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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsBreakfast Topic: "Blizzard's Horde bias" -- fact or delusion?
by Jeff Fincher 
Oct 26th 2011 at 8:00AM
It seems every week on the official forums, other game sites, and in daily conversation in Azeroth or Earth, the topic comes up that Blizzard favors the Horde. When the claim is directed toward lore development, even Horde players sometimes agree. But is there merit to the accusation?
Chris Metzen admits he loves Thrall and gets excited talking about the Orc's story, but he's also named Malfurion Stormrage as his favorite character in the past. Developers incite cheers of Lok'tar Ogar and For the Horde! at BlizzCon while suggesting Not the face! for the Alliance's new battlecry.
Most of this, however, is not where players look for their sole source of faction pride. It's in the game. The Horde's story has gotten very interesting with Sylvanas' darker path, Garrosh's controversial leadership, and Thrall's place on center stage in Cataclysm. The Alliance, however, has seen very little involvement from its leaders, and some players feel what they have seen has been out of character for their leaders. Malfurion neutral as Ashenvale burns -- or worse, as Tyrande is attacked?
Perhaps the strongest supporting evidence for or against bias (depending how you interpret it) are Metzen's recent comments that the Alliance will get some needed attention to strengthen that faction pride in two novels focusing on the Alliance, first with Wolfheart by Richard Knaack, followed by a still-untitled novel about Jaina Proudmoore by Christie Golden. But is that enough?
Do you think novels will stir the passion in the Alliance players' hearts, or is Blizzard going down the wrong path for the right desire? Do you think there's any merit to the claim of bias to begin with, or is it just more faction feuding amongst players?
Filed under: Breakfast Topics, Guest Posts
Reader Comments (Page 4 of 19)
SR Oct 26th 2011 8:46AM
"Sorry guys, I showed up at your wedding and called you a F****** ****sucker, Emo F***ot, and what not."
Apology doesn't mean SHIT if you've smeared it all over everyone's faces. They're "professionals". Should've known what to spew onto the crowd and what not.
Sleutel Oct 26th 2011 9:05AM
@Cephas:
Wow, whoever wrote that really needs to learn how to apologize. "Sorry you were too much of a stick-in-the-mud to get the joke" is not an apology.
loop_not_defined Oct 26th 2011 10:57AM
L90ETC is a semi-in-character, Horde-themed band. It's satire.
Boobah Oct 26th 2011 11:53AM
There's a difference between being pro-Horde and anti-Alliance. I don't think most of the people pissed off about that incident care that ETC is pro-Horde. What they're pissed off about is A) that Corpsegrinder was anti-Alliance and B) he went beyond that, and insulted the players for preferring Alliance to Horde. Oh, and C) that the folks running Blizzcon either couldn't tell the difference or are full-on in support of the sentiment.
Friends can say stuff like that about each other without it being insulting, but if the first thing you ever get from somebody is that... well, you're not likely to take it in a spirit of fun.
Cephas Oct 26th 2011 12:14PM
For the record, I definitely think that the Corpsegrinder video crossed the line in terms of appropriate content for Blizzcon. If I had been responsible for writing the apology that's what I would have focused on.
But still, it was never meant to communicate "OFFICIAL disdain" - the apology did at least make that much clear.
Edge00 Oct 26th 2011 8:12AM
This idea of "horde bias" makes no sense to me. Warcraft is a story that Blizzard (Metzen) wants to tell about a fictional place called Azeroth. If you don't like the way that Alliance leaders are responding to conflict in the game, its just not a compelling story (to you). I don't see where bias fits in. Its like saying Star Wars has a Jedi or Rebel Alliance bias... no, thats just the story Lucas wanted to tell.
Horde bias would be if anyone who made a horde character got 100,000 gold and free epics at level 1 and Alliance characters didn't.
Magius Oct 26th 2011 8:38AM
Its is not that we don't like how the story is going so much as the story is weak and just doesn't make sense at times. We have established characters that follow a certain path of logic per the lore and when certain things happen they just sit twiddling their thumbs.
It is the equivalent of someone coming in, hit on your girlfriend/boyfriend, and you just sit there ignoring it when you are known (and proven to be) to be the jealous type. Just doesn't make much sense.
