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8-01-2011 @ 9:33AM
Sometimes a guild's desire for a 'lack of drama' (read: inability to criticize players who are not doing their job) conflicts with their desire for progress. The 'new guy' might simply be saying what everyone is thinking. Several things struck me about the OP's letters: The lack of time to raid time, the lack of time to spend grinding for gear, and their apparent performance issues.The OP said, "I will say I haven't wiped a boss we had on farm." That means the OP has wiped a boss that they were trying to progress on. If these 'mistakes' are consistent (and by the OP's own admission, they seem to be), the other players in a progression-minded raid environment are going to resent the player causing them - especially if that same player isn't grinding heroics for the gear necessary to get the gear they need for raiding. Think about it: You have a player who logs in once a week to raid, who isn't working to upgrade their gear outside of raids, and who is causing wipes on progression bosses. Even the most drama-free raid-team is going to resent having to carry that kind of player.If all the new guy is doing is making indirect comments about inadequate healing and trying to arrange healing to compensate for carrying an under-geared, under-prepared player, I'd say his patience with the OP is a lot higher than would be the case with a lot of progression raiders.The Drama Mama's are right: Talk to your guild leader (and possibly the other officers) without the benefit of your hugbox (ie: the GM's wife) cushioning you from what very well may be a hard truth: You might need to step back and let someone else have an opportunity to raid if you are unable to put in the time and energy needed to progress at this time.
8-01-2011 @ 9:40AM
Good lord. The typos, they abound./goes to retrieve coffee
8-01-2011 @ 10:21AM
^ThisIt's an unfortunate fact that there are very few players who are both (1) Competent to evaluate other raider's play, (2) Confident enough to speak up with appropriate criticism, and (3) Courteous enough to do so without coming off as "That Guy."It's unfortunate that this "That Guy" is as much of a jerk as he is (reported to be), but Hurt Healadin seems like he's more out of place than he realizes. Raiding once a week and not making up the VP difference with Zulsjust isn't reasonable for a guild trying to make "progression," whatever your definition of the word is.
8-01-2011 @ 10:53AM
I agree with your sentiment about self-examination re: playtime etc., but I think most people have wiped a group on a progression fight. Unless you're on wipe # 23456, chances are that you're still getting the mechanics down as a group. So long as it's not the 12th instance of the same mistake, by the same person, complaining and blame gaming is counter productive.Wrath trained us all to be much less fault tolerant. Towards the end you could bang out 5 heroics in an hour and a half, then pile into ICC, on your 4th alt, with a PuG, and roll up (at least) the first half of it without breaking a sweat, raiding became a game you couldn't lose. Mostly you ran out of time, or got bored, and that's when you stopped. That state of affairs lasted quite a while, and now the pendulum has swung back, somewhat. The raiding game has simultaneously become more difficult and more accessible than ever. The patience we lost in Wrath hasn't quite returned to us, and expectations are higher than ever. It's a no-win for a guys like Hurt. Regarding something LynMars said above; good back-ups are a fabulous thing to have, and hard to come by. It's what I do. I told my guildies right up front that my time was kind of limited, and that as much as I'd like to make every night I simply can't. I struck deal whereby I always, always, always, am available when I say I am, and I sit if the entire regular group shows. I think I sat out once, maybe. It's likely easier for me to do that as a DPS, I went Shadow for Cata after healing since BC, but it may be an option for Hurt.
8-01-2011 @ 11:09AM
I disagree that passive aggressive criticism is a sign of patience. In this case, it seems more like cowardice or reveling in causing someone else distress. I'd much rather have someone call me out directly than beat around the bush while tapping me on the head and giggling.
