Is it time to kill tanking?

The tanking system has long been somewhat problematic in World of Warcraft. While it scales to some degree, from 5-man dungeons to 10-man raids, the scaling falls apart when we get to 25-man raiding, which currently demands about the same amount of tanking as 10-man. You can get through most of Firelands with two tanks, no matter your raid size. Majordomo Staghelm only requires one tank, again, no matter your raid size. This means that the scaling from five to 10 works, but as soon as you go from 10 to 25, instead of needing 2.5 times more tanks, you need no more tanks.
The other problem is simply that there already aren't enough tanks for every 5-man group. When the Call to Arms feature was announced for the Dungeon Finder tool, it was created out of the simple fact that we're not seeing the distribution we'd expect in the playerbase. In order for the Dungeon Finder to work without significant group queues, we would need 20% of the people queuing up to be tanks (1 in 5 = 20%). This is not the case.
People simply don't want the perceived group responsibility of tanking. It's why changes were made to CC mechanics that allow groups to CC on the fly without pulling. It's why Call to Arms exists. And yet, despite both of these changes, tanking was still so unattractive to players that threat itself needed to be redesigned. All of this work to try and get people to tank. Maybe the problem isn't the players here, though. Maybe it's the role.
Outnumbered two to one
There are currently four tanking specs in the game, out of 30 possible specs. This is the lowest number of specs per role. Healing has five (discipline and holy priests, resto druids, resto shaman, and holy paladins), and DPS has 22, because one of the tanking specs can also be a DPS spec (the feral druid spec). This points to an already obvious fact: DPS specs outnumber the tanking and healing specs combined by a two-to-one margin. Why is this?
Well, for starters, while healing makes a certain amount of sense to people who've played other games, the idea of the tanking figure is fairly unique to the MMO genre and has more or less existed in that genre to help make up for the games' lack of intelligence. The original tank and spank encounters were designed around the idea that the game needed help to decide who the monsters would be hitting. After all, their roots are in pen and paper RPGs like Dungeons & Dragons, but there's no game master to tell the monsters what to do.
With modern encounter design often varying wildly from this formula, one of the reasons for the tanking role has been changed or removed. Tanks often find themselves switching targets, rounding up adds, taunt swapping to clear debuffs, kiting, and in general working on aspects of a fight far removed from the old keep the big, ugly thing punching me instead of the mage aspect of the role. This complexity was even mentioned in the recent Dev Watercooler as a reason that threat was being increased so that tanks don't necessarily have to worry about threat races or having to switch targets to intercept streaming adds.
Class archetypes and character preference
Let's consider, however. With four tank specs and 22 DPS specs, we're already at a significant disadvantage in terms of picking a character that tanks versus one who does not. If you enjoy certain class archetypes such as the demon-worshiping spellcaster or the companion to animals, you're locked out of the role even if you'd like to give it a try. Of course, the argument can be made to roll an alt, but if you simply don't like death-channeling necromancers in plate or turning into a bear, then you're not going to want to do so just so you can tank. Furthermore, there are people who play those four classes who simply don't find tanking as it stands particularly compelling.
There are ways to do without tanks, of course. One way would simply to make healing changes that allowed healers to cope with a boss's switching to whoever had aggro rather than having to have a limited number of people who are talented and geared to make healing them easier and who chose abilities and stances to make enemies want to hit them. Another way would simply to make tanking a choice a class could make by picking a stance, form or presence and opening it up to more classes -- a simple trade-off (you chose to tank, you do less damage and generate more threat) that makes all sorts of classes able to tank who never tanked before. There are plenty of classes that have abilities that could be used to tank -- warlock Metamorphosis, hunter pets, shaman weapon imbues like Rockbiter and their earth elementals -- with a little modification.
What change would be enough?
