Officers' Quarters: Downsized

Every Monday, Scott Andrews contributes Officers' Quarters, a column about the ins and outs of guild leadership. He is the author of The Guild Leader's Handbook, available now from No Starch Press.
Word went around this week that one of my server's long-time 25-man guilds would be switching to the 10-man format. It's a phenomenon that has become more common recently. For many guilds, fielding the number of quality raiders needed for the larger size has grown more difficult over the past few months.
Part of the reason is likely the drop in attendance during summer. Some of it could be the game's declining subscription numbers. We also can't ignore the fact that 10-man versions of Firelands bosses are, in most cases, significantly easier to beat.
This week's email comes from a player whose guild has also made this decision. In the process, he's found himself without a slot.
Hello Scott,
I am a raider in a casual/raiding guild with a bit of a problem . . . I joined this guild after running with a couple of it's members in my first pug once I hit 85. Things were really quite amazing at first, the guild runs were so well run and actually fun, which was something I rarely experienced during ICC. I was usually in the top 3 in damage on most bosses, knew my role, never had any issues with other raiders, always showed up prepared and did what I could to help the guild. Then my problem arose.
One night during a raid, I got a call that a relative was in poor health. When the raid ended, I whispered the raid lead that I may not be on the next week. The relative passed away.
My in-game problem arose when I logged in for a minute that first week and found an in-game mail from an officer admonishing me for not accepting/declining for raid on the calendar and asking "if I didn't want to raid, what the hell was I doing in the guild?"
As you can imagine I was shocked, saddened and more than a bit pissed-off reading it. After taking a minute to make sure I didn't say anything I'd regret, I whispered the officer asking why he sent the message. He said "to get me to raid" (at this point I'd missed 1 raid and had been on for probably 15 straight prior). I told him I'd messaged the raid lead about it and informed him why I hadn't been around to elaborate on when I'd be back. I told him that the in-game mail was out of line and got an apology from him. I then suggested re-thinking the wording in the future.Hi, Disappointed. I see two issues here. First, you're still aggravated by the officer's mail. I think you need to let it go. He clearly didn't know the reason why you missed the raid, or he never would have been so harsh.
So now, even though this had been a great guild to run with, my thoughts towards it are somewhat soured. Then to top it off, while I'm gone the guild decides to focus on 10's . . . I now find myself a "standby" raider since they'd formed the new core-10 while I was gone. My question is twofold.
1) Am I wrong to still be perturbed with the guild officers or was their handling of the situation as crappy as I thought it was?
2) Do I stick around and see if things improve and I get back into raids or do I move on? While I was still able to run a BWD pug this week, I don't want to just be able to run T11 content forever.
Interested on your take on this,
Disappointed
The mail issue
Was his mail insensitive? Yes. Was it unwarranted, given that you'd only missed one raid? Probably. Consider yourself fortunate, however, that the officers are so proactive about attendance. It makes a big difference in the long run that attendance is expected and absences are noted, particularly toward the end of each tier when so many players are burned out on the content.
To me, it's not worth carrying a grudge over. He did, after all, apologize.
The real problem is the lack of communication among the officers. Clearly the raid leader didn't pass along the message. That is an issue the officers need to address for the future. A simple forum post could have let everyone know what was up with you.
The raiding issue
The second issue is of course the decision to run 10-man raids from this point forward. My recommendation is to speak with the raid leader about this. Ask him if any player rotations are planned or if they are just going to bring the same people each week.
If it's the former, then you should get a fair shot at going to raids at least some of the time. If it's the latter, then that's probably a mistake on their part, because people like you who are left out in the cold are going to quit the guild. Then when one of the core team members drops out or no-shows, they'll be screwed because they won't have anyone to replace that player.
It's not fair to make people sit on standby every week in the event that one of the "full-time" raid members can't make it. There has to be some kind of consideration or rotation in place. Based on how your raid leader plans to deal with this issue, you'll know whether it's worth sticking around or not.
The only other solution would be to ask the officers if you can start up a second raid group. It could even be a partial alt run with players from the other raid. Of course, you or someone else in the guild must be willing to schedule, organize, and lead those raids.
In the end, if you do decide to quit, quit because they aren't offering you the opportunity to raid, not because of an unfortunate misunderstanding.
/salute
Filed under: Officers' Quarters (Guild Leadership)
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Reader Comments (Page 2 of 3)
Jaq Aug 29th 2011 7:49PM
/facepalm.
