hour value on this. Here's the Catch part. Being a WoW player myself, although having the experience will get them in the door, the first question I ask them is, "Are you still active?" Because if they are, I can't consider them. Here's why: I've noticed that successful guilds are soul-sucking endeavors the likes I've seen accomplished only by church groups staffed entirely be retired people with too much time on their hands. If you're successful enough to list this on your resume and actually have it matter, then you're not going to be focused on what I need you to be focused on. Any good manager is going to want to know that the hiring organization is absolutely going to be number one in your priority queue, and being told "I'm raiding right now" when I call you at 8 pm because we've got a last-minute meeting the next morning with a principal and I need you to work on updating some presentations is not acceptable.
Finally, job hunting sucks. But if you've got significant volunteer experience, it can be beneficial. Finding ways to show how you tied your online experience into more localized impact can be huge, too. Did you use your ability to organize events to do a Child's Play drive for your guild or server? Find ways to do what you do with impact. It does make a difference.
Celeb May 8th 2011 3:25AM
I didn't put WoW on my resumé, but when it came to the phone interview and the interviewer asked me about my leadership experiences, I didn't think twice. I told him about my experience as a guild officer, trying to appease 60+ members plus 20+ raiders. He was very interested in it, asking me lots of questions, and I ended up getting the job. But the company I was interviewing for was a tech company, that has a startup spirit, very young. If it were a more traditional company, I would have thought twice and probably wouldn't have said anything.
Eamara May 20th 2011 2:15PM
I mentioned it on my CV, explaining all the ways it has improved my work ethic. I have a picture of me with Ghostcrawler at the midnight release of Cataclysm as my profile picture on Facebook, so if I was googled that would be the first thing they see.
I got an awesome job with plenty of prospects for career advancement. Whether WoW helped I don't know, it wasn't something that was talked about in the interview. But it certainly didn't make things worse. Now I regularly wear my many WoW shirts to work on casual fridays, with no problems whatsoever.
Sure, my experience is very personal. Maybe not everyone will have the same experience. But while people hide their love for WoW in the closet and refuse to mention the positive impact it has on so many lives, we'll never get away from this 'games are for losers' stereotype. Be proud of who you are. Don't hide away for fear of being ostracized. Otherwise society will never advance past the stereotype, and we'll all be the worse off for it.
David May 8th 2011 5:34AM
I've talked about it on an interview and it helped me get a second interview.
Lipstick May 8th 2011 6:14AM
To a certain extent, leadership experience - is leadership experience. Where wow runs into trouble on a resume comes down to two areas - social stigma, and the lack of it being a professional reference. They can't exactly call up Ghostcrawler to fact check any of your experience or verify your experience now can they? The other real issue besides the lack of public knowledge about wow -- or the only public knowledge being somewhat bad -- is that all guild leadership experience will vary.
All guilds are different, and what you've learned about leading -- or how involved in the process you really were varies wildly. For example the GM of a leveling guild which is full of mostly alts who rarely log on -- is going to have a very different experience -- then say -- the GM of any top 20 guilds in the US for wow would have.
For this reason I would recommend doing one of two things -if you want to use this experience- either omit from the resume -- but mention/bring it up in your interview in some way -- perhaps as one of the examples you use to illustrate your qualifications -- most employers want examples -- not blanket "I'm a hard worker" statements. This experience could work very well as a personal anecdote.
If you really would like to include it on your resume include it in a "real life about you" information section, or "non professional experience" section. Some applications or resumes include non professional information to make you seem like a more genuine person.