Whether or not either of these options or any others are really good for the game is what should really be discussed. Is it simply a matter of not enough tanking flavor, and can that be provided without messing up tanking balance? Should tanking be reduced to a simple toggle that more classes could flip, or would that water down tanking too much? Is tanking integral to the game or an outmoded idea no longer relevant with fight design as intricate as it has become, and can you get rid of it without rendering leveling content trivial? Tanking has been with the game since its inception and has seen a lot of design work to keep it a vital role, so abandoning or redesigning it to this extent would be a huge decision. But right now, it's no longer an unthinkable change to the game.
We've tried bribing tanks, changing CC, letting the instant queues tempt them, and even reducing how much they have to juggle to get them interested. Is it enough, and even if it is, is it a sign that tanking simply isn't worth the hassle?
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Filed under: Druid, Paladin, Warrior, Analysis / Opinion, Death Knight
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Reader Comments (Page 7 of 17)
DonNochay Aug 26th 2011 1:54AM
@MattKrotzer
It's the most playable, refined MMO on the market. The proof is in the pudding.
MattKrotzer Aug 26th 2011 10:03AM
Even the Mona Lisa has a few bad brushstrokes.
Razerbug Aug 25th 2011 6:25PM
Hunter tanking FTW! I think we've been saying that all along...
Make BM a tanking spec, it's not been popular for Raiding in ages.
hp_hunter Aug 26th 2011 11:18AM
is it sad that the one time I got ranked into Worldoflogs I was using BM?
I do love dpsing as bm, but it's hard to compete againt MM's flexibility (BM on Atramedes = sad hunter) and SV (which I usually pick cause there's not a class who can provide that buff on our group).
The extra healing from a spirit beast and the bigger roster of pets to choose as a BM hunter doesn't hurt either...
Wouldn't mind if BM tree were made like something like feral tree, which supports both roles in one tree though.
Jabadabadana Aug 25th 2011 6:27PM
The problem with removing tanks, is that as long as agro exists, a tank will exist. Your biggest, baddest, dps may now be your tank, but now he's got 2 roles, to his original one.
And if you remove agro, it either becomes all aoe (dodgeable or non), or a bunch of random charging, and both massively increase the RNG factor in the game. (Which at least with the people I play with, is a bad thing)
Puntable Aug 26th 2011 10:57AM
There are some MMOs that shy away from tanks and threat. In these games, boss fights usually means whoever the boss is focused on has to "kite". It's not much fun for everyone to have to chase the mobs constantly (or run from them).
Segador Aug 25th 2011 6:28PM
Shamans used to have a semi-viable tanking spec... until recently, stone weapon increased threat. Why not let shamans have a real tank spec?
Karcharos Aug 25th 2011 6:28PM
My own suspicion is that the upcoming changes in 4.3 are step 1 (1.5?) in de-emphasizing the trinity in WoW. Blizzard is not dumb, and they've been pigeonholed by their own game structure in terms of encounter design. They also are well aware that games like Guild Wars 2 are trying to erase the trinity from their game.
There are loads of companies bringing WoW clones to market. (Hi Bioware!)[1] Why would a player with cumulative months /played jump ship to something that's barely more than a fresh coat of paint? Humans suck at being rational about sunk costs, and we value the relationships we have with others very highly.
The game that manages to iterate the fundamental gameplay of MMORPGS to something beyond Dance Dance Revolution: Finger Edition *WITHOUT* getting wedged into a niche[2] is the one that will take a big fat seven figure bite out of WoW's subs.
YMMV.
1./ I have loved me some Bioware over the years, but SWToR doesn't do anything for me.
2./ I'm not just referring to "spaceships and spreadsheets" (EVE)-type niches, either. "Only runs on relatively recent hardware that was intended for gaming" is also a niche. IMHO, one of WoW's secret and significant advantages is that it's playable on systems that have no business being used for gaming.
ventris Aug 25th 2011 6:31PM
no tank wants to deal with the retardation going on these days from people. tanking is underappreciated. DPS are a dime a dozen, devs need to stop catering to the whiners who just want no que time and free loot. 4 classes can tank and it represents pure laziness on the part of those who don't want to learn and are simply too lazy to develop an off spec and just have someone else do all the work so they can pew pew.
