The Light and How to Swing It: Retribution in the Firelands, part 2

Before we delve into some strategies for dealing with another two bosses within the Firelord's domain, let's have some quick words about the most recent Censure hotfix. Yes, it's a marginal DPS increase, made even more marginal if you need to switch targets often and drop your stacks -- but the important thing is that Blizzard's working on it. Trust me, more buffs are coming.
Last time, we covered some tips for dealing with Shannox and Lord Rhyolith. This week, we continue the two-for-one deal and bring you two very add-centric fights, Beth'tilac and Alysrazor.

I really hope you're not arachnophobic. The Beth'tilac encounter is rife with spiders of all shapes and sizes, and you'll need to squash the lot of them before the fight is over. As a ret paladin, there are about three different jobs you could be performing, depending on your raid composition and raid leader's diabolical schemes.
Spinners and Drones This job involves pulling down Cinderweb Spinners via taunts and killing them, then switching to the Cinderweb Drone. We are uniquely suited for this job because we have two great taunts available to us: Hand of Reckoning and Righteous Defense. While Hand of Reckoning is point-and-shoot, Righteous Defense can be used with a bit more finesse. If the Spinners are targeting a specific healer, you can cast Righteous Defense on them, bringing down up to three of the targets attacking them. Alternatively, you can cast Righteous Defense on one Spinner and hope that its target has two other Spinners attacking it. In short, we have the ability to pull down four Spinners at once. Go ahead and flex that off-spec taunting muscle.
After all of the Spinners are dead (there should be three waves of Spinner spawns), switch to the Drone in the southwest corner and kill that as well.
Spiderlings There will be three groups of Cinderweb Spiderlings spawning from the northwest, northeast, and southeast corners of the room. If you're assigned to kill these, make sure they don't reach the Drones that will be spawning in the southwest corner of the room. Seal of Righteousness and Divine Storm are your friends here. Also, see if your raid leader can pair you up with someone who can slow the critters; it will make your job a heck of a lot easier.
Mama Beth Some guilds send DPS up top with the tank and heals to chip away at Beth'tilac before she comes down for phase 2. If you do get tossed upstairs, taunt a Spinner, grab its web, and ascend. Your tank should pick up Beth, so just get in a position to attack her from behind. Watch out for pools of lava up on the web, as they signal the location of an incoming meteor from Beth'tilac's Meteor Burn. When the meteor hits it will create a hole in the web, so stay on your toes.
When Beth's energy bar reaches zero, she will begin an 8-second cast called Smoldering Devastation that will essentially one-shot anyone unlucky enough to be stuck on the web with her. When she begins the cast, just down from her web through the hole in the middle and fiery filaments will slow your descent. Once the cast is complete, more Spinners will appear, and the cycle begins anew.
After three Devastation casts, Beth'tilac will descend from her lofty perch and then the burn phase will begin. If any Spiderlings reach her when she drops to the ground she will restore 10% of her health per crunchy arachnid consumed, so make sure to clean up the adds beforehand. Aside from that, all of the DPS and healers should be stacked up behind her opisthosoma (that's a fancy word for "butt") with the two tanks at the front, at least 10 yards apart from one another. A stacking Frenzy buff, in addition to her frequent Ember Flare casts, means there is a soft enrage here. During this phase, liberal use of glyphed Divine Protection is recommended. Otherwise, line those cooldowns up with whenever you want to hit Bloodlust/Heroism (my raid group waits until she's at about 40% so that the healers enjoy a little boost as well) and squash this pest.
From her loot table, you will notice that the Arachnaflame Treads are the only things worth mentioning. When you compare these to their BOE counterparts, Warboots of Mighty Lords, they fall a bit short due to the haste. Of course, this is all presupposing that you could use the full value of the hit rating on the Warboots (or even 60% of the hit, after reforging), so choose wisely.

It's a bird! It's a plane! It's ... well, it's a bird, actually. Truth be told, Alysrazor is just about the hottest bird you've ever seen, with one of the coolest pull animations since Sapphiron. Every rose has its thorn, however, and this bird is no different. Do you remember all of those fights where a patch of fire would spawn under you and you had to move? Remember how inconvenient that was? Now imagine that fire patch moving around, accompanied by rotating flame jets and errant fire tornadoes, and you have an inattentive raider's worst nightmare.
There are two options for how you will spend most of the fight as a ret paladin. The first is less than ideal, while the second is much more likely.
