Spiritual Guidance: Shadow priest FAQs
by Fox Van Allen 
Oct 12th 2011 at 6:00PM
Hey everyone. I'm so excited I could just puke, because BlizzCon 2011 is almost here. It's like Christmas is around the corner. I'm so excited I can't sleep. I'm also so excited that I don't want to sit down and get my work done, but to be fair, I get that feeling regardless of whether BlizzCon is around the corner or not.
I was so busy over these last few days getting ready for my trip to California that I didn't even have time to think up a super-awesome topic for today. Thankfully, my loyal minions on Twitter responded to my call for help. They were kind enough to bombard me with a ton of general questions about shadow priesting.
And since
Before we get into the questions, let me just add this: If you're wondering about the answer to any shadow priesting question that I don't tackle here, it's not too late to ask. Send me a message on Twitter at @foxvanallen and I'll try to answer it in a future Spiritual Guidance column real soon.
OK, enough thinly veiled attempts to get you to follow me and pad my numbers. Let's get into the questions.
The sexiness of shadow priesting
@ittesi259 asks:
Why is shadowpriesting just so damn sexy?It's sexiness by association. You're welcome.
The usefulness of Dark Intent
Oh, what's that? You want me to answer serious questions that might improve your DPS? Ridiculous. But if you insist ...
@Leemesgee asks:
Dark Intent=bad design? When it's gone, SPriests are sad - When it's there, everyone think's we're OP.Once upon a time, a long, long time ago, different classes had their own unique raid buffs. It was a way to guarantee opportunities for players of each class. In The Burning Crusade, raids would bring along a shadow priest because of our Vampiric Touch ability; back then, it allowed shadow priests to grant 5% of the damage we dealt back to the party as mana restoration. Shadow priests were in demand because of that, and game designers knew it.
With Wrath of the Lich King came a new game design philosophy: "Bring the player, not the class." Vampiric Touch was redesigned; the mana return buff was standardized as Replenishment and given to retribution pallies, destruction warlocks, frost mages, and survival hunters. The buff became an essential ability, one that raids were balanced around. Strangely, though, while Blizzard has allowed multiple classes the ability to provide Replenishment (and similarly, to benefit from Replenishment) as well as most other formerly unique buffs, Dark Intent remains its own special snowflake. Only warlocks give it out. And 95% of the time, shadow priests are the beneficiaries. Our spec is balanced around it.
Is it bad design? Not when taken without context. But when you start considering that Dark Intent spits in the face of the "bring the player, not the class" philosophy, then yes, it should probably be redesigned. It's not the top problem facing shadow priests. But it sure feels wrong to have shadow priests so dependent on a specific buff. Especially one given out by a total jerk like Tyler Caraway.
The value of Shadow Orbs
Of all the questions I was asked, more were about Mind Blast than any other topic.
@Mallusof asks:
is it best to wait as long as possible for 3 orbs before using MB or should cast as soon MB is off CD, haveing at least 1 Orb?Mind Blast is easily one of a shadow priest's most important spells. It does more damage now than ever before -- I regularly see it connect for six-digit damage when it crits. And perhaps more importantly, Mind Blast gives us two of our most important procs, Replenishment (when cast on a target with Vampiric Touch) and Empowered Shadow.
Now, obviously Mind Blast is going to be at its most powerful when you have three Shadow Orbs to burn. Each orb adds about 25% to the base damage (at level 85, depending on mastery); 3 add an approximate 75% bonus. That's a pretty nice bonus and a terrific reason to want to generate as many Orbs as quickly as possible.
That said, the bonus damage you get from consuming 3 Shadow Orbs pales in comparison to the bonus damage you get from the 15-second Empowered Shadow buff, which you get by consuming any quantity of Orbs. The buff can add a solid 25% or so to the damage done by our DOT spells (again, the exact value depends on your mastery rating). Losing Empowered Shadow it is a terrible hit to our DPS, since DOTs account for about 75% of our total damage.