Schadow Aug 26th 2011 1:17AM
Like it or not, DPS represent the overwhelming majority of WoW players. Tank and healer are the niche roles.
I agree that tanks are unappreciated, but catering to tanks won't solve any problems. The problems keeping people from tanking are social ones, not design ones. Few people want the responsibility of leading the group, pulling things and controlling the flow of the fight, because when they screw up, they get heaps of hate from the DPS.
The fundamental problem is the random dungeon queue. The anonymity it provides allows people to fling hate at will with no concern of consequence. Tanks that were threat-capping DPS got blasted with hate, and it was becoming more problematic with entry-level tanks being grouped with raiding DPS running heroics for orbs or to top off valour points for the week.
So Bliz responded by increasing tank threat to the point of irrelevance. While that removes the tank hate, however, it also completely disconnects any personal relationship between a tank and his DPS.
Sure it was a pain back in BC to try to stay ahead on threat vs strong DPS, but it was also a bit fun to nervously watch KTM or Omen trying to stay ahead of them. With unlimited threat, it's a bit boring.
Rather than approaching it from a mechanics angle, Bliz should have approached it from a social one. If they added a reputation aspect to RDF, there would be consequences for those being hateful, and subsequently people would be more courteous when using the system. if you got rated down for constantly pulling agro off the tank, you would probably target off the tank a bit more, and maybe even delay a moment or two to give him a threat lead. Viola, threat problem solved.
DPS dealt with threat in BC. They had to. A mage tossing a pom-pyro on the pull was an ex-gnome. So we know they can do it. And they can do it without being asses, because they did it just fine back then.
Bliz has been systematically wiping out human interaction between people in groups. PuGs may or may not say "Hi" and "thanks all" and that's pretty much the entirety of the interaction in a random dungeon.
The tank threat changes completely obliterate the interaction between a tank and DPS. They might as well take tanks and healers out of the game and replace them with NPCs - it would make no difference at all to the majority of WoW players (DPS).
And that being the case, what it the point of an MMO? Why do you need the "multiplayer" part of it if there's no human interaction?
Instead of reducing all points of interaction, Bliz should be strengthening them. People stay playing a game because of the interaction they have with other people, not because they can mindlessly run zandoms for purples. Memorable instances are ones where people make mistakes and you still succeed. Take away the mistakes and it's no longer memorable.
Bliz needs to make threat matter. Threat was fun. The white-knuckle race to keep ahead of that damn mage made the fight memorable, not the boss dying and spilling out the same loot he did last week and the one before. When threat matters, tanking is more fun because of the interplay between people, which is after all the point of an MMO.
What they need to address is how things go when the damn mage does overtake the tank's threat. There needs to be consequences. DPS need to get 1-shot again.
And to reduce the hate for tanks who threat-cap their DPS, there needs to be a reputation gain or loss if he people in your party like or don't like you. So if the tank is bad, he can be downgraded without people having to hurl abuse. Because if people hurl abuse, they will end up being downgraded themselves.
Have reputation hurt people where it counts: The queue time. The better your rep, the faster you queue. Imagine how polite DPS would be then.
Smashbolt Aug 26th 2011 9:15AM
Tanks (and healers) are already in such high demand that they'd have to be immune to any downvoting mechanism or else a downvote for a tank is just a punishment for the DPS.
Tanks are already being pulled in instantly because they are needed RIGHT NOW. Making a downrated tank artificially wait to get in just means making three DPS wait longer for a tank to come off their time out.
And if tanks are immune to this punishment system, what's the point?
Kia Aug 25th 2011 6:30PM
I'm glad you mentioned how outnumbered tanks are, as well as a number of other possible examples. I lost interest in DK tanking when I couldn't do Frost any longer, for one, and you couldn't pay me to play a Warrior or Bear.
I was just speaking a few days ago about Enhance tanking or Metamorphosis tanking. It seems to me that Blizz made a huge mistake nerfing DK options, Enhance abilities, etc. Making LESS options for a role an already incredibly small amount of people want to play just makes me wonder how they possibly thought it was a good idea.