No. No game is more important than a member of your family dying. EVER. This guy should have told that officer to go fuck himself. Repeatedly.
I missed all of my raiding obligations this week because I had to evacuate during Hurricane Irene. Since I am my guild's MT, we actually wound up not raiding this week. My guild was perfectly reasonable and understanding about it, because I had a serious real life issue. This clown in this letter did it wrong.
And yes, IT IS A GAME. I don't worry about how I inconvenienced someone because real life intervened because it's a game. Nothing prevents the raid from going on without one person, and nothing keeps the other 24 from playing WoW.
Man, this game cane really mess up people's perspectives.
kuri Aug 29th 2011 8:42PM
To reiterate, the Officer wasn't told why this member was missing from the raid that evening and sent this mail. An apology was offered, and this scuffle should be over.
Regarding missing raids and letting down your team: A game shouldn't rule your life, but you should have the courtesy and respect you'd have for any real-life team (basketball, hockey) or group social obligation (going out to eat, attending a party). Put yourself at a high priority, but keep in mind others as well.
If you're playing Assassin's Creed offline by yourself, go ahead and enjoy the fact you're tied to nobody and nothing but your own desire to progress. But once you get around others, you're mixing yourself up in that complex web of social interaction where people get hurt, angry, disappointed, and mistrustful if you do things without considering them.
Thus, if someone passes away, make a forum post. Tell the appropriate parties. Take your time off (keep yourself at #1). Do your due diligence to fill your team/friends in on your situation so there's no questions (or room for questions to arise) regarding your absence.
I can't imagine anyone would say "skip the funeral / mourning and kill that boss!", but I think we can all agree you shouldn't shirk your responsibilities (i.e. filling people in) in the process.
Bynde Aug 30th 2011 12:04PM
"He clearly didn't know the reason why you missed the raid, or he never would have been so harsh."
I disagree , mamas. If he didn't know he shouldn't have started out with a dickish mail msg.
Polite and respectful people don't start cussing at people right off the start. A mail msg could simply ask if there is a problem, not bitching him out.
The mail itself would have probably pissed me off enough to quit on the spot. Or at least justify my quitting on the spot. Apologizing was the right thing for the officer to do. Scolding him and warning him/her (the officer) to not be a dick in the future would also be the right thing to do.
emberdione Aug 29th 2011 6:34PM
As I promised someone this weekend I would write up what we did, here is how my guild handled the rotation on dps for raids.
http://www.emberdione.com/blog/?p=503
We had 16 raiders and only 10 spots, lol. I tried to figure out a way to make it fair both on bosses downed and ease of fights.
Succulent Aug 29th 2011 6:41PM
It's a tricky situation and, from my experience, no matter how well you handle it, you can't please everyone.
Even if you're just a 10 man guild, realistically you have to recruit for 11-12 raiders and rotate around because you need someone that can plug a spot if someone can't make it. It can be a logistics nightmare.
Glad to read you've handled it well and it's working out.
DonNochay Aug 29th 2011 6:39PM
"First, you're still aggravated by the officer's mail. I think you need to let it go. He clearly didn't know the reason why you missed the raid, or he never would have been so harsh."
That's crap. Total crap. Telling people how to feel regarding an emotion in this situation is a load of shit. Also, you're assuming. You have no idea the intricate details of what went on yet have no problem making assumptions and filling in the gaps as you please.
"He clearly didn't know the reason why you missed the raid, or he never would have been so harsh."
What does it matter that he may not have known the reason? It's a game. A GAME. Too often that gets forgotten around these parts.
Kallix Aug 29th 2011 7:28PM
I'm sick of seeing this type of comment so I'll take a different stab at explaining how I see it.
"Hey Bill, wanna come for a drink tonight?"
"No thanks, I'm raiding tonight."
"Bill we're seeing a movie tonight, wanna come along?"
"Ah sorry, can't tonight, raiding, maybe tomorrow".
Bill rushes home from work, forks down a quick meal and jumps straight onto his PC, ready for the raid he's been looking forward to all day.
"Right, I'm here, let rock and roll!"
"Oh, sorry Bill, you didn't hear? John couldn't make it tonight, raids cancelled".
