Gold Capped: Dealing with Neutral Auction House sniping
Every week, WoW Insider brings you Gold Capped, in which Basil "Euripides" Berntsen aims to show you how to make money on the auction house. Email Basil with your questions, comments, or hate mail!
Neutral auction house sniping is the practice of lurking at the neutral auction house (which is usable by both factions) until someone tries to use it to move items from one of their characters to another across factions, and then stealing it. Unlike someone who ninjas a mount in a PUG, this type of theft is totally OK with Blizzard -- all the sniper is doing is buying a posted auction.
How does this constitute theft?
The neutral auction house serves one main purpose in this game: It is the only way items can cross between the Horde and Alliance markets on a realm. It doesn't seem to have been built for this, though, as you need a second account or a friend to bid on the auctions you create. The neutral AH is an exact replica of the normal faction AH in every way but one: It costs three times as much to use. The high deposit and auction house cut, along with its relatively remote location, means that the neutral AH is almost never used to find a buyer for something.
Cross-faction arbitrage is the business of moving goods from one faction to another if there's a shortage (and a higher price) on one of the factions. It can be good money, but it's a lot less if you have to pay that 15% AH cut. Faced with the sure loss of 15% of their profit margin, most people work out a "solution": Simply list the items for 1 copper and avoid paying any AH fee! Unfortunately, this exposes their listing to snipers. What they're actually doing is betting that their auction won't get sniped, and every time they're right, they win back their 15%. Unfortunately, every time they're wrong, they lose the entire value of their shipment.
Avoiding the 15% fee is as much of as risk as leaving your car running with the door unlocked after buying a big-screen TV -- more, actually, because the police won't help you get your BOE epic back. It's not against the rules to buy an auction, even if the seller didn't intend you to buy it. It certainly feels like this should be considered theft to anyone who's just had their stock taken, but the short answer is that they should have played it safe and "sold" the item to themselves for some amount they'd be willing to let a sniper pay.
Boom, headshot!
With the native AH interface, snipers can simply click the search button every few seconds and buy out any good deals they see as quickly as possible. There's usually less than one page on the neutral AH, making this an extremely simple proposition. If they happen to have Auctioneer, it's less than a half hour to set up a real-time searcher that will pop up a one-click buy window every time an auction matching their parameters is found. It's unreasonable to assume that anyone capable of configuring an addon as notoriously finicky and annoying as Auctioneer is incapable of keybinding the "buy" button and somehow managing to have it pressed repeatedly for hours at a time.
Protection
There is no protection from this practice. As long as people are willing to go to neutral auction houses and buy out auctions that weren't intended for them, cross-faction arbitrage will be a risk. There are, however, several tactics that can be used against these people. They're hopefully not breaking any rules, so I won't either.
How to fix it
This problem would go away if Blizzard allowed players to do what they're already doing without having to misuse the neutral auction house. If Blizzard allowed cross-faction mailing of goods with a 15% fee, the poor, neglected neutral AH could go back to having a simple page of fish auctions. Now, I know this might sound easy to players, but remember that Blizzard doesn't have an easy way of determining "market value" to base that 15% on. It could replace this with a fee based on vendor value or a flat fee, though.
Additionally, it could implement persistent want-to-buys. This would mean that the only risk of moving goods across the neutral AH would be that the wrong person sells you their goods.
This would have the effect of evening out prices for a lot of types of goods on each of the two economies, but the extent to which they're evened out would depend on how heavily the transfer was "taxed." It would also be another welcome gold sink to help combat the ridiculous hyperinflation we've seen of late.
Maximize your profits with more advice from Gold Capped. Do you have questions about selling, reselling, and building your financial empire on the auction house? Fox and Basil are taking your questions at fox@wowinsider.com and basil@wowinsider.com.
Neutral auction house sniping is the practice of lurking at the neutral auction house (which is usable by both factions) until someone tries to use it to move items from one of their characters to another across factions, and then stealing it. Unlike someone who ninjas a mount in a PUG, this type of theft is totally OK with Blizzard -- all the sniper is doing is buying a posted auction.
How does this constitute theft?
The neutral auction house serves one main purpose in this game: It is the only way items can cross between the Horde and Alliance markets on a realm. It doesn't seem to have been built for this, though, as you need a second account or a friend to bid on the auctions you create. The neutral AH is an exact replica of the normal faction AH in every way but one: It costs three times as much to use. The high deposit and auction house cut, along with its relatively remote location, means that the neutral AH is almost never used to find a buyer for something.