WeWhoEat Aug 25th 2011 6:33PM
Give the tank in a DF group the ability to rate every DPSer that was randomly queued with the Tank. This rating determines a DPSer's priority in DF queues :)
There's nothing wrong with tanking (as a concept) the problem is that random people don't care and there's no consequence to their apathy or just plain rudeness.
Pocky Aug 25th 2011 9:54PM
I think the problem with that idea is that all the asshats would abuse it, just to be an asshat, and that would invalidate the entire rating system.
After all, isn't that what asshats do for a living anyway?
redwinger_6 Aug 25th 2011 11:56PM
And when bad tank fails time and time again and blames the dps (I once pulled aggro off a tank attacking one single trash mob without firing a single shot other than autoshot, after he had already had the aggro) and/or the healer he downrates everyone, or the dps who are still learning get downrated so they never get into a group and never learn.
WeWhoEat Aug 26th 2011 12:22PM
This was obviously not a serious suggestion (I guess not everyone reads ':)' as sarcasm) but it was made to illustrate that the problem isn't with the game mechanics but with player attitudes when in a DF pug. I use my ignore list to personally banish people who've shown a bad attitude but there are always more jerks than you have room in your ignore list.
I've played games that have thrown out the trinity (tank/healer/dps) but they all feel like I'm playing a solo game in a big chat room, while still containing the frustrations and grief from bad players. I think you're looking to throw the baby out with the bathwater by getting rid of tanking while not solving any problems which really stem from bad player attitude.
Seraph Aug 25th 2011 6:35PM
At this point in the game, it is much too late to introduce such a sea change. For future games, Blizzard can definitely think about this, but you're talking about a central tenet to the very core of the game's design. Sure, you can say that Blizzard has already made vast and sweeping changes, but removing one third of the trinity is an impossibly huge shift in strategy.
That said, I have to agree with some of the other comments. People not tanking has much less to do with it being hard and much more to do with it being stressful. The sad thing is, it's really not that stressful, except that it is made that way by the people you are forced to play with if you use LFD.
thall1463 Aug 25th 2011 6:36PM
I play a paladin and would gladly offer my tanking services, but I play as Retribution. For me it seems that one of the worst things about wanting to tank is the barrier of entry. I don't have that much time to play and get geared as a tank so I just stick to playing as DPS. If there was a way for me to jump into a prot spec (or even just stay ret), throw on a shield, and start tanking I would.
Rossi seems to have a good idea with the ability to tank just attached to some kind of toggle. If I remember correctly this idea even got talked about before Cata with say the ability to not be crit by a boss being tied to Righteous Fury or Defensive Stance. This kind of change I think would at least help with the number of people able and willing to serve as tanks.
othragon Aug 25th 2011 6:37PM
Tanking is great. I thoroughly enjoy it. If i have to offspec dps on a raid i'll be bored to death. The way i see it, changing CC, adding CTA or even buffing threat were just plain mistakes. Tanking is supposed to be a responsability for those willing to endure it.
Could there be a different system? Sure, there could be new designs that roll around not needing a tank for instances or raids. Do i see it happen? Not really. The game works as it is, i don't think there's nothing wrong with the role. It's most players that want instant gratification without putting any effort into it. Those are the players that stay away from the tanking role and sadly, those are the majority of the playerbase. So i'll quite mathew, if you know a tank, hug him and cherish him. He may not be performing his beloved role forever.
Gaurisk Aug 25th 2011 6:44PM
There are other factors I've taken into consideration, like the fact that I'm a fan of Jeff Grubb's work for TSR Hobbies and that ArenaNet's subscription-free business model doesn't dictate that they design their game as a poorly disguised Skinner Box, but it's the deconstruction of the Holy Trinity class design model that makes Guild Wars 2 a Day 1 pre-order for me. Someone is trying something different, and that demands my enthusiastic support.
The Old Republic, by way of contrast, is dead on arrival for me, and the class design is why. I've seen this design model, I agree that it takes away from multiplayer gaming more than it adds, and putting a different set of background scenery behind it doesn't make it compelling.