Now imagine that happening to 24 different people. See how if you push WoW aside because its just A GAME you can ruin an evening for a lot of people at once? If Bill asks why John didn't turn up, and gets told a relative of his died, Bill would completely understand. If, on the other hand, John just no-showed and then the next day when questioned just said "oh right yeah I forgot, went out drinking instead, don't take it too seriously ITS JUST A GAME LOL!!!1" you can imagine that people would be pissed. Now imagine officers that have to deal with people like this constantly.
In this situation, the officer over-reacted because he didn't know the situation, and he apologised once he found out. But going mental about it because its just 'a game' is ridiculous.
Tdog Aug 30th 2011 12:48AM
@Kallix
While I do agree with both, it's a game so do it as you please, if you can't make it fine but be mindful of others. And do everything possible to inform people that you can't make it if you can't. The Officer did go completely to far in that letter.
Because as to your sample up there, that happens. But it's not the persons fault that had to leave here. The person the article is about informed the raid leader that they couldn't make it. Maybe it's the Officers faults for not communicating with each other. So they should have found somebody in ample time or just called it before it ever started.
masterm6 Aug 31st 2011 12:03PM
"Bill we're seeing a movie tonight, wanna come along?"
"Ah sorry, can't tonight, raiding, maybe tomorrow".
Missing a real-life social event with people you can actually interact with to meet a responsibility in a game to people you will probably never meet? That's hardcore.
I mean if you raid with actual rl friends, that's one thing. Otherwise... wow.
undeadgoat Aug 29th 2011 6:48PM
Dude, your guild leader is a dick and you can do better.
Jabadabadana Aug 29th 2011 7:37PM
His guild leader doesn't come up in the entire article...
People seem to be missing the fact that one (1) of the officers who is not listed as the GM, or the raid leader, sent him a message based on insufficient data, and then Apologized later.
The fact that they swapped to 10s is not them being dicks, it's a guild direction choice. It does tend to hurt a bunch of people, but the decision is usually made when 25s are failing either from quality dilution, or attendance issues. It isn't a stab at him, and having the start of 10s be made up of people who are online, is kind of the only way to do it when one starts. He can request rotation in, but yes, they didn't take him when he wasn't online.
His options are pretty much what the article suggests. Rotation in (if they'll do it), a second group, or another guild.
christopherwramsey Aug 29th 2011 6:59PM
First the scott is right the officers didn't talk to each other. From what I read you guys don't use/have forums(I think they don't have them) so doing a in game mail is the best way to talk to you but he did cross a line maybe he didn't do it the right way. You can't fault the guy for trying though.
Next you were replaced get over it. Move on to a different guild thats the way things work now a days. Your DPS they can always fine DPS. Let me give you a good example
my guild that I was leading fell apart. All the things I did for them Ventrilo website flasks all free. all 7 tabs were bought by me before cata even hit. once the officers turned on each other me being the guild leader I tried to stop it but One was to big of a asshole to even talk to him The raid lead transfers off the crappy server. all the raid members left to be with the asshole. We were a level 25 guild had 7 tabs had over 200k in the bank raid bills were paid people had never had to buy flasks or food never. we had a good guild but raid lead left and the other officer didn't care for me so he took off and started his own guild. I was trying to put my own raid team together but they kept jumping ship to a level 1 guild. They are STILL having the SAME problems they were when they were in my guild. I laugh my ass off about it. I hope they never down rag. They will though. The ungreatful jerks. This is for you Severed on BT. you know who you are.
rkaliski Aug 29th 2011 7:44PM
AS far as the first question. I think the writer should drop the subject. Yes the officer should be reminded that worlds like bullets from a gun once fired off can't be called back and they can do a lot of harm.
The second part sounds like either A) he is being punished for not devoting his life no matter what, or more likely b) has run into a situation where he is a newcomer and the core of the group (polite terms for friends) decide they don't want to wait around for the rest of the scrubs.
If they don't follow through with their rotation or help you form a second group run away from the guild as fast as you can. Don't fall for any sort of promise that once firelands is on farm they will gear up the scrubs. They will then want to do heroic 10s and then deathwing. If they wanted to do 25 man they would have made sure everyone geared up at the same time. Does anyone think that they are going to gear you guys up for 25 man deathwing?
Sorry Bud, your guild just went to a leet 10 man from 25 man.
bella Aug 29th 2011 8:04PM
"Was his mail insensitive? Yes.