For a good portion of the fight, Alysrazor will be flying around, confident in her vertical advantage over you. In her arrogance, she will molt and drop Molten Feathers. Click on three of these and you will gain Wings of Flame, a mechanic that will allow you to soar through the air and bring the pain to the haughty avian. To stay aloft, you will need to fly through rings of fire and gain the buff Blazing Power, which will refresh the duration on Wings of Flame, and also avoid Incendiary Clouds. If you let Wings of Flame drop off, you will be the one dropping, so pay attention!
The reason I mention that this role is less ideal for a ret paladin is because of the superhuman jockeying you will need to do to stay in melee range of Alysrazor while avoiding clouds and flying through rings. If you want my opinion, leave this job to the ranged DPS classes.
The much more likely scenario you will find yourself in involves interrupting and killing adds on the boring old ground. Blazing Talon Initiates will spawn periodically and begin casting two different spells. The first is Brushfire, which is uninterruptable and spawns a moving fire blob that you obviously want to avoid. Important to note is that it spawns in the direction the Initiate is facing, so as long as your camera is not looking down on your character from geosynchronous orbit, just use some footwork to sidestep the problem.
The second cast is called Fieroblast. This spell is interruptable and in fact should be interrupted every time it is cast. Not only does it hurt, but if the Initiate successfully casts one, he or she gains a buff called Fire it Up! that will make subsequent casts much harder to interrupt.
Meanwhile, the tanks will be picking up Voracious Hatchlings that hatch from Molten Eggs. Whatever you do, do not be standing next to the eggs when they hatch! They will become Imprinted onto you, and nothing you do (aside from dying) will get it to go away -- not even Divine Shield will get it to ignore you.
Other than that, the only other things you will need to avoid are the rotating Lava Spews of Plump Lava Worms and Alysrazor's Blazing Claw, which she will cast while sweeping through the center of the encounter area. These patterns are fairly regular, though, so if you are paying attention, you should be able to avoid them easily.
Feel free to chip in on some Hatchling hurtin' in between Initiate spawns, but your tanks should be able to handle those with ease. After a short time, Alysrazor will remove the Wings of Flame buff from all players and fly in a tight circle in a sort of transition phase, producing a number of fire obstacles that you need to avoid. She will spawn a Fiery Vortex at the middle, and she will produce Harsh Winds near the edge. What this means is that you can't try to cheat and avoid the following ability.
Fiery Tornadoes are the bane of many of the raiders in my guild, as I'm sure is true for many other guilds as well. I found a short 12-second video clip illustrating the very basic orbiting pattern of these tornadoes. For those without video access, all you really need to do is follow a tornado in its path until another tornado passes you on either side, then switch to that "lane" and follow the new tornado. I know it can be tricky, especially with spare Brushfires moving about every which way, but keep at it.
After a short while, Alysrazor's sugar rush will run out and she will fall to the ground, exhausted and drained of Molten Power. This is where you should use cooldowns and hit Bloodlust/Heroism, because she is under the effect of Burnout. Ignore the Blazing Talon Clawshapers that spawn, as it will be up to your tanks to interrupt and hold them; if you try to be a hero and pick one up, know that it will attack you instead of continually trying to cast. The DPS and healers should be stacking during this phase, in preparation for what is to come.
When Alysrazor reaches 50 Molten Power, she will become Ignited and cast Blazing Buffet every second until she reaches 100 Molten Power and casts Full Power. From the mouseovers, you can plainly see that this is all Fire damage, so again, glyphed Divine Protection becomes a lifesaver. Hitting Holy Radiance while stacked wouldn't be a bad idea, either. When she casts Full Power, everyone will be knocked back a fair distance and the cycle resets. Lather, rinse, and repeat until you get a kill!
From her bag of goodies, there are a few choice items that we need to consider. The Greathhelm of the Voracious Maw and Alysrazor's Band are two very nice pieces, especially considering that you won't see another ilvl 378 helm until Ragnaros. Lavaworm Legplates are very nice as well, although the tier legs, Immolation Legplates, are also very juicy and are purchasable with VP. My opinion: If you don't have your tier legs yet, go ahead and pick them up. If you already have your tier, they aren't really worth replacing unless you are in desperate need of hit.
Filed under: Paladin, (Paladin) The Light and How to Swing It






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Crispn Sep 13th 2011 6:10PM
How many people are on the Blazing Talon Initiates at once?
Shyster Sep 13th 2011 7:16PM
It's usually two and you cycle interrupts on them in w/e order necessary, or at least thats what my group does.
Arrowsmith Sep 13th 2011 7:16PM
Depends on if it's 10 or 25. on 10, two DPS to a side, and on 25, I want to say it's 5-6.