In fact, the consequences of losing the buff are so dire, you always want to cast Mind Blast whenever you have at least one Orb. It's a top priority -- more important than waiting for 3 Orbs, more important than refreshing DOTs. If you can cast Mind Blast and you have Orbs up and active, cast MB, consume the Orbs, and refresh Empowered Shadow.
For characters below level 80, the bonus math isn't as generous -- Shadow Orbs are only worth a 10% bonus each to Mind Blast damage. Still, as for level 85 characters, the biggest benefit from Shadow Orbs is the Empowered Shadow buff, even though its power at lower levels is more muted.
When to cast Mind Blast
And to follow up on our previous question about Mind Blast, @lomogeek asks:
Is there a specific time to use mind blast?To an extent, we've already answered part of this question: You should always cast Mind Blast whenever you have at least Orb to burn. But what about when you don't have Shadow Orbs available? And what about your opening rotation?
In the middle of a fight, there's a pretty good rule of thumb for Mind Blast. If all three of your major DOTs are active on your target -- that's Vampiric Touch, Shadow Word: Pain, and Devouring Plague -- then you should feel free to cast Mind Blast. In that situation, it's the most effective spell in terms of damage done versus time required to cast it.
Now, things get a bit more complex as your 15-second timer on Empowered Shadows ticks down to nothing. If you've got only a few seconds left on the ES buff and one of your DOTs seems likely to expire soon, you may want to cast Mind Flay one more time to try and generate that ever-valuable Shadow Orb. At this point, though, it's your own judgement call.
With regard to when to cast Mind Blast as an opener: In the grand scheme of things, it doesn't matter. Some people like to grind out that first Shadow Orb before casting Mind Blast, because they know the Empowered Shadow buff is so important. Other folks like to open with Shadow Word: Pain, start applying DOTs, and let the first Shadow Orb get generated "naturally." At the end of the day, the opening moments of a fight constitute a tiny part of your overall DPS. Do what you feel most comfortable doing.
Are you more interested in watching health bars go down than watching them bounce back up? We've got more for shadow priests, from Shadow Priest 101 to a list of every monster worth mind controlling and strategies for raiding Blackwing Descent.Filed under: Priest, (Priest) Spiritual Guidance
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Chalcedony Oct 12th 2011 6:11PM
What do you use as an opener? I usually do 2 Mind Spikes, followed by a VT, MB, then apply DP and SWP. Is that bad?
Jason Oct 12th 2011 6:20PM
That is almost the same opener as me. I do Three Mind Spikes, a VT, MB, apply remaining DOT's, SW:D, and then mind Flay until MB is ready again. The opening guaranteed crit off the Mind Spike Buff (or de-buff, cant remember) makes for a nice beginning to a fight.
Chalcedony Oct 12th 2011 6:28PM
Jason, good point about the MB crit. I find that I also like the mobility of that opener. I fade just before the pull then cast my initial spikes and VT from range and cast my instant MB, DP, SW:P, and SW:D as I run into position.
Shade Oct 12th 2011 6:49PM
(insert very bad spriest-related pickup line) there that's what Fox uses as his opener
Matt Oct 12th 2011 6:52PM
I tend to go with getting Empowered Shadows up asap, so I open with SW:P and then Mind Flay till a proc comes up. It there are multiple targets, I SW:P all of them, like on Shannox, then Mind Flay the one I'm supposed to be killing, to make the boff proc sooner.
Mitch_b_666 Oct 12th 2011 8:12PM
I find that opener to be more of a dps meter pleaser, rather than a bonus to our actual dps.
Yes you might instantly be at 12k dps or so, but youve then got to start from scratch behind that number, back at 0.
I think it's better to get your orbs up as fast as possible, so mines as follow; prepot a volcanic potion, SW:P, MF 1-2 times, AA, MB, VT, DP then shadow fiend.
Z Oct 12th 2011 9:04PM
Mitch_b_66, remember that when you cast AA you lose all your 5 stacks of Evangelism, which is the part that increases your DoT damage, while Dark Archangel only increases your direct damage spells.