Was it unwarranted, given that you'd only missed one raid? Probably. "
Not probably. Completely and utterly unwarrented considering he had only missed 1 raid out of 15. I understand the Gm/Officers position all too well. I am GM of my guild and know how frustrating it is when people do not show up and you need to field another person, but as a Gm/Officer you should also know your people. You should know that 'Disappointed' always shows up and previously has let us know that something happened. You should be able to see this outside the one night that prompted your rant in a mailbox.
Disappointed may not have been the only one doing a no-call no-show that night and it could have prompted the mail, but that also says that the Gm/Officer sent out similar notes to other people. If he didn't then he was picking on Disappointed which is a whole different issue. That Gm/Officer apologized and while I agree that Disappointed needs to let it go the Gm/Officer needs to understand that he can't do this an keep his raiders.
Yes, the 'it's only a game' defense is kinda crummy but in the end.. it is.. only.. a.. game. Disappointed had a relative die. It obviously was a close enough relative that he was off for a week for the funeral. That is more important that 9-24 other people getting to raid that night (if that one person was enough to keep them from raiding then they have a whole bunch of other issues). If you try and defend anyone for giving Disappointed shit for not showing up then you are heartless bastard and no one is going to show up at your funeral. Just sayin.
blessthemartyrguild Aug 29th 2011 10:00PM
I agree 100% I am the GM and Raid Leader of my guild and never have I ever even thought of sending a mail like that. If I have someone who is reliable and no shows honestly im getting worried because they have shown that dedication. For those who want to say 24 others depend on you.....bullshit if you raid 25 man with a 25 man raid roster then you have shit leadership. The officer was being a prick yes....he apologized yes...if at this point you haven't left over it Scott is 100% correct in saying just let it go. As far as the ten man, personally I would look for a new guild. The guild you are in has fundamentally changed from what you joined it as so you have every right to look elsewhere.
In regards to the 10 vs 25 thing, they can never be equally difficult, based off spacing and pesonal accountability 10 mans do have the advantage, if they raid stack they have a massive advantage. However there are situations they have to chalk up to rng and wipe that 25 mans can cover(think interrupters on heroic nef). Bottom line is this compare your progression to your raid size doing anything else gives you a skewed view of things. As far as world firsts they will all be done by 25 mans for a long time because these guilds have been around in that format for a long time and thus have th skill, synergy, and drive in place....add to it as the top guilds they get the top applicants as well.
tibbelkrunk Aug 29th 2011 11:03PM
Was it unwarranted to get aggravated over missing 1 of 15 raids?
Maybe. The policies and culture of the guild determine this.
Some guilds are relaxed enough to absorb a missed raid every now and then without an issue.
Others are more strict about attendance, and if that's how the guild has established itself, then it may well be within expectations for every raider to respond to the calendar invites without fail.
And finally... No, it's not just a game. Every time you have 9 or 24 other real people setting aside their time to raid with you, it's your duty to show up on time and prepared. It's what you signed up to do.
(Sometimes you have unavoidable circumstances that cause you to waver on those responsibilities, and that's understandable, but it's still wasting other people's time.)
blessthemartyrguild Aug 30th 2011 12:37AM
If this is a guild where you are expected to have near 100% attendence I very highly doubt they are doing calendar invites....guilds like that(mine is one, I require 90% attendence) have a schedule and you are expected to be there.
As far as 24 other people....I can guarantee they didn't have a 25 man raid roster and if they did then its the officers fault not a raiders who misses due to tragedy striking. Secondly he informed the raid leader, who is the person in charge of raiding....kind of like informing your direct boss you are missing work to attend a funeral, so again the officer who berated him was in the wrong for not knowing since he did inform the raid leader.
thpthpthp1 Aug 30th 2011 6:36AM
Maybe the officer also had some traumatic incident happen in real life as well and it leaked over? =p
Strawder Aug 30th 2011 12:22PM
Bella wrapped this up very well.
In the end, WoW is just a game, no matter how some people may see it. And yes, I've known those people for who WoW is life itself.
(But I've also never joined a raiding guild, despite being invited, because I know my RL kids and wife trump the game, and I don't put myself into a position where my RL will conflict with other people's play time. There isn't such a thing as a raiding guild for every one, and I don't delude myself into thinking as such.)/sidenote
Eirik Aug 30th 2011 2:14AM
25 man raid: 3x tank, 6x healer, 16x DPS
10 man raid: 2x tank, 2x healer, 6x DPS
Guild was doing 25 mans. They do not have anyone who can swap from DPS or healer to tank to form a second 10-man raid?