Patch 5.2 interview with Dave Kosak
Inside an old alt's vault
The latest patch 5.2 news
All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsNew Mists of Pandaria talent calculator live
by Chase Hasbrouck 
Oct 23rd 2011 at 2:00PM
Now, I'm not sure how much calculation you'll actually need to do when you only have six choices to make, but congratulations to the Wowhead team for getting this put together so quickly. Fore more information on talents, check out our liveblog of the Class Talent System Panel.
The news is out -- we'll be playing Mists of Pandaria! Find out what's in store with an all-new talent system, peek over our shoulder at our Pandaren hands-on, and get ready to battle your companion pets against others. It's all here right at WoW Insider!Filed under: BlizzCon, Mists of Pandaria
Reader Comments (Page 3 of 4)
Ganatola Oct 23rd 2011 3:23PM
I have to be honest - I love this system. It completely revolutionizes the generic MMO talent tree for three reasons:
1. It cuts out the fat, pork, unneeded and unwanted junk of Talent Trees (like boost the power of Wrath by 10%). Nobody is excited to shove points into Improved Regrowth. Everybody likes slapping a point into a sweet move like Remorseless Winter. It is your choice of abilities you can get now from your Spec; what you do with your abilities and how well you use them is what will most greatly affect your healing, tanking, damaging across the board. Not what spec you have.
I have a feeling most of the % damage increase we used to have will be rolled into the ability itself, and if not, then we'll all lose some DPS/HPS/TPS. Before you freak out about the potential drop in (X)PS, remember: it's a new expansion; we'll get it all back soon enough.
2. It gives a new freedom unlike anything seen in an MMO before (I'll be honest, I've only played WoW. Correct me if I'm wrong here). The "Talents" in the talent tree are actual talents, abilities now. Don't think of Bladestorm as an Arms ability anymore. It's an AOE for all warriors, and from what I heard from Blizzcon, its going to be a quick switch from Bladestorm to Avatar in an AOE to Boss fight situation.
A heavy-movement boss, a tank-and-spank, and a battle-for-survival will all require different abilities to be optimum. Anyone who says "NO! This is the best spec for DPS" will be left behind in the raiding scene, because the system is far more flexible now. The game is becoming simpler, and the "cookie cutter spec" with optimum DPS will be different with every encounter; thus, there will be NO cookie cutter spec.
You can spec into whatever the heck you want to, and you won't be nearly as penalized in this system than in the last. Your talents aren't going to be as influential as before; your ability to play the game is more so.
3. It is an easy system, thus it makes your life easier. What more do you want in one of the more important aspects of the game, especially a part that is so passive? This system also makes your choice of spec more active: you are switching around your abilities to meet the demands of the fight you're in.
Your actual spec stays the same, but if you need more Pew Pew than CC in one fight, just swap around your abilities. No running back to Org or Stormwind to change your tree - just fix it then and there. The boys at Blizzcon said changing talents around is as easy as glyphs. I'm taking their word for it.
In short, this is a very intelligent move on Blizzard's part. They killed the concept of the cookie cutter spec, made the talent trees far more interesting and active, and gave more freedom to control how you want to play, all in one smooth motion. There is a reason Blizzard is still on top after all these years: they know what the heck they are doing.
Boobah Oct 23rd 2011 6:39PM
To be honest, they didn't exactly 'kill' the cookie cutter spec. It's just that now we'll all have the cookie cutter spec, and we ended up with six talent points left over at 90.
Deathknighty Oct 23rd 2011 3:25PM
CBCBCB Death Knight FTW!
Who else is gonna take that build? What are your dk builds? Let's make this epic!
Or not, whatever, my email will thank you. :D
kevin.luang Oct 23rd 2011 4:44PM
BBCBCB will probably be my standard spec, but Blizzard wants you to change it up a lot for diffent fights.
But yeah, corpse explosion? Force choke? *taunts dragon* COME AT ME BRO!
Narshe Oct 23rd 2011 6:48PM
ACBCAB
Although I can't see spells like Outbreak and Death Pact being turned into talents, that would be lame.
Kodiack Oct 23rd 2011 4:21PM
Wow, get a job or something, are you 12 and THAT butthurt to be raging on this site every single day over a game that you "won't play" again?
Caylynn Oct 23rd 2011 4:36PM
To all of you complaining about losing spells, skills, and abilities: you realize that many of these will be "hard wired" into your spec now? So you don't need to worry about choosing damaging abilities or DPS increase talents if you play a DPS spec. They will be automatically incorporated into your spec, and you will naturally gain them as you level up. So you don't have to worry that they are present in the talent trees. The talent trees are there to give flavour and choices, not to give you spells and abilities anymore.