Yeah, yeah, odd analogy but you get the point.
Spellotape Oct 26th 2011 8:49AM
Stories can have bias regardless of the direction the writers choose to take it. As it stands, they might as well decimate the Alliance and call it World of Hordecraft - if the story is compelling to you (not you personally, but anyone/everyone) then you are probably Horde because "your side" is not losing anything but constantly gaining and attaining great victories while having interesting inner-faction conflict, as well.
Edge00 Oct 26th 2011 9:37AM
I know what bias is. I guess I just don't see this story as having political parties the need to be supported and lobbied for. I get being a fan of one faction or another, but I really don't see where bias is a relevant factor to be discussing about a story. Of course there are "winners" and "losers", antagonists and protagonists. I can even see how a person might view the faction opposite of the one they primarily play as an antagonist. However, I don't understand how the storyteller can be "for" or "against" factions in a story he created.
How do you measure a story to determine it is weak? Pounds? Feet? Degrees? Its subjective. I think in this case if it doesn't make sense its because we as players don't see the whole picture.
Is there bias? Sure, whatever, but thats not even germane to the discussion.
conundrum Oct 26th 2011 10:23AM
@Spellotape
It all depends at how you look at it. You may see the Alliance doing nothing but losing lands (because you obviously do not play in the Barrens and see Taurejo burnt to the ground), but what about something so much more important? The Horde is losing its soul. Now this actually does feed into the Horde getting more story time, but it is like watching a show where your favorite character becomes less and less likable, and more and more of a jerk you hate. I watch one of my favorite faction leaders die, the Forsaken becoming more and more overtly evil, and the Orcs being led by a raging maniac. The Goblins and Trolls are the only ones that have ANYTHING good going on, and both of them take huge backseats to the Orcs and Forsaken. No appreciable lore for Blood Elves.
So then the question becomes; Would you rather be told a story about somebody you really like becoming somebody you hate, or just not get any story?
Full disclosure, the only Alliance I have played since Cata is the Worgen starting zone so I lack a full appreciation of all the story (or lack thereof) out there.
EverythingRuned Oct 26th 2011 1:33PM
Apparently this guy has never read bad fanfiction. "Bias is impossible in an author's work".... ha!
nymrohd Oct 26th 2011 8:16AM
Whatever Metzen thinks, the significant majority of players don't give a rat's ass about novels.
Orrine Oct 26th 2011 9:29AM
< avid novel reader here
Yeah. Garrosh ass being beaten by Warian in Ashenvale almost doesn't matter to me because I didn't see it in game. And I didn't see that battle implication either.
Glaras Oct 26th 2011 9:49AM
Agreed. The novels have no impact on me, insofar as the game is concerned.
As for the bias accusation: FACT. It's very clear that for at least the last 3 years, the effort has been put into making the Horde more interesting, more "cool", and the blatant bias is displayed by the development team every chance they get. As has been pointed out by many in these posts, if you're Alliance and you go to BlizzCon, you can expect the company (and whether you agree or not, like it or not, employees of the company *are* the face of the company, period) to bash you for being Alliance.
More evidence: the announced future destruction of Theramore. A port city with a long history both in-game and in lore, the seat of one of the leaders of the Alliance, Jaina. And they're going to have the Horde destroy it. Zharym's comments in the forums are dismissive and condescending, chiding us for not waiting for the rest of the story, for being upset over the "opening moves". Apparently, he wasn't aware of Southshore, or of Ashenvale.
Then there is the widely-discussed Twilight Highlands chains where the Horde is commencing battle ops in a contested area, while the Alliance is arranging a wedding between squabbling dwarves.
The evidence is clear, in spite of the protests of Blizzard employees and their apologists: there is a bias among the developers that translates into in-game differences that clearly favor players who choose Horde.
Mattimus Oct 26th 2011 10:48AM
When I was young, maybe 10 or 11, I used to go to the used book store and buy books like BattleTech and Aliens novels. They were violent and gory, and I loved them.
I'm 26 now though. I don't have the same kind of free time as I used to, and my tastes have sophisticated some. Warcraft novels may be okay, maybe even pretty good, but I'm not going to pick one up instead of Wise Man's Fear or A Dance with Dragons. I don't have time to read all the books I'd like to, and things like the Warcraft books are the first things to fall off that list.