Telwar Sep 13th 2011 9:01PM
On 10m, you have two dps/side, and you need about 3 interrupts over the lifespan of the mob. An enhancement shaman can cover one, and a rogue with Kick glyphed can just barely manage all three on the other mob. Otherwise, you need a primary interrupter (anyone else with a 10s cd) and a secondary, probably one on a 20-30s cd.
paulmewis Sep 13th 2011 8:34PM
Many of the EU forums are a bit more pessimistic about blizzards plans for ret. There talk of this being the carrot before the nerfbat.
Personally, I believe ret's going to get large changes again in the pre-expansion shake up.
hazmacewillraid Sep 14th 2011 12:35AM
I don't really see a need for "large changes" again. Although things like Holy Power and Inquisition make the beginning of encounters a bit clunky, ret really has a flow to it that works, at least in my own humble opinion. The only thing I would possibly change would be to do something about Hammer of Wrath (I hardly use it when I'm chaining my cooldowns) and perhaps take some of the RNG out of our damage.
toddless Sep 14th 2011 8:08AM
Omg two in a row!
OT: censure is cool. Im just hoping they don't nerf our burst too much for steady long dps like most classes. I like being able to blow someone up in 8 seconds
Pliers Sep 14th 2011 1:48AM
Carrot before the nerf bat?
It's pretty clear their intentions are to leave us as is or buff our
damage further, as they say flat out that our damage was low, censure
was a tweak, and they'll do more if needed.
Increasing all our damage a bit (like buffing 2h-wep spec another 5%),
or playing with HoW's mechanics would both do the job. If they wanted
to truly "fix" the spec, they need to lower our RNG, which is a result
of DP and AoW procs, not just increase it.
The best option is probably to stop auto-attacks from proccing AoW.
Instead, make 3-HP and DP Templar's Verdicts give AoW, with a 10s
internal cooldown. This ends up getting AoW once per 3-CS cycle, which
runs about 13 seconds long. You'd get 5 melee swings in that same time
frame, for 1 AoW proc. The difference is that you won't waste it with
chain procs, it fits nicely into the rotation, and removes the random
aspect almost entirely. We'd gain a small amount of dps, and a lot of
predictability.
Our rotation would become CS, filler, filler, CS, filler filler, CS,
TV, Exorcism, which ends up being incredibly smooth. If they lowered
HW's cooldown from 15s 12s, it would fit that rotation as well,
leaving you with 2 open globals per HP-cycle, and one would be filled
by TV on average.
Those small tweaks ends up adding a lot of stability to the rotation,
while a slight buff to 2H-wep spec would cover our needed dps gain.
Pyromelter Sep 14th 2011 1:52AM
I'm going to give a friendly suggestion... please don't take offense to this.
"How to Raid Bosses" on wow insider blog posts, frankly they are pretty boring and not interesting.
Same thing with "How to Gear" gear lists. I think gear lists and crafted/rep gear lists are GREAT in the first 1-2 weeks of an expansion. Helps people who aren't at level cap or who just hit that cap to gear up, and gives later people a reference.
So that's what I think doesn't work.
What does work are things that are more specific to the class, and less general to gearing/raiding. Like cool pvp tips, like how to emergency heal in pvp. Or how to completely pwn a group in Alterac Valley. Or maybe some dps tricks - AoE rotations, how to set up CLCRet, and maybe throw in some specifc tips on current raid bosses (as opposed to just going over each boss in many long paragraphs).
And maybe a flavor post, on how to completely annihilate death knights. Get some kind of rivalry going with DK's. Talk about how they are all dirty and stinky and traitors to the light. All that jazz. Because tbh... reading about a melee role in a raid that's been out for what, 5 months now? It's just not interesting.
Pyromelter Sep 14th 2011 1:55AM
And here is a really good suggestion - how about talk about the state of ret, is it fun, the fun you have, future changes, where it was, and where it's going. Make it a multiple week article. Try to talk about the ways in which it was fun, what happened to it, and how rets might have fun playing the spec in the future.
hazmacewillraid Sep 14th 2011 11:56AM
These are great ideas for future posts, and I'm sorry that you feel these raid guides aren't very interesting. The problem is that there hasn't been a whole lot of stability in the ret columnist position so this material was never released when it was still "relevant", meaning I need to play catch up with the rest of the columns. I hope you'll stick with it.
Pliers Sep 14th 2011 1:58AM
Another great article, Antigen!