TheTraveler12 Oct 23rd 2011 6:18PM
no REAL choice at 45 for fury.. fuck CC. i hit things and they die. I dont have time to be worrying about whether or not that one mob got away from me. thats what charge is for. piercing howl? no thanks. Cripple? Throwdown? throwdown is an ARMS talent. wtf are they thinking. I hope this changes.. severely. Or just go back to the way it was. Who gives a shit about cookie cutter specs as long as i can have fun in that spec i don't care.
Boobah Oct 23rd 2011 6:46PM
Seriously? You hate Throwdown because it is currently an Arms talent? Hope you never use Deathwish. And since Arms talents are automatically disqualified, I guess you don't use Deep Wounds, either?
Long story short: That's not what these talents are about. Everything you need to be a (your spec of choice) is baked in. The cookie cutter spec is what everybody has, anything else is a bad choice, so why give people the option to fail?
Strawder Oct 23rd 2011 5:01PM
My initial reaction after playing with this for about 10 minutes?
I prefer the old trees better. I'm sorry, I just do.
And I'm a Casual, not an Elite or anything.
As it stands right now, it feels very pigeon-holed to me, like removing ranged and melee slots from Warriors/Rogues and Hunters. Sure that stuff wasn't necessary, but it gave you things to play with, fun little things.
I'll wait and hold any other thoughts until they flesh it out better. I'm sure this is really early, and really half-cocked at the moment. Hopefully it'll get a good deal more work before it goes even into Beta stages.
As someone who's tried recently to bring in a few people who've never played anything like WoW before, and watched them leave within the free trial telling me the game was too hard and too confusing, I can understand why they're doing this. I still can't help but feel they're punishing the rest of us for the select few.
TheTraveler12 Oct 23rd 2011 6:13PM
i hope to god they change the talents for warrior.. i have NO choice at lvl 45 to take a talent i want.. i have to choose between 2 types of CC.. im a fucking FURY warrior.. we dont use CC..
TheTraveler12 Oct 23rd 2011 6:14PM
i meant 3!! 3 types of cc i never fucking use. in PVE or any other situation.
Boobah Oct 23rd 2011 6:56PM
And you're a not a very good player if you can't see the possibilities. It's not as if you're giving anything up to get these, except for other CC abilities you wouldn't normally take.
Which is kind of the point. Most of these talents are not supposed to be DPS boosts, or survivability boosts, or healing boosts. And every one that IS is competing with other DPS, survivability, and healing boosts.
Some of 'em still need work; I rather doubt that it's a good idea, for example, to have hunters with a snare vs. two DPS boosts, even if they match thematically, or warriors with an AOE stun vs a couple DPS boosts.
Narayana Oct 23rd 2011 8:15PM
This is the point of this change.
The people who try to apply the old way of thinking- the ones who stick by the mantra of "I R DPS, I do DPS" will sink in the new model. This approach allows you to make choices that you never had to make and allows you to make that choice without having to give up something that is core to your spec.
richmale1969 Oct 23rd 2011 6:20PM
I hate this more than the cookie cutter talents we have now. I'd really love to see a talent system similar to what Rift has.
TheTraveler12 Oct 23rd 2011 6:22PM
paladin at 15? do i NEED to have to run after a mob? let them run away, they always come back anyways. Why even release the calculator until its near finished or we are in BETA? All its going to do is piss people off.
Boobah Oct 23rd 2011 7:04PM
Yeah, because it's certainly not your job to get out of the fire. And switching targets? Sure don't want to make THAT take less time. We certainly don't want our tanks to position the mobs more rapidly, either.
Artificial Oct 23rd 2011 6:33PM
"Druids chosen for the screenshot because they're the best class in the game"
You've miscounted. Druids are the best four classes in the game. :p
TheTraveler12 Oct 23rd 2011 6:47PM
looking over all the classes im getting rightly pissed off. wtf not final version. I doubt the selections will change much. The numbers will no doubt change but i have low hopes for the actual talents to change. This is sad if they are going to stay this way. there are far too many classes with higher lvl talents that play no part in some specs. Dps specs with healing talents, for other people? wtf is that shit? I will be far too busy hitting things to worry about a raid member about to die. THAT is the fucking healers job.
Boobah Oct 23rd 2011 7:04PM
Believe it or not, you do more DPS if you're alive. And you do more DPS when the tank and healer are alive. Your job, in a group setting, is to do whatever you can to get the group through.
You'd've been fun to see in a BC heroic. Or a Cataclysm one last December or January.