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11-16-2011 @ 6:49AM
My thoughts on this:1. Won't the story of this book take place BEFORE 5.0? Wolfheart takes place BEFORE 22.214.171.124. Why is Alliance getting major character development in books and Horde getting major character development in game?Is it because a) Blizzard don't think the Horde players can read? (Their main is a Tauren.)b) Blizzard don't think the Horde players can afford books? (Their main is a Troll.)c) Blizzard thinks that the Horde players hate books? (Their main is an Orc.)d) Blizzard rather have the Alliance players pay for something that the Horde players get for free, since the Horde players have the sense to pick the winning side? (Their main is a Goblin.)(j/k) ;-)3. Why does Horde players complain about Garrosh? This is World of Warcraft and you are WINNING because of him. Seriously, he is awesome. He always attacks in the right time at the right place and thanks to him, you steamroll the Alliance. Isn't that what you wanted. Without him, Sylvanas would still sit and be emo in Undercity instead of finishing off three of the Human nations (Alterac, Lordaeron and Stromgarde) and driving a fourth into exile (Gilneas). (Well, there is still Eastern Plaguelands, but you know... Paladins. Neutral. Organisation created to fight the Lich King, but can't be bothered with something as minor as a zombie invasion wiping out four human nations. Makes so much sense. Yep.)4. Also, why do so many Horde players see themselves as being turned into the bad guys here? I haven't played Ashenvale in Cata. I tried to avoid it since I liked it so much in Cata, and I expect most of the forest to be cut down by now. After all, that's why the Horde came there in the first place, right? The Warsong clan especially cut down more trees that they needed and let the rot just for lulz, and to piss of the Night Elves even more. (It actually makes sense from a military perspective. Cutting down the whole forest makes it so much easier to wipe out the Night Elves. The trees will grow back. The elves won't.) But I have been attacking Ashenvale, with many alts, since vanilla and I have, personally, NEVER felt like a villain. So why should you feel like villains now when you are doing the exact same thing that you have done since 2005, only because you are better at it? It's not like you were unaware of what could happen, since in Vanilla the Warsong clan cut down as much forest as they could, and the Forsaken merrilly raised dead for their armies and used plague to kill their captives. Seriously, stop with the QQ. You wanted war to be put back in warcraft, you wanted to scream Lok'tar Ogar For The Horde and rush right into the Alliance ranks, smashing skulls and cutting off limbs, and now that you get to do that, you whine? Some people...5. Also, why is everyone thinking Garrosh is dumb/bad/evil for attacking Theramore? Look at what happened, from a military perspective. (Theorycrafting a little since we don't know the full story from Jaina's perspective. We'll get it in a book so Blizzard can have their developers put more stories about Thrall and Sylvanas in the game instead. Yay.) The Horde attacks Ashenvale. Despite the mighty victory in Wolfheart (cough) the Horde is still expanding there, pushing the Night Elves back. (Since Night Elves appareantly suck at combat since 2005 and need to be rescued at the last moment by the humans and ex-humans. Someone said the Night Elves are the strongest fighting force on Azeroth. Suuure.) To save the Night Elves (who I consider a joke at this point, compared to what they were in Warcraft 3) the Alliance opens up a second front in the Barrens, forcing the Horde to pull troops out of Ashenvale to defend themselves. (This ofc makes the ALLIANCE the villains in the average Horde player's eyes, since, you know, the RIGHT thing to do would be to peacefully let the Horde exterminate the Night Elves. Yep. Ofc, the real die-hard Horde fanboys probaly thinks that it's ok to wipe out the elves, because, you know, they're elves. And they have stuff the Horde wants.) Anyway, the Horde, more or less, wins in the Barrens, but are still fighting on two fronts and can't send every soldier they have to finally end the misery of the Kaldorei, so, naturally, they mass their resources on one front. With Theramore, Northwatch Hold and the Alliance troops in Southern Barrens gone, the Horde can direct all their efforts northwards. I mean seriously? This is