Drama Mamas: Should minors hide their age?
I don't know if the letter writer is American; I just like the song. We normally edit our letters a little for clarity, but the way this one is written is important to this week's topic.
hello I'm a tank in turmoil
I'm a main tank for a small social, levelling guild we recently got teamspeak so we could progress through content at a faster pace, my problem is this I'm not the most aged player in my group and Ive not quiet hit the point in my life were my voice doesn't so sound young, i the main tank for my guild any they rely heavily on me, my guild leader is my best in game friend and i don't want to ruin my friendship with him but when he finds out I'm a minor it will ruin our friendship and il be laugh out of my guild. i have had 2 sever transfers because of this problem which has been really annoying and i don't want to leave my guild because i grown attached to them. want should i do?
sincerely tank in turmoil
I am going to make two educated guesses here. I may be completely wrong on this; you'll have to let me know. (And please do.)
- It was your behavior and not the years you've been alive that contributed to the bad feelings from the other servers. You have matured and adjusted since leaving them and are now a better guildie and friend. Bravo for learning from your mistakes, if that's true.
- Your guild leader may already guess that you are a minor, judging from how you type. I know that many people (including myself) assume a lack of education due to age when dealing with missing punctuation, improper capitalization and poor grammar. I'm not trying to be hard on you -- you just need to work on your language skills. School and maturity will help there.
- Talk to your guild leader privately. Use whispers or email, not officer chat and definitely not guild chat.
- If you misled him by lying about your age, apologize for that.
- Ask how to break it to the rest of the guild and take his advice. He may choose to do it himself.
- Have a sense of humor about it. You may get good-naturedly laughed at. But they probably want to laugh with you. Take the jokes that happen as meant with the best intentions and enjoy the camaraderie. Just because someone pokes fun at you does not mean they want you out of the guild or even dislike you. Just assume no malice is meant and poke fun right back (again, without malice).
I really believe everything is going to be fine and fun. Enjoy your faster progression!
Tank, don't apologize for what you are. You're young. You're capable. You're a successful, established main tank. Those are facts. Let them stand.
What I suggest that you do bring up with your guild is the fact that your voice most determinedly, most annoyingly yet most amusingly makes you sound quite, quite young. Let your voice take the heat. That does mean you're going to have to bring a sense of humor to the table -- you have to be able to poke fun at the Big Tank, Tiny Voice joke along with everybody else. Get everyone smiling along with you. We can all relate to having some quirk of physique or personality that others may find endearingly humorous. Accept yours, and embrace it to your advantage in this situation.
One caveat: All of this assumes that you are, in fact, old enough to be comfortably and appropriately mixing with a group of adults. Does your guild have any rules about age? Have you lied or actively hidden your age from your GM? And after discussing the situation with your GM, is he willing to continue your membership in the guild?
I promise you this, though: If your GM is not willing to allow you to remain in the guild, it will be for the best. Many guilds don't feel comfortable including minors; even a year or two could make or break their reaction. As attached as you may have grown to this group (and I do encourage you to share this fact with your GM), if they're not comfortable with such a young guildmate, then you don't want to insist on maintaining something that's become truly awkward. At that point, a change truly is all for the best.
In the end, I suspect that a frank, forthright private discussion with the GM will set you on track to scoot right past this awkward moment. Good luck, and let us know how it goes!
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Drama Mamas






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 4)
Snuzzle Sep 12th 2011 9:11AM
Listen. If they couldn't already tell you're young from your behavior, then chances are you're mature enough that your age won't matter. Lisa said it best: let your actions speak for themselves. If your age still bothers them, then there are likely other reasons (like language in guild chat) or they just have stigmas about minors (like Mom grounding you from the computer, or calling you to take out the trash mid-raid).
If you can squash those concerns, and there are clearly no maturity concerns (or else they'd probably have suspected your age by now) then you should be home free. As long as they have no language concerns that is.
I admit, I'd feel a little off-put by a young tank, too, but only one I don't know well. One of my best in game friends is four years younger than me, meaning he was a minor when we met six years ago. But he's also ridiculously mature, even for his age back then. In the end, while people can have certain preconceptions about age, it's just a number. If you can prove that it's just a number, then you've got a great shot at staying in your guild.
If not, don't despair. And next time be honest about your age before you get into a guild. There are a lot of family friendly raiding guilds out there.
Pyromelter Sep 12th 2011 2:09PM
"If they couldn't already tell you're young from your behavior, then chances are you're mature enough that your age won't matter."
I agree with this sentiment. That being said, I would like to answer the letter writer's question here:
Get a voice modification program to make your voice sound a little deeper. Not Barry White deep, but just so that you don't sound like a 6 year old girl (if, say, you're a 15 year old boy).
I'm betting a lot of people will disagree with me, but sometimes it's flat out better to lie, and maintain the lie, if it makes things easier. Don't tell people you are 30 or something like that, but say you are like 17... still a minor, but pretty much at that magic age of 18.
