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9-12-2011 @ 2:16PM
SuicideKings.This is what we use for our 10-man. Main spec items use the list, offspec is rolled for. Much simpler than points, and just as fair. It also has the advantage of keeping loot distribution equal over multiple weeks, as the list persists, as opposed to most rolling rules where it's a "1 piece per night" deal.http://www.csiundercity.com/?page_id=16http://kahluamod.com/ksk/Just have your raiders "roll into the list" the first time, and after that you're gravy.
9-12-2011 @ 2:32PM
We do the same thing, but do be careful about off-spec rolls. In my raid, for example, we only have one plate DPS but 4 people who want plate OS pieces (1 warrior tank, 1 pally tank, 2 pally healers). Rolling for OS works fine until somebody hasn't seen a OS upgrade in a while, even if it's someone who only uses the OS for solo play.
9-12-2011 @ 4:46PM
When I was working on potentially putting together a raid a while ago, I had decided to go with Suicide Kings with a couple of twists:1. Everyone got "bumped up" a spot for being on time. That meant that whoever was on top of the list had to be on time just like everyone else, or they might lose their top spot. 2. There was a MS and an OS list. Everyone who had an off spec made a second roll for their OS gear. That helps tremendously, in that people know when they're eligible for an OS item.3. If no one wants to take a small upgrade item because they want to retain their place on the list, there can be a roll-off for the item. However, an individual can only take one roll off per night (otherwise they have to Suicide), and if someone only takes roll-offs some number of nights/items in a row, they automatically get suicided at the beginning of the next raid.Another thing you can do is consider moving the loot responsibilities to someone other than yourself. As many folks have mentioned, and you've learned, raid leading is a lot of work. If the loot stress isn't yours (or isn't yours alone), it helps a lot.
9-12-2011 @ 4:51PM
^ This. Our guild went from a DKP system to SuicideKings when BC launched, and so much of the gear drama went away. The folks who were holding out for that one perfect piece quickly landed near the top of the list and would get it when it finally dropped; the folks who needed multiple upgrades would be near the bottom so it was little or no loss to them to grab them, and the stress levels just plummeted. Later, we tweaked it to run one SK list for tier and a second SK list for gear, which prevented the need to hoard your spot for that tier token and shard possibly-useful gear in the process. SK works because if two or more raiders are competing for the same type of gear, no one can win all the rolls (or worse, lose them all). Once someone wins a piece, everyone else has priority until they get something too. It evens out very quickly and is really easy for the RL to run - there are addons to help out.
9-12-2011 @ 4:52PM
SK is deeply flawed (as is DKP or any cost based system) if it doesn't have a /roll for mainspec players before going to offspec.This scenario happens all the time otherwise:Boss 1 drops sword which is a slight upgrade for mainspec for a single character.He passes to not lose position in the list, as the next boss drops something that's really good.Item which could go to his mainspec goes into someone offspec (or more commonly) is sharded.So your loot system there just happened to make someone take an upgrade they should have.So you should drop the round robin causing part of your system (the list) or allow an open mainspec roll before dropping to offspec/sharding that doesn't effect the list.
9-12-2011 @ 5:32PM
@TreasonMy raid solves that with our "No Position Hoarding" rule (it's there on our guild website if you read it).Basically, it says that if someone drops, and it's an upgrade for you, but you refuse to bid on it because you're "saving your spot" for that "cool weapon" you've been wanting, well too bad, suck it up. We're a team, and this is a team effort, and it's in the TEAM'S best interest if you get the upgrade.I force bid you, you get the item, and you suicide anyway. Plus you lose some of my respect because you're being a selfish, loot-whoring berk.
9-12-2011 @ 7:57PM
SK was the first thing I thought of when it comes to this type of thing. With a 10man raid, it would be really easy to set up. No need to go through all the hubbub that Shoryl set up. SK for main spec needs, /roll for anyone else who wants it where it won't be sharded. Position hoarding is a necessary evil of SK; however, in a 10-man raid, you wouldn't really need to hoard that much, since most of the time there won't be a huge amount of loot competition.
9-12-2011 @ 8:22PM
Position hoarding is not an issue (or at least not as big of an issue) with Double SK lists. With Double SK (DSK), everyone is on the list twice, and thus everyone "hoards" their top position to wait for the uber-awesome-upgrade-of-awesome, and will use their low bid position on the more minor upgrades.Bids for MS are resolved before OS is entertained. Only stuff that gets sharded are items that noone can use.
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