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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsAsk the Devs Round 9 wants your tanking questions
by Matthew Rossi 
May 25th 2011 at 3:00PM
Whatever your questions are, now is your chance to answer them. So go! Go, my legion of the tanks, go and get the developers' aggro and do not let it go until your questions are answered!
The news is already rolling out for the upcoming WoW Patch 4.2! Preview the new Firelands raid, marvel at the new legendary staff, and get the inside scoop on new quest hubs -- plus new Tier 12 armor!Filed under: Druid, Paladin, Warrior, Analysis / Opinion, News items, Death Knight, Cataclysm
Reader Comments (Page 3 of 4)
Noyou May 25th 2011 4:13PM
Probably about the same time we can "vote kick" you from wow insider. Ever heard of the phrase negativity breeds negativity? Ok maybe I just made that up but if you have a negative mindset it's going to follow you. You do raise a valid point that if someone goes "AFK" you should be able to remove them. However if someone joins a dungeon and legitimately has to go afk for 2-3 min I don't think that deserves a vote kick. And especially if they zone in AFK (essentially being AFK after accepting the random queue. Yeah there are a lot of people out there who might not acquiesce to your charming personality. But if you go into every random queue thinking/hoping/praying you don't get hooked up with "an idiot" your mindset is already geared for that and already preparing for the confrontation. I can't tell you how to play your game but I can tell you running into a brick wall isn't the best solution. And I seriously hope Blizzard never gives that much power to any one person. WoW has been becoming increasingly more anti-social since the revamp of LFD. I don't think that wise for any MMO.
Kar On E May 25th 2011 4:20PM
See Stella, the problem with that plan is that there is already a ton of "problem" tanks out there. I can't even count the number of times I've seen someone queue up as a tank and then demand that someone else do the tanking for them. If not, they hang around until the vote kick option is up or pull and /leavegroup.
And really, I've yet to truly see any bad DPS actually break up a group. Usually someone else picks up the slack for a bit, then the DPS gets vote-kicked when the chance comes up.
Pam May 25th 2011 4:35PM
As a resto druid, I seem to be pulling ads off the tanks a lot on Maloriak. I have shadowmeld on my Nelf (2 min cd), but my Worgen doesn't have a way to drop aggro, and the tanks always seem to struggle with keeping aggro on all those ads.
The tank can be fully epic'd out, and I still, from across the room, pull healing aggro. (Of course, this appears to be a druid issue, as my priest doesn't pull healing aggro nearly as bad, if ever).
What kind of tools will be available in the future to allow healers to be able to drop aggro, or, what kind of tools will be available to allow tanks to keep higher than the healers on the threat table?
TallMan May 25th 2011 5:00PM
I'd say it's the tank's responsibility to touch all the mobs in a reasonable time. I've found that just one tap from thunderclap/blood boil/swipe/hammer of righteous is enough to remove the threat of healer aggro, or at least keep the mob's attention long enough to get in some more hits. I agree that initial healer aggro can be a challenge to deal with, but unless the devs want to create a new attack with a 200 yard aoe that does half a point of threat like all heals have, everyone will just have to be clever about handling it.
collagen May 25th 2011 4:45PM
Kind of the opposite of a tanking question, but will DKs/other classes that don't have one ever get a threat reduction ability/talent? Queuing as DPS and subsequently tanking on every pull regardless of tank quality is frustrating.
dru.reuther May 25th 2011 5:16PM
As a Blood/Frost DK my advise to bursty DPS types who can or believe its their right to open a fight with a max effort NUKE ....... count to three after the tank engages before you push your scorched_earth_macro .... its amazing; you will still be at the top of what you really care about... The all mighty Meter and (here is the best part) no ugly mob will chase you down and force you to lift your eyes from your sky rocketing climb on the damage meter!
Its brilliantly effective.
That is until you die from standing in the green stuff the healer was yelling at you to avoid before the pull.
Sunaseni May 25th 2011 5:26PM
You're not pulling threat, you're off-tanking and making the tank take less damage! =D
It'd be nice, but I consider it a fact of life at this point. Badass Frost DK waits a bit, then starts hitting. Turns out he didn't wait enough. Only two ways to go, down, or up. I prefer just plain killing the thing that's beating up on me.
noel mcleod May 25th 2011 5:02PM
"I can't even count the number of times I've seen someone queue up as a tank and then demand that someone else do the tanking for them." What is "do the tanking". I HATE marking, and often don't like being lead in a PUG. I often run with a guildie where I ask them (the guildie) to mark for me (because she knew the fights better) and had someone tell me I was a "fail tank". Huh? Did we wipe? No. Did anyone die? No. Did the healer have to be uber-awesome? No. Did you not notice that the person doing the marking was in the same guild as me? Apparently not ...