war, and Theramore troops are invading Horde territory and preventing the Horde to win on another front. If I could wipe out Theramore, I would. If they didn't want to die, they shouldn't have attacked. The Theramore-Horde war was NOT started by the Horde. If you play with fire, you might get burned. And I actually respect Garrosh for not being like the dumbass Alliance leaders that are all like "Oh noes, the Horde is attacking and they took some of our land and killed some of our people. Phew. They halted their offensive. Now we can all have peace and bunnies again." (Repeated in infinitum.) Ever thought about which obligations the title "Warchief" implies?6. Some also wonders how the Horde can raze such a mighty fortress. That one is easy, they just need to use the resources that they have and Theramore doesn't. Shamans and aircraft. It will take some planning to syncronize it, but here's what I would do. The horde army, accompanied by every Horde-loyal shaman they can find (remember that the Humans and High Elves have no connection with the spirits, and are more likely tahn not to have offended them one way or another) arrive at Theramore's gates in the middle of the night and immediately call upon the elements to set off massive earthquakes, similar to what Thrall did at Durnholde. As walls and buildnings collapses, killing many of the defenders or burying them alive, Goblin zeppelins and aircraft fly in from the north and firebomb everything, including the ships in the harbor. The grunts and braves then rush right into the confusion, finishing off the shocked, disoriented and disorganized survivors, while the shamans call on the spirits to make a whirlpool, tidal wave or hurricane that sinks whatever fleet is left after the Goblin attack. Then they'll march northwards along the beach to take out Northwatch. Easy.7. With Theramore gone, now the Horde can focus their effort on the Night Elves. Bye bye Ashenvale?8. I almost hope the burning of Theramore will be an Horde-only event. I can't decide on what is more depressing for the Alliance players, to see another town destroyed and having to play on an Horde alt to see what happens, or to be forced by Blizzard to be invited to yet another show of HORDE TOTAL FIGHTING SUPERIORITY. I will enjoy playing it on the Horde though. From a military prespective, Theramore had it coming. From a storytelling perspective it's more like WTF Blizzard Another Human Nation annihilated?!? There are only (potentially) three Human nations left on the planet now. And of them, Dalaran is neutral and noone even knows if Kul'Tiras exist any longer. Mankind is doomed...Anyway, show this in-game for the Horde at least. I will scream if you put it in a book or comic.9. Since Blizzard is ending the Human presence on Kalimdor with this, can the Alliance plz be allowed to retaliate and capture Grom'Gol, Stonard and Hammerfall, since they are the main Orc settlements in the Eastern Kingdoms? It will give me great pride playing as Alliance to finally kick the greenskins out from our continent. (Ofc, there is the Twilight Highlands, but I'm pretending there aren't any Orcs there. La la la. *covers ears*) And Stonard, Grom'Gol and Hammerfall seems like a fair trade for Theramore. Also, I can rub it in the face of Orc players. "You lost all your old bases in the Eastern Kingdoms to the puny humans. Orcs suck. Neener Neener." :-)10. Why is everyone assuming that Jaina survives this? Her book likely takes place before 5.0. Also, why is everyone hoping that she survives? It's not like she has been part of the story in the game at all. Honestly? Megs Dreadshredder and Sassy Hardwrench (both of which are awesome, don't get me wrong) that are minor Goblin characters have more story in the game than any ALLIANCE RACIAL LEADER, INCLUDING JAINA. Not counting Malfurion. He has never, in-game, been an Alliance charcter. Also, he need to shave. It's not like we will miss a lot if, for example, we lose Tyrande and/or Jaina. I'm sure Blizzard can come up with a new character that can bounce up and down in Temple of the Moon and pass out the lvl 20 priest quest. And another crying human female to replace Jaina. I won't miss them because they were never there, except in the books and I can still read the books whenever I want. And play Warcraft 3. Just don't touch Sylvanas, ok? She is the only female faction leader that gets to be powerful in the game. At least until, and if, Megs or Sassy (or Her Tallness) fire Gallywix.