It seems like his problem with his age solely a voice-chat issue... his voice sounds probably very high and youngish. That is why I recommend a voice-chat mod that deepens your voice. Make sure you test it before you use it though! And if anyone besides your GL asks your age, tell them that it's none of their business.
GuyverIV Sep 12th 2011 5:15PM
@Pyromelter
I can't hang with deception, man. If his guild is superficial enough that they'd chuck the kid for being a kid, then imagine what happens when (because this stuff ALWAYS comes out) his modulation software is discovered?
As a more eloquent soul then I once put it: "Ohh yeah, $#*! just got real up in this $%^*#."
He may have to try harder to prove himself as a youngster, not particularly fair, but what is in life? But if he was found out to be a liar? At BEST he'd have a bunch of folks mad at him for deception. Worst he could get Gkicked so fast he'd bounce, or set himself up where that could be used against him less pleasant people who may figure it out before others do.
Turmoil, if you're reading this, I agree with the Mamas. (And as everyone knows, the opinion of the average schmoe on teh Intartubes Counts For Something, heh) Tell the GL in a controlled, private setting, apologise sincerely, succinctly, but *not excessively* if you encouraged a mis-understanding regarding your age, and face the results with your head held high. Apologise for NOTHING ELSE. You're the same person they've trusted up to now, all that's different is you've clarified any misconceptions.
Heck, if your GM is the kind of stand-up-guy I'd hope for, he'll make an announcement before your "on-air" debut, making note of your desire to clear the air and supporting you as the bang-up tank they all know.
GuyverIV Sep 12th 2011 5:15PM
One more thing! Brace yourself for some ribbing. It will almost certainly happen, gamers love to tease, but that's fine. I'm sure you know, but be careful of taking offense when it's not intended, a joke about your age is not always an insult. Don't be defensive. *YOU* ain't got a thing to prove that you haven't already.
Even if you DO catch some attitude for your age, don't snap back. If you're defensive, arguementative, or you get upset (understandably) if you DO get insulted, some folks may take it (UNFAIRLY!) as a sign that you're just not ready for the guild. When in doubt, silence is golden, and the more rudely someone acts towards you, the more rapidly others will realize *the other guy* is a jerk if you don't get aggressive in response.
Just stay calm, and remember: When you REALLY want to snap back at someone is the exact time you should NOT do that. It's a trap, and you're smarter than that.
You'll be fine, Turmoil. Stay Calm and Carry On!
Lee Sep 12th 2011 9:19AM
Hope it all goes well OP. We have a tank in the guild who is just a tad below early teens and he regularly main / off tanks our non-progression raids (and could manage progression raids if he was allowed to stay up that late!). The average age of our guild is probably 3 times his, yet he fits right in because it's a family friendly guild and he takes a mature approach to being online.
Just to let you know that there are places out there where you can slot right in without worrying about age - I hope your current guild is already one of those.
e.friedman1992 Sep 12th 2011 9:22AM
Couldn't have said it better myself. I am GM of a decent sized guild about to start FL progression. I'm OT and it turns out that our MT and raid leader is 14! (Most of us are about college age or higher) I explained to him that as long as he continues to perform well and act like an adult, we have no problems keeping him on. (Lol, we also jokingly told him we need his mother's permission)
And sure, sometimes his age shows, but you know what? Its a video game, kids are SUPPOSED to be playing it.
gewalt Sep 12th 2011 12:51PM
actually, it has been my experience raiding with minors that it is an extremely good idea to get their parents on vent, describe what kind of commitment you are expecting from their kids, and make sure that the parents are aware of exactly what is going on with this kid.
Most importantly, find out exactly what the kids restrictions are, and make sure you help out enforcing them. If he has to be off the game at 9pm his time for bed, then make sure the raid doesn't spill over that time, or you WILL be causing problems for him.
kids are extremely prone to getting in trouble with their parents over wow, and a little openness between the guild/raid leader and his parents will save that kid a lot of problems.
There's many good reasons to treat minors like minors. Don't expect them to behave like perfect adults, because they are not. But there's no good reason to not have skilled minors in your raid, as long as you all agree to their restrictions. And if they don't have any restrictions?
Nick Sep 13th 2011 4:46AM
@gewalt
That is an extremely good idea, for more reasons that one. Not only would it make life easier for everyone, but if the minor's parents are the sort of people who just can't understand that online friends are still real friends and real people, this can help to bridge the generational and understanding gap between them and their child. You never know, Mom might end up putting the raid in little Timmy's dayplanner and making sure he's there on time for it! *Laughs*
Jack Kelly Sep 12th 2011 9:25AM
My girls are not allowed to chat more than just to be polite for the simple fact that there are adults playing this game and not all adults have good intentions.
I caught one of them having a conversation (more than just thank you, hello, and goodbye) and she got a week vacation from Azeroth.
And they are strictly forbidden to ever speak to their age or age-related status in the world.
