Encrypted Text: How PoisonSwapper shaped rogues forever

Rogues are a pure DPS class, which means that all three of our ability trees are DPS-focused. We don't have the capability to heal or tank, and our ranged attack arsenal is weaker than a hunter's argument that he deserves a Crystallized Firestone for his Ranseur of Hatred. While there are other pure DPS classes like the mage and warlock, rogue specs have more in common than fire and arcane or destruction and demonology. Our combo point rotation system defines each talent tree's playstyle, and many of our signature spells are shared between all specs.
Because of the similarities between our specs, there are several concepts that apply to all rogues. I've called these axioms, rules, and laws in the past, but the truth is that they're not always inscribed in stone for everyone to read. I'm talking about the knowledge that established rogues take for granted, as we're so used to our habits that we forget why we started them in the first place.
Deadly Poison drives many of our choices
When designing a proc effect, the developers typically lean toward one of two options: percentage-based rates or proc-per-minute (PPM) rates. Percentage-based proc rates give our attacks a flat percent change to activate, which means that faster weapons that land more attacks will yield more procs. PPM-based proc rates scale their proc chance up or down based on our weapon speed, which means we should see the same number of procs per minute, regardless of what weapon we use.
While Instant Poison and others were moved to use PPM mechanic many moons ago, Deadly Poison has remained untouched as a percentage-based poison. When we have five stacks of Deadly Poison on our target, each additional DP proc actually activates our other poison.
Deadly Poison was redesigned in this fashion largely due to Adrine's clever addon PoisonSwapper, which automatically swapped our weapons to exploit a weakness in Deadly Poison's design. PoisonSwapper would swap our off-hand weapon to an alternate weapon laced with Instant or Wound Poison whenever we were at five stacks of Deadly Poison, and then swap back to the Deadly Poison weapon just in time to refresh the stack. Blizzard had no option but to redesign Deadly Poison or force rogues into using an addon to maximize their DPS.
Because the redesigned Deadly Poison yields more poison procs when we're using a quick weapon, we want to use the quickest weapon possible. All of those extra Deadly Poison procs are guaranteed to give us extra Instant Poison procs once our target is at five stacks of DP, which means that our DP-laced weapon actually generates more Instant Poison procs than our main weapon does.
A tale of two poisons
While assassination rogues have plenty of talents that prop up Instant Poison, it's actually not that great for combat or subtlety rogues. In fact, Wound Poison deals more damage over the course of an encounter for these two specs than Instant Poison does, due to its high proc rate. The catch is Deadly Poison and Wound Poison don't synergize well due to WP's low individual proc damage. Because each Deadly Poison proc generates a massive Instant Poison proc when you're using IP, the two dovetail into a combo that combat and subtlety simply can't resist.
If you're crawling through a quick dungeon or engaging in PVP on your subtlety or combat rogue, there's nothing wrong with tossing on some Wound Poison onto your weapons. Unless you're getting more than 30 seconds of uninterrupted damage on your target, Wound Poison will probably yield more damage anyway. In fact, Wound Poison is actually the poison of choice for combat and subtlety ranged weapons in most situations, although that point becomes moot in Mists of Pandaria. The Instant/Deadly Poison combo requires a full stack of Deadly Poison active on our target before it's effective.
The quintessential quick dagger
Because Deadly Poison is a cornerstone for every rogue spec in PVE, we need a quick weapon to apply our poisons to our targets as soon as possible. Blizzard's developers have stopped itemizing quick melee weapons for rogues that aren't daggers, so all three specs are stuck using daggers in their off-hand.
While I miss the imagery of a rogue dual-wielding sharp swords or heavy maces, the fact is that itemizing gear for rogues and ensuring we have a good off-hand weapon available has become much easier. In fact, having quick daggers as the de facto OH weapon for all three specs makes it easier for us to be flexible with our choice of spec. There are other reasons to use a quick weapon, like Combat Potency, but Deadly Poison ensures that all three specs are equally inclined.
The Mists of Pandaria cloud our view
Ghostcrawler (WoW's lead systems designer) admitted that the poison system will be getting a revamp in the upcoming MoP expansion pack. While exact details of what's changing are scarce, I have to imagine that today's poisons, as we know them, will be gone. Deadly Poison's mechanics drive so many of the choices that we make on our rogues, and so there will be plenty of research and theorycrafting put into MoP as rogues work to find out how the poison redesign tweaks every aspect of our class.
Filed under: Rogue, (Rogue) Encrypted Text






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
DarkFinch Nov 9th 2011 1:13PM
10+million subs is far from dead.. Just ask Blizz's wallet.