Therefore, it is always better to cast AA after you have just refreshed your DoTs (especially VT). This does 2 things: 1) you 'waste' very few GCDs on DoTs while the Dark Archangel buff is active (you should only have to recast VT once, and not DP). 2) you will cast at least 5 ticks of MF before you refresh any DoT, so you will have Evangelism back up to 5 when you recast any DoT.
So, concerning your opener, I think it would be a dps increase to cast VT and DP before AA: prepot a volcanic potion, SW:P, MF 1-2 times, VT, DP, AA, MB, then shadow fiend.
My (very long) opener on the other hand is: Pre-pot, VT, (tank actually pulls here), SW:P, DP, MF, MF, (MF if no Orb), MB, recast VT, recast DP, AA, SF, MF, MF, MB.
Generally my VT and DP are recast when all my procs are still ticking.
Hope this helps.
Matrillik Oct 14th 2011 1:52AM
^this for the most part. Only concern is with
"AA, SF, MF, MF, MB."
I'm fairly certain archangel does not increase shadowfiend damage, so saving it for right before a mind blast is pretty nice, then you can fit more mind blasts in before the buff is gone.
My starter: pain, vt, dp, flay til an orb, mb, trinket, vt, dp, flay, flay, AA, mb, flay like mad.
Mr. Crow Oct 12th 2011 6:19PM
It might just be because I'm not operating at the cutting edge of things, but I don't quite get why Dark Intent is being treated as this thing that only Shadow Priests should get ever. Warlocks may be balanced around putting Dark Intent SOMEwhere in a fight, but I don't think Shadow Priests are balanced with the assumption that a Warlock is always there to give them (and only them) Dark Intent.
in 10-man raiding especially, a Warlock ALWAYS has a target for Dark Intent, but a Shadow Priest doesn't ALWAYS have a Warlock. I also think the comparison to Replenishment just rings a little foul -- sure, Replenishment became a tool that Blizzard used to get some non-raid-viable specs into the raid, but that's nowhere near the same as Dark Intent and how it's used.
I just don't like the idea that Dark Intent is something that belongs to Shadow Priests when it's a Warlock ability. It's like saying Warrior tanks owned Tricks of the Trade or Misdirect because it helped their threat generation.... that's just not how class design works.
Rowdygal Oct 12th 2011 6:48PM
He was saying spriests benefit the most from the haste and the class in designed around that. That is all. He was not saying it BELONGED to spriests, just that it is usually given where it will do the most good. That would be a haste based class , spriests.
Matt Oct 12th 2011 6:54PM
Shadow Pirests are the best target for DI, since we have the most uptime on dots. Boomkins come a close second. So if you have 1 of each of them, it comes down to which player is better at keeping their dots up.
rapsam2003 Oct 12th 2011 7:08PM
Because Dark Intent benefits both the warlock and the person it's cast on...
It gives the warlock haste and gives the spriest haste. Both classes love haste. It benefits both the warlock and the spriest to a greater degree than it does to use Dark Intent on other classes.
Mr. Crow Oct 12th 2011 7:19PM
I'm not arguing that Dark Intent is great for Shadow Priests. It totally is.
I'm arguing that Shadow Priest DPS is fine WITHOUT DI, and Fox's assertion that it is a necessary buff that Shadow Priests are balanced around having 100% of the time is a false assertion. Fox is stating that "if you're a shadow priest and you don't have a warlock in your raid, you're doing sub-par DPS" and I really don't feel like that is the case.
The Replenishment/Vampiric Touch example is just a really poor comparison here, because I don't think Dark Intent is as intrinsic a component for Shadow Priest DPS as Fox is stating here. It's great when we can get it, but asserting that "we suck without it" can't be right.
Mr. Crow Oct 12th 2011 7:20PM
I apologize, let me be clear:
I'm not saying that Dark Intent is NOT great for Shadow Priests. It IS TOTALLY GREAT for Shadow Priests, and I like having it when I can get it. But what I'm saying here is that it's a bonus, not a necessity.