Cross-faction arbitrage is the business of moving goods from one faction to another if there's a shortage (and a higher price) on one of the factions. It can be good money, but it's a lot less if you have to pay that 15% AH cut. Faced with the sure loss of 15% of their profit margin, most people work out a "solution": Simply list the items for 1 copper and avoid paying any AH fee! Unfortunately, this exposes their listing to snipers. What they're actually doing is betting that their auction won't get sniped, and every time they're right, they win back their 15%. Unfortunately, every time they're wrong, they lose the entire value of their shipment.
Avoiding the 15% fee is as much of as risk as leaving your car running with the door unlocked after buying a big-screen TV -- more, actually, because the police won't help you get your BOE epic back. It's not against the rules to buy an auction, even if the seller didn't intend you to buy it. It certainly feels like this should be considered theft to anyone who's just had their stock taken, but the short answer is that they should have played it safe and "sold" the item to themselves for some amount they'd be willing to let a sniper pay.
Boom, headshot!
With the native AH interface, snipers can simply click the search button every few seconds and buy out any good deals they see as quickly as possible. There's usually less than one page on the neutral AH, making this an extremely simple proposition. If they happen to have Auctioneer, it's less than a half hour to set up a real-time searcher that will pop up a one-click buy window every time an auction matching their parameters is found. It's unreasonable to assume that anyone capable of configuring an addon as notoriously finicky and annoying as Auctioneer is incapable of keybinding the "buy" button and somehow managing to have it pressed repeatedly for hours at a time.
Protection
There is no protection from this practice. As long as people are willing to go to neutral auction houses and buy out auctions that weren't intended for them, cross-faction arbitrage will be a risk. There are, however, several tactics that can be used against these people. They're hopefully not breaking any rules, so I won't either.
- Canary auction Put up a single auction of something somewhat valuable, but not so valuable that you're unwilling to lose it. A stack of ore, perhaps, maybe a BOE from two tiers ago. Leave it up for a minute before you try to move some real payload over, and if it gets bought, shut your operation down.
- Chaff While the neutral auction in its natural, pristine state will have maybe a page of auctions (fish, crafted greens, etc.), you can easily find something cheap and plentiful to post thousands of auctions of. Bury your actual payload in the middle of it, and you might confuse snipers long enough to get one past them. If they're using the auctioneer real-time searcher method, you need to hope that they've defined a really stupidly simple searcher that flags any cheap auctions. That will mean that they have to decline hundreds of auctions before they get to yours, unless they stop the searcher and redefine it. If you're really lucky, they left their drinking bird on the keyboard with a stupid searcher, and you'll leave several thousand useless items clogging up their mailbox. Empty that at 50 per minute, Mr. AFK Sniper.
- Brute force If you're on a PVP realm, just gank them -- and/or the auctioneer they're using, if it's a PVE realm.
How to fix it
This problem would go away if Blizzard allowed players to do what they're already doing without having to misuse the neutral auction house. If Blizzard allowed cross-faction mailing of goods with a 15% fee, the poor, neglected neutral AH could go back to having a simple page of fish auctions. Now, I know this might sound easy to players, but remember that Blizzard doesn't have an easy way of determining "market value" to base that 15% on. It could replace this with a fee based on vendor value or a flat fee, though.
Additionally, it could implement persistent want-to-buys. This would mean that the only risk of moving goods across the neutral AH would be that the wrong person sells you their goods.
This would have the effect of evening out prices for a lot of types of goods on each of the two economies, but the extent to which they're evened out would depend on how heavily the transfer was "taxed." It would also be another welcome gold sink to help combat the ridiculous hyperinflation we've seen of late.
Filed under: Gold Capped







Reader Comments (Page 1 of 5)
Tai Aug 19th 2011 9:08AM
I had this happen to me once. I am usually really fast on transferring, and don't price stuff at 1 copper. I messaged the toon and complained and mentioned how fast he had snipped it. He then bragged about how he was using a hack to do it, and had been caught before with no consequences. Well, it took me a while to get a gm to pay attention to the fact that the player had admitted to hacking in a tell. I never got my item back but I so hope he got a ban out of it.
Grumpy Wow Guy Aug 20th 2011 1:02AM
People use the terms "hack" and "hacker" very loosely. It's extremely likely that he was just using one of the many (perfectly legal) Auction House addon's.
If he really used a real hack, and blizz caught him, then he sure would have been banned on the spot.
Lloren Aug 19th 2011 9:12AM
The way I've always used the neutral AH is by having a friend that I trust stand by at the auctioneer, preferably one that is also on RealID. I let them know what I'm posting, how much it's posting for, and the exact moment it posts, so they can immediately buy it as soon as I put it up. It's always worked for me.
Svylva Aug 19th 2011 9:41AM
I do the same. Loads of cross-faction transfers and we've never been snipped.