DarkFinch Nov 9th 2011 1:15PM
^ Meant to be a reply to celticman245... Silly comment system! =P
Narlic Nov 9th 2011 1:14PM
Hey, what do you think the likely-hood is for us to see some revamping for 4.3? I notice that the rogue section of the PTR notes only mentions the Wound poison change (which was really just part of the overall healing-debuff change). I keep hoping to see SOMETHING on the PTR... and one of the things I am hoping for is a preview of the poisons change.
ZodiacDragons Nov 9th 2011 2:40PM
I don't think rogues are going to see any new changes till next patch. Historically, (and I could be wrong on this) our class has changed the least throught the game's life time. MoP does look promising tho :)
ZodiacDragons Nov 9th 2011 2:41PM
Next expansion* not next patch
Chase Christian Nov 9th 2011 5:38PM
I think the legendary daggers are the only review we're going to see. They put a LOT of time and effort into the quest line.
Fragments Nov 9th 2011 1:22PM
Cool story bro.
GuyverIV Nov 9th 2011 1:25PM
...ok, son, I know you're scared, but we need you to show the nice police man on this doll where the mean GhostCrawler touched you.
(Seriously, looking at this nozzle's history is a lesson in how to simultaniously add no value to a conversation while sounding like a spoiled 15 year old manchild who needs a smack on the back of the head and a firm "Hush!" I don't normally ponder about when the banhammer's coming, but... well, I'm pondering.)
Forward Nov 9th 2011 1:29PM
Haha first post is such an arsehole.
Emophia Nov 9th 2011 1:44PM
I hate using a dagger as an offhand for combat.
It looks so freaking janky, having a massive axe in my mainhand and some tiny dagger in my offhand. So wrong.
Narlic Nov 9th 2011 2:03PM
I don't know... I've noticed that daggers have gotten pretty huge lately. For example, I am currently wielding Gatecrasher and Entrail Disgorger in combat (because the Razor won't drop...) and the "tiny dagger" is longer than the "massive axe"
caldai Nov 9th 2011 2:16PM
Agreed.
Pudwhack Nov 9th 2011 4:30PM
I like the design. As a rogue, it never felt right to hold two large swords. I felt like a warrior with leather armor. A main hand sword and off hand dagger just feels like a better class fit.
Sleutel Nov 9th 2011 7:38PM
Welcome to actual history:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parrying_dagger
REDMJOEL Nov 9th 2011 1:59PM
And yet, here you are commenting on a game you claim not to care about. Hmmm
Khirsah Nov 9th 2011 2:10PM
No matter what the changes to poisons, I'm glad that some are on the way. Not because we desperately need changes, but because I am worried about the future of our class as the only pure melee dps.
Don't get me wrong: I'm not celticman up there (who, based on his comment history, appears to be a fury warrior that sucks at pvp and wants to blame Ghostcrawler). I don't think the sky is falling for WoW or our class. But it is nice to know that the devs recognize our entirely unique position in the game, and are working toward giving us some added utility to bring to a raid, especially in the face of another melee hybrid joining the bunch.
ZodiacDragons Nov 9th 2011 2:36PM
I agree, sky's not falling but we aren't really climbing either. I for one am looking forward to see what changes we get in MoP. Going to be nice to be able to use different poisons lol. The biggest thing I'm looking forward to tho isn't changes to poisons, it's the fact that all rogue specs are going to hav access to Shadowstep again. YES!!!! *fist pump*
Narlic Nov 9th 2011 3:17PM
*chanting* Sha-Dow-Step! Sha-Dow-Step! WOOO!
ZodiacDragons Nov 9th 2011 2:27PM
Ya really. Look at this guys guys comment history. I've read all the way back to Aug 28th, 2009 and, seriously, EVERY single post this guys has made has been negative (mostly about warrior tanks). There wasn't a single positive comment at all. The last few posts have all been about the same thing: "Game is dead. Fire Greg Street." Bro, stop commenting on here if you can't contribute anything. Damn.
JA Nov 9th 2011 3:56PM
I don't know about you guys, but my luck with OH dagger drops has been horrendous! Throughout T11, Cho'gall never once drop his dagger for me, and I ended up spending 20K for the Scaleslicer.
And several months of raiding FL, not once had I seen Alysra's Razor. The freakin' mount actually drop off her for our raid group a couple of times, but of course never the dagger.
The only time I've seen the Entrail Disgorger was when I tanked on my warrior...