A tank's job is to engage the mobs and hold aggro (assuming DPS aren't stupid). They don't have to be lead, especially if there is someone better suited.
Astoreth May 25th 2011 5:59PM
Did it not occur to you that perhaps the tank is ALSO building his tank set?
LFD etiquette says you have priority on gear suited to the role for which you queued. As a DPS, you should not be rolling on tank gear unless/until the tank says he doesn't want it. Period. If you want to build a tank set out of LFD, then invest in some starter crafted/reputation/JP tank gear and queue as a tank.
Astoreth May 25th 2011 6:10PM
Oh c'mon, comment system, what did I ever do to you?!
raingod May 25th 2011 6:00PM
That will happen when Tanks like you stop ego tripping and thinking they
re the only one in a group who can do anything.
Kar On E May 25th 2011 6:07PM
Noel,
I agree, and I wouldn't consider someone that doesn't mark mobs a "fail tank." Frankly, I'm much happier when a tank does that rather than just charge in and hope that the mess clears itself out. What you're talking about there is the leader which doesn't have to be the tank IMHO.
No, when I talk about someone demanding that I (or someone else) tank for them, I'm referring to the idiots who do just that. The ones that queue up as a tank, get selected as a tank, then turn around once the group zones in and decides not to. The conversation usually goes something like this:
"kar u tank."
"Um...I'm in caster gear. And you queued as tank."
"so? u tank. my dps is l33t!"
ahsanali May 25th 2011 6:17PM
It sounds like your tank isn't tagging those mobs. For instance if you have a warrior tank and he spreads a rend to the new mobs with blood and thunder, and then keeps refreshing rend with a new TC on the pack he's tanking there is no way he'll lose aggro to a healer.
What may be happening with you is, your tank taunts a mob off you (which raises your tank's threat to match yours, and keeps the mob on him for six seconds) then goes back to another mob. Six seconds later, the taunt effect wears off and the mob comes after you as you've been building healing aggro in the meantime.
The fix would be for your tank to actively slap the mob a few times or get a dot/consecrate/dnd/disease ticking on the mob. Its not tough, but does need the tank to pay attention and know the fight.
Blayze May 25th 2011 7:50PM
Can someone please ask why there's Hit and Expertise on at least three items of tanking plate so far, including on a gun--since last I checked I wasn't a Death Knight and thus wasn't reliant on Death Strikes hitting.
I mean, every effort so far seems to have been made to force us away from threat stats and towards survivability stats--so why they're crapping useless stats onto my gear is beyond me.
Nick May 25th 2011 8:36PM
Can I has a refund for my agility ring please?
Yours,
Confused Pally.
Ps agility = dodge makes lots of sense, more than str = parry. Why the change?
Koleckai May 26th 2011 8:55AM
I don't even expect worthwhile or difficult questions to be answered. The Ask the Devs series seems more like marketing fluff than actually trying to answer customer concerns.
dannyleitner May 26th 2011 9:55AM
Will there be a legendary tanking shield from Deathwing, or in any of the following expansions?!
Didax May 26th 2011 10:38AM
I find it amusing that just a few weeks ago in a discussion about the LFD system, Stella made almost the exact same post (albeit slightly less rant-y) and was upvoted to blue almost immediately.
The point is, back when there was no LFD, the "lead" generally went to the tank. This combined with realm-only dungeons provided for much less bad behavior in PuGs.
I think the bigger issue is the anonymity factor, but giving tanks the ability to kick problem players would likely increase the number of "good" tanks in the dungeon finder. Even as a raid-geared tank, I for one would actually start queing for dungeons again FOR FUN.
Pugging in a dungeon right now as a tank is about the LEAST fun I can have in game, and that's just due to problem players. With a modicum of control, perhaps people would think twice before being jerks.
Yes, there are problem tanks out there that would abuse their power. But I think it's a step in the right direction towards improving player's attitudes.
coville May 26th 2011 1:44PM
Just to make sure we are on the same page, I have a DK tank and have never ninja-ed a tank gear with. I openly tell the tank that I plan to roll on tank gear if it drops. I usually only DPS when I am tired of tanking and want a break.
Secondly, the comments here show why I want the feature to force tanks to stop whinning and get to tanking.
Third, I have seen many tanks roll on DPS gear and then say, "I'm doing all the work as a tank I get to roll on whatever I want". The door to jerkville swings both ways.
In conclusion. As a DPS I come across more tanks that whine than DPS ninjas when I tank. I can't tell you the number of times I get the "your a cool tank" comment at the end of a run because so many tanks have become prima donnas over gear rolls.
This is a game people, drop if your not having fun. Don't get attached to an item until you win the roll, then it is yours to do with as you please.
nuk May 26th 2011 1:52PM
tank need free hit/exp from talents (wasnt a question i know)