Revynn Oct 12th 2011 7:29PM
- "but I don't quite get why Dark Intent is being treated as this thing that only Shadow Priests should get ever."
Warlock here chiming in. In any given fight, normal 25M Baleroc for instance, if you have a Fire Mage, Rogue, Kitty, Boomkin, SPriest and Warlock, then the Warlock needs to put DI on the SPriest. Shadow Priests have unquestionably the largest gain from DI of any other spec and unless the SPriest in question is absolutely awful (dies 12 seconds into the fight and/or spends most of it staring at the wall) will provide the largest increase to overall raid DPS. The biggest reason for this is that while a Boomkin or Fire Mage fills with Scorch or Wrath which benefits from DI's 3% Haste buff, Mind Flay as a channeled spell benefits not only from the Haste, but also the stacking buff to DoT damage.
TL;DR - SPriests are affected by DI in more ways than other classes, making them the best target.
That's not to say that the SPriest is -always- the best target. In my 10M group, our Fire Mage goes up to play Starfox while our SPriest stays down on the ground to help deal with Meteors and adds. Since the Fire Mage has near 100% uptime on the boss and is closing in on 80K dot-based DPS, he is a far better place to put my DI than the SPriest hanging out on the ground, switching targets, chasing stuff around and killing adds that die plenty fast already.
Likewise, on Heroic Staghelm, our Combat Rogue maintains a far higher uptime on her Concentration buff than our SPriest does because she'll never get pounced on during Cat phases. Who should I put the damage buff on? The SPriest doing 30K DPS and running around trying not to die or the Rogue doing 50K DPS without interruption?
What I really found amusing was when our last Holy Pally practically DEMANDED Dark Intent and I told her I would sooner put it on my Imp. Of course, she was a meter whore and also the only healer I've ever known who thought it was necessary to pre-pot.
George Oct 12th 2011 7:33PM
Both warlocks and shadow priests benefit the most from the warlock giving the buff to a shadow priest if possible.
It's a great buff for both classes. The next best class for a warlock to cast it on is another warlock, who will already have their own to cast on someone else.
Both of them are very DoT and haste heavy classes. As one warlock said to me, "shadow priests are DI proccing machines".
Because it benefits both classes so much, the only time the warlock is going to be giving DI to someone else is when there are more warlocks than shadow priests in the raid.
Affliction warlocks, in fact, are almost exactly the same as shadow priests mechanically. You can draw almost 1:1 equivalences between the classes. My affliction warlock actually uses my shadow priest's power auras, with the spells renamed. VT -> UA, SW:P - Corruption, even SW:D -> Life Tap, MF -> Shadow Bolt and MB -> Haunt. The difference comes down to things like Empowered Shadow. In this case, it's a warlock buff, and a shadow priest is near enough an affliction warlock.
Z Oct 12th 2011 9:09PM
George,
DI doesn't stack:
a warlock casting DI on another warlock will cancel his/her own DI when it procs. As far as I understand it, there are much much better options in almost every situation that locks giving themselves DI.
Spellotape Oct 13th 2011 6:14AM
@ Z
While the proc didn't stack, the haste buff used to. Before my guild had any (or even a single) shadow priest to speak of, our numerous warlocks would stack it on each other for the extra haste.
George Oct 13th 2011 11:19AM
@Z I wasn't suggesting that DI stacked. I said the classes that benefit from having the buff on them the most (regardless of whether they got it by giving it to someone else, or got it from someone giving it to them, it's the same buff) are the shadow priest and the warlock.
What I said was "The next best class for a warlock to cast it on is another warlock, _who will already have their own to cast on someone else_", implying that shadow priests get it because there's no point in casting it on other warlocks, since I was replying to a question on why shadow priests almost always get it.
Xayíde Oct 14th 2011 4:59PM
Actually, the Warlock benefits a tiny bit more from putting DI on a Boomkin instead of a SPriest. The benefit to the SPRiest however is far greater than the benefit to the Moonkin so the Warlock would be doing a disservice to the raid by choosing the Boomkin over the SPriest (considering similar gear and skill etc...)