8-01-2011 @ 11:23AM
@Zubbiefish:I don't mean the usual wipes while learning a fight, or the understandable, occasional accident that happens to everyone.I'm talking about "That Guy" who only shows up on raid night, undergeared and underprepared, expecting to raid.Not running heroics means that his gear is likely inadequate. It also means that he is learning Cataclysm play mechanics (healers and tanks were hit especially hard with the 're-learn your role' hammer this expansion) during the raid rather than in heroics.That combination of undergeared and underskilled is deadly to progression. It means that at best the guild is nine-manning the fight, and at worst means they are being killed by someone standing where they shouldn't be standing.If all of the healers are going OOM halfway through the boss fight, then the DPS is probably standing in the fire.But if one healer is going OOM (or worse, letting their heal assignment die) before the others, then something is usually wrong.If that healer is undergeared and refuses to gear up outside of raids (regardless of their reasoning), it's unfair to ask the rest of the raid to suffer repair bills and wasted time just to carry them and gear them up - especially when the other nine or twenty-four people have likely been grinding heroics in order to get themselves ready.Ultimately, what I'm saying is this: The hotshot might be "That Guy" for speaking up about the OP's failings, but the OP is also "That Guy" for not holding up his end of the raiding bargain.
8-01-2011 @ 11:32AM
@Matt P:I agree that I would rather someone call me out than beat around the bush.But many, many casual raiding guilds have a 'no drama' policy that doesn't let people do that.While it prevents name-calling and naming names in a harmful manner, it often also creates an environment where useful or necessary criticisms are seen as 'stirring up drama.'There is a difference between helpful and harmful critiques, but these sorts of guild policies often don't differentiate.It is also possible that "the hotshot" is trying to nudge the OP into doing the things the OP obviously needs to do, like run heroics for gear. He may even think he is being polite by not calling the guy out by name, but simply saying, "Healing is inadequate for our goals, we need to gear the healers up." In the end, it seems that the OP wants to blame the new guy for creating a hostile raiding environment while the OP continues to rest on his ICC laurels, expecting the guild to both pat him on the head for showing up once a week while carrying him through the new content.That seems like a far more selfish thing than anything the new guy has done.
8-01-2011 @ 12:23PM
@Gendoubutthatswrong.jpg"It is also possible that "the hotshot" is trying to nudge the OP into doing the things the OP obviously needs to do, like run heroics for gear."If you read, Healadin stated that he could only raid 1 night a week due to real life concerns, and really couldn't run heroics that often either. If he or she has a full time job, kids, other social priorities, ect., you can't expect them to drop everything just to go grind heroics. If their guild thinks their gear is good enough, then it IS good enough. Real life > WoW.That Guy is probably the guy with multiple 85s, all geared to the teeth (due to the fact he probably has nothing to do most of the time) and expects everyone else to be able to do the time with much less time. I'd simply tell him to HELP his fellow guild members out, not tell them that they suck and need better gear. Being passive aggressive can ruin many things.
8-01-2011 @ 12:53PM
@Duffman:I agree that RL > WoW, but raiding is meant to be an activity that is meant for people who are committed to the game, if not time-wise, then at least effort-wise. If Healadin barely has enough time to get geared up through heroics, there are plenty of other activities he can do in-game that don't require nearly as much time and committment: random heroics, PvP, dailies, questing, achievements, collecting stuff, etc. The difference between those things and raiding is that he won't be unnecessarily handicapping people who ARE putting in the time and effort. I think what Gendou is trying to say is that Healadin and other "casual" players shouldn't expect to have their cake and eat it too at the expense of the other raiders. Of course, we don't know Healadin's situation directly, so YMMV.Just my two cents.
8-01-2011 @ 1:57PM
A "no drama" policy doesn't mean people can't talk to the raid leader to have him/her talk to the problem player.Geared Shadow priest not pulling nearly the DPS she should be? Point out their meters to the Raid Lead so he can get someone on that to help. Someone's gemmed/reforged/enchanting incorrectly or not at all? Point it out to the raid lead so he or someone he assigns can handle it diplomatically, rather than having player A get jumped by random other team members."No drama casual guild" does NOT mean "never ever critiques or helps people who are lagging behind to improve." It just means it's handled by the appropriate guild/raid team channels at the proper times, not during the raid itself via snide remarks and snippy comments everyone knows are directed even if they don't name names, even if they're thinking it themselves.There's being a team player, and then there's being a jerk to make yourself look cooler to the team. Same as there's being a team player, and knowing when to sit out or stick to back up/alt runs if time to gear and practice are an issue.
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