You have to be "on it". This game can be fun for kids but it is not *for* kids.
Pyromelter Sep 12th 2011 2:14PM
"And they are strictly forbidden to ever speak to their age or age-related status in the world.
You have to be "on it". This game can be fun for kids but it is not *for* kids."
Quoted for truth, and fishing for uprankings on this post, because this is about the best advice I have ever read on allowing daughters to play wow.
Also the "one week vacation" comment. WoW Insider needs to add a fourth star just for this post IMO.
Tai Sep 12th 2011 7:42PM
I very much disagree. My daughter used to play, starting in a limited way at about 10 or so, and I always told guildies she was my kid and her age. We ran into problems when other players didn't know her age and might say or type something inappropriate. People were quite good about minding themselves around her once they knew.
Sahara Sep 14th 2011 7:06PM
I think both Jack and Tai's approaches have merit in different situations. With people you know, are familiar with, and interact with constantly - such as a guild - it is best if the guild knows your child's age so they can act more age appropriate when the minor is online. For example, I was once in a guild which was very good at moderating swearing when the guild minor was online.
But Jack has a very VERY good point too. There are alot of creepy people on WoW. And they're creepy even for GROWN ADULT women. I wouldn't want my girls within 10 leagues of said creepy people, and sometimes they get creepier when they know the person is a child. Some people are just jerks and like to take advantage of naieve players, and lets face it, there are many naieve players which are minors. (Of COURSE there are plenty of mature minors who are not naieve, too) I support the "Don't ask, don't tell, EVER" policy in all situations outside of a guild you trust. And frankly, if you have a creepy person in your guild (been there), extend the policy to the guild. Let the GM know about the minors so they're not in the dark, and hey also let them know why you've told your kids not to tell their ages. Most GM's would understand I think.
danawhitaker Sep 12th 2011 9:31AM
I think everything will be fine. As the GM of a guild with people ranging from 14-40+, we take people with us for their skill and personality, not their age. I've actually got 2-3 14-15 year olds and a 17 year old as part of our core raiding group. My biggest concern as GM in regards to their age is that they aren't short-changing their education in order to play (none of them are). While I'm sure there are some players that age lacking the maturity to be part of a guild like that, the fact that the OP is concerned about this issue indicates a semblance of maturity in recognizing it may be an issue. The guys in my guild were quite hesitant at revealing their ages at first, probably for similar reasons, but I'm glad they did.
I've actually found the hardest age group to deal with in a guild isn't the high school crowd. It's college students. They're between being minors and adults, trying to find themselves, and many are trying to juggle being out from under the thumbs of adults. At least many (though not all) in the high school age range have parents who keep them somewhat in check.
MattKrotzer Sep 12th 2011 9:57AM
Is your name REALLY Dana Whitaker, or are you a Sports Night fan?
If it's the latter... you're awesome. (If it's the former, you're awesome, too... but you know what I mean.)
danawhitaker Sep 12th 2011 10:58AM
You're watching Sports Night on CSC, so stick around ;)
I know you got downrated, but I don't care. People just don't appreciate the awesomeness of Aaron Sorkin.
MattKrotzer Sep 12th 2011 1:59PM
No, they really don't. It's a shame. At least he was recognized for his work on The Social Network. Well deserved. He just has bad luck with TV networks.
Also, you should follow Joshua Malina (Jeremy Goodwin) on Twitter. He's hilarious.
belthazor Sep 12th 2011 9:44AM
i dont think it will really matter its just about maturity im 11 and im in fl with my guild they know my age and they dont really care
kreighund Sep 12th 2011 3:14PM
This almost seems like a model of the grammar issues mentioned by Robin...
Inside job!
Lee Sep 13th 2011 4:49AM
I think the grammar language issues can be broken down into two subsections
1) Age/Education - categorised by "belthazor" above, missing capitalisation, missing apostrophes are key indicators, textspeak/l33tspeak are others.
2) English as a second language (perhaps modified by age) which I think would be categorised by the "tank in turmoil". This shows a good grasp of English but lack of experience in communicating with native speaksers. This has casused some sentence structuring issues and words replaced by similarly sounding words. For example "want should I do?" which does have punctuation but has "what" replaced by "want".
TL:DR I think "tank in turmoil" doesn't speak English natively so shouldn't be judged by that letter as it's better than anything most of us could do in foreign langauges
Cricket Sep 13th 2011 3:44PM
@Lee
The non-native grammar/spelling problems and the native-but-young/uneducated problems are, however, completely different. An ESL speaker is more prone to make word order, sentence structure and contraction mistakes, use odd words, misuse slang or miss certain connotations. We rarely make homonym mistakes because our learning process is intricately tied to the written word, not the spoken. The kind of mistakes in Turmoil's letter or the OP are a fairly good example of mistakes an ESL speaker would be unlikely to make. I'm not saying that Turmoil isn't also an ESL speaker, but the letter does indicate a young person rather than a non-anglophone person.