Kunikenwad! Aug 19th 2011 9:55AM
I always coincide my neutral transfers with money transfers. Say my Horde buddy needs to borrow around a 1000g and I need to move an item to my Horde shaman (like my Tankards O' Terror for upcoming transmogrification). I'll just use my buddy, post it up for 1000g, I get the item, he keeps the gold. Win-win! That way no one will snipe it.
Cambro Aug 19th 2011 10:49AM
What are you going to spiff the Tankards into?
Eyhk Aug 19th 2011 11:04AM
test
Kunikenwad! Aug 19th 2011 11:04AM
@Cambro
No my friend, you misunderstand! I'm spiffing my axe/mace combo INTO tankards! HUZZAH! No goblin shaman (or dwarf shaman) should be without his TANKARDS O TERROR!
Eyhk Aug 19th 2011 11:06AM
Wow... for some reason I cannot say
"You mean 850g since the neutral AH takes a 15% cut..."
but my stupid "test" post goes through?
Eyhk Aug 19th 2011 11:11AM
Damn you
Ku
ni
k
en
w
ad!
I can't post using your name without getting my comment flagged for review
terph Aug 19th 2011 2:08PM
Indeed. We've usually done this side-by-side or over the phone whenever possible. Esp before faction transfer. My bf and my best-gaming buddy both had alliance characters with well established inventories and gold that needed to be transferred. We were highly paranoid about it, so I was on refresh duty while they posted.
Sleutel Aug 19th 2011 7:13PM
I use this method (with the friend on Ventrilo or Mumble, so the coordination is even easier), or an alt on another account (back when I had two), with both accounts logged in simultaneously in separate windows.
In what's probably hundreds of cross-faction transactions, I think I've had exactly one auction sniped, and that was a mistake on the part of the buyer--they immediately tracked me down and returned the item.
coville Aug 19th 2011 9:17AM
Cross faction gear item transfer should be easy enough for blizzard to set up through an NPC goblin somewhere. Maybe have a set fee based on vendor value of the item.
I don't see how cross faction item swaps would negatively effect the game so there should not be a reason for Blizzard to keep this out.
g2g591 Aug 19th 2011 1:34PM
it affects the economy. Take my low pop very faction imbalanced server as an extreme example. Here there are about 4 horde players for every alliance. This means things are much more scarce on the alliance side, and therefore more expensive (supply and demand etc) . If one could easily transfer items cross faction, I could buy a bunch of boes Horde side then sell them for a much higher price Alliance side (and then if i so wanted I could post an auction of something on my horde toon on the neutral AH for as much as I wanted to send back over+the AH cut)
Eirik Aug 19th 2011 5:01PM
g2g591, you're on Chromaggus?
Dadanox Aug 19th 2011 9:29AM
I have both my account and son's open and ready. I preload the search on my son's account so that I can search for and buyout my auction as fast as I post it.
The other option when simply moving profits over to your other faction alts (still need to utilize a second account) is to put up a junk item like food for a very high price like 15k. You eat the AH fee, but there is no risk of sniping.
Spellotape Aug 19th 2011 9:32AM
I usually just /who the zones of the neutral AHs on whichever side I'm buying from and if no one is around then I proceed. Of course, someone could be browsing from the mobile AH, but I've yet to lose anything ...
Tony Aug 19th 2011 9:33AM
I don't know, personally I think there should be risks involved for something like this. It's not much different than similar things in real life -- if you want to get around the way something is set up, there's going to be things that might not go according to plan.
Oteo Aug 19th 2011 10:20AM
I agree that there should be an element of risk. If Blizzard wanted people to be able to easily move goods between factions, they wouldn't have made separate auction houses, prevented you from buying your own auctions on the same account, or made it so that you can't mail items between your opposite-faction alts. The system is clearly intentional and not in need of fixing: goblins need to accept that they incur a risk by manipulating game mechanics to bypass these obstacles. I can understand a guide to minimizing risk, but I thought equating sniping to stealing and the inclusion of a "how to fix it" section smacked of a sense of entitlement, as if it's Blizzard's responsibility to ensure your mechanics-bypassing transactions are 100% safe.
JattTheRogue Aug 20th 2011 5:27AM
Definitely agree with both of these comments. It's a huge "We do not condone this practice and will make it as difficult as possible without outlawing it" signal from Blizzard that you can't buy your own auctions with the same account. Trying to work around it is a risk, and there are people who put in time and effort to capitalize on that risk. The best way to get around it is mentioned in this post: put the item on the AH at the price for which you wouldn't mind someone else buying it. But if people don't want to spend that gold or don't have it on the toon they're trying to transfer it to, then it's on them if their auction gets sniped at a low price. It's not theft.