Obviously the books are making enough money to be worth it to them, or I'd ask why they bother writing, printing, and selling something that boils down to a Wowpedia entry for most of their players.
Al Oct 26th 2011 8:18AM
Given how poorly they've weaved anything from the books into the game, I can't see it helping.
Littleeye Oct 26th 2011 8:19AM
From a writer's perspective, it would be a very understandable tendency to favour Horde where it comes to plot development and 'flavour'. Simple reason:
The 'good' guys want to preserve the balance and keep life structured and peaceful.
The 'bad' guys seek to upset the balance and change the world into. Note the brackets that I have applied here, btw.
In most stories, it's the 'bad' characters that carry the energy. If a story featured only good guys, nut much would happen. So for a writer/story developer, it is easier to come up with a plot driven by the Horde faction, I would think. The Alliance is mostly occupied with reacting to Horde plans (maybe excepting Alliance initiatives to recover terrain previously lost to the Horde).
So if there is a bias, it may well result from story development mechanics rather than a personal preference for the Horde faction and its characters.
esposib Oct 26th 2011 9:16AM
I'm thinking you aren't actually a writer, because that was the most simplistic interpretation of how writers handle 'good' guys and 'bad' guys that I've ever seen. Energy in a story comes from conflict, whether it is internal conflict within an individual or conflict BETWEEN individuals or groups of individuals. The Horde story has seen great development because of the conflict between different leaders (Cairne and Garrosh, Sylvanas and... everyone else, etc.) plus the internal conflict we see so clearly illustrated by the Thrall quests at 85. The Alliance story has had almost no development, despite the possibilities of conflicts that could be explored.
I challenge anyone to explain why the Alliance leader - a person that has sworn his hatred of the Horde - sits idly in his throne room while his allies are attacked in Ashenvale, Gilneas, Hillsbrad, and Twilight Highlands. He even goes out of his way to send heroes to help the Trolls. That's not a leader, and that isn't good story development.
Muse Oct 26th 2011 9:28AM
The antagonist isn't necessarily the "bad guy".
Angus Oct 26th 2011 10:13AM
Challenge accepted.
He is sitting on his thumbs because NOT doing so destroys the Alliance an he knows it.
Ashenvale is hosed, but it is in Kalimdor and his forces trying to assist Stonetalon are bogged down, sending them to help would make the little territory they have vanish and wipe out his troops for nothing. He's got enough problems with the Barrens now and the Horde has hurt itself with the destruction of a Cenarion school.
Gilneas fell. That's in his favor. As ling as they're mad at the Forsaken they aren't hiding behind a wall.
The Dwarves are fractured and, frankly, not the best choice to send support for combat operations. Fighters worried the Dark Irons behind them may be just as willing to attack them as the Orcs don't fight well.
Gnomes are still dealing with their home and weren't exactly a force to be reckoned with anyway.
Space goats... Yea, not known for being super deadly and they are best used to help the Night Elves.
Night Elves are most in conflict with the Horde yet have a ton of interaction with them as individuals. I mean come on, they have FOUR separate factions that work with the Horde. FOUR. If he goes on a Horde killing spree he risks killing off people that have helped keep this war from getting very bad. Considering that any time someone has a beef with Malfurion they try to kill a prominant member of the Horde, it is in the Alliance's best interest to keep the Druids working with the Horde.
Add to that the Forsaken and spies he probably has and he NEEDS to sit on his hands. Thrall put together a large group of races that needed to band together to survive. If you attack one member, you risk having the rest come to their aid. If you let a moron piss off all the other races they may not listen when he calls. Let one acre the others and you might be able to take her out. Let a former member of your side hang out with your people and maybe after one of your people saves them from a painful withdrawal problem, they may not help the others.
If he let's the Horde tear itself apart, he might be able to pick and choose fights and wipe out the ones he wants gone while leaving the rest.
I bet SI:6 had orders to capture Thrall from him. Get Thrall out of the equation, stop him from reuniting the Horde once it has fractured and the Alliance can ignore the Tauren and Trolls, wipe out the Forsaken and Orks and work with the Goblins and Blood Elves.