The only things I'd add are:
Beth'tilac:
Use Righteous Defense before Hand of Reckoning, and try to get it off while the spiders are still lowering themselves down their web strand. You will frequently catch 2-3 targeting the same healer (they love druids in our raids), and then have Hand of Reckoning for whatever's left over. If you do it in the other order, you might Hand-taunt one that RD would have covered.
Alysrazor:
Judging the Hatchlings as you run between Initiates gets you free damage, and bridges the gap faster, so you can start dpsing again.
Also, for those of you have mastered the art of the horizontal shuffle (I clearly mean the Tornado phase. You have a sick mind), you can attack her while running your circles. Antigen mentioned to me that you can hit her at the start of the fight, so I start attacking her within seconds of her opening knockback (watch out for her frontal cleave as she flies overhead!), and set her as my focus. Later in the fight, while doing the Tornado Twist, I'll pick her back up as my target and mash my dps keys while spinning in circles. Not only will Judgement's sprint help you dodge the tornadoes, but you get some free damage.
Xenikos Sep 14th 2011 11:12AM
"The reason I mention that this role is less ideal for a ret paladin is because of the superhuman jockeying you will need to do to stay in melee range of Alysrazor while avoiding clouds and flying through rings. If you want my opinion, leave this job to the ranged DPS classes."
What?!? I'm ranked #2 on WOL on Alysrazor 25man, and there is no "jockeying" necessary to stay in melee range of her. Her hitbox is GARGANTUAN!! You can be hitting a ring just as it is about to expire and still be in melee range of her. You can also continue to DPS her during P2 while you're dodging fiery tornadoes.
I hate to be so critical, but there are a lot of ret-specific things you could be talking about, not generic facts about bosses released 2.5 months ago and bad arachnophobia jokes.
Xenikos Sep 14th 2011 11:21AM
Oops, down to #4 now (in the unlikely case anyone cares) - looks like a few more rets broke the 50k mark on Tuesday.
hazmacewillraid Sep 14th 2011 12:22PM
The buffs you gain up in the air benefit other specs much, much more than it benefits us (I'm looking at you, fire mages). If the top ret parses for Alys are bordering on 50k, that's enough proof to let the fire mages, boomkins, affliction warlocks, and shadow priests go up in our stead, raking in at least 15k extra DPS simply because they like haste more. For the sake of optimizing your raid DPS, staying on the ground just makes sense. It also lets us make use of our burst DPS and interrupts, especially when those ranged DPS that we're sending up don't have the same tools.
Of course, I did qualify that part of the article with "if you want my opinion." I guess you didn't!
Xenikos Sep 14th 2011 12:39PM
Certainly the specs you mention are outperforming 50k by a wide margin - I wouldn't argue that Rets should go up above those. But other ranged specs don't get as much of a buff from the rings/crit buff, and among melee, only rogues can get more of one - so Rets are not a bad choice for the air team. But my point wasn't so much that Rets *should* go up, but rather that the reason stated why they shouldn't - that it is difficult to be continually DPSing Alysrazor - is blatantly incorrect.
Pliers Sep 14th 2011 4:48PM
I don't mean to fanboy/white knight or anything, but it seems like you're focusing on a small point because you happen to do the job that he's saying we shouldn't.
I think the message is that WoW's StarFox64 is a game better left for other classes. He could have elaborated a bit more on why playing tag with Alysrazor isn't a good idea, but he's definitely right that we're not the right choice. Even with proper play, you will start and end the air phase out of range, have less time to dodge clouds, and have less to show for your efforts. Plus, we can't swoop down and dps the mobs on the ground like ranged can.
Not only do casters benefit far more than we do from the buff - one caster does about 25% more damage by himself than a melee in the air and a melee on the ground combined - but the huge gap between them and us dwarfs any differences between us and other melee. If you do have to send a melee up, as long as you don't pick an enhancement shaman, you'll see pretty similar results.
For comparison, a shadowpriest, lock, or boomkin flying through the air would match my damage to the targets on the ground, while doing 75k extra dps to Alysrazor. Take my damage on the adds, my damage to Alys, add in your #4 parse, and they'd still have a 10-20k lead on us. A mage would do even more. You'd have to have a pretty irregular raid comp if there's no better option than sending one of us up.
I think you're right to point out that we *can* do the air part of the fight, and have a valid point about why his reason is overstated. I was initially assigned to fly through hoops for our guild, and though I found it markedly more difficult than you seem to, it's doable. However, you're not just saying we're capable, but actually say that it's not a bad idea, and I disagree completely. It is definitely possible for a ret paladin to do that task. That doesn't change that we shouldn't.