11-16-2011 @ 9:32AM
1. In all likelihood, yes. It's probably part of the setup for 5.0's events. I'm personally betting on an attempt to set the political scene for events going into Mists of Pandaria.2. Horde are also getting major developments in the books not in the game. See: The Shattering and Twilight of the Aspects for object examples of important Lore-related Horde-side stuff you never see referenced anywhere in-game.3. Because Garrosh Hellscream is a suppurating orc-supremacist dick. A suppurating orc-supremacist dick that's going to get a lot of his own people killed for the sake of his own Daddy Issues.4. The conflict in Ashenvale was a pretty much a realistic resource-based conflict, combined with a cultural clash that neither side is willing to let go. Bombing baby druids because Gary H wants to get his war on? That's pretty damned evil by any objective measure. Similarly, there's no good side of plague-bombing Gilneas and Hillsbrad, legitimate tactical/strategic objectives of war notwithstanding. Mind you, I think the Alliance is indulging in some pretty horrific "fog of war" related atrocities, as well, and I suspect that's part of the thematic point. No one comes out of war with their hands clean, standing on unassailable moral high ground. I just think that the Horde is looking much, much more hypocritical given the weight Horde culture gives to adhering to an honorable warrior ethos. There is no honor in the murder of innocents.5. I don't think the Horde and/or Garrosh Hellscream is bad/wrong/evil in attacking Theramore, to be honest. Theramore, by virtue of its position as the only major Alliance port within pragmatic striking distance of Durotar and its function as a debarkation point for the Alliance forces assaulting the Southern Barrens, is a legitimate tactical and strategic target. It would be foolish to allow that resource to remain in Alliance hands once the current conflict heats to Fourth (or Fifth, I suppose) War levels.6. Sink the foundation of the city. *The Shattering* basically indicates that, like New Orleans, Theramore effectively lies below sea level. Raise the seas, lower the ground level, two or three hurricanes, invade via air while they're reeling from the natural disasters.7. Isn't this already happening in "Wolfheart?"8. I'd like to see Kul Tiras return in-game as a major political power.9. I suspect that Arathi didn't get a major overhaul in Cataclysm because it will become a front-line war zone eventually. Sylvanas obviously intends to push the Alliance below the Thandol Span. This is the natural place to stage a pushback against her.10. Because Blizzard has never actually killed off a faction leader. I don't actually see them starting now. Assassinating her character? That I can see all too easily.
11-16-2011 @ 10:04AM
1) Probably, yes.2) That's a good question. Do the devs ignore the Alliance on purpose or it just happens because most of them are Horde fans at heart and *forget* to give the Alliance the same treatment?3) Because he is an evil douchebag like his dad Grom. The Horde is winning not because of Garrosh, but because of ass-pulls and Deus Ex Machina's by the devs. Or because Sylvannas has finally gone pure-evil and is bombing half of the Eastern Kingdoms with the plague. Hail the New Lich Queen ¬¬BTW, I don't like Sylvie, she's evil and that's not what I signed for when I made the jump from Warcraft III to WoW.4) In WC3, it's stated that Grom's actions were wrong, but at least he got the excuse of demon-poisoning and the xenophobia of the Night Elves. His son however, shows a disrespect for all living things (not just the elves) unimaginable for a clean, uncorrupted Mag'har Orc. The Horde has gone down a morally dark path in WoW compared to what it was in WC3. Garrosh and Sylvannas just make things worse.5) I agree.6) Nothing to say here.7) Yeah. And while we're at it, why not give the Horde the entire continent of Kalimdor? I'm sure such a reasonable course of action won't create any game unbalances at all, and most Alliance players will find it fair and appropiate. *Puts on sarcasm glasses*8) Too soon to tell, I just hope blizz doesn't turn it into another humiliating defeat for the Alliance with no repercussions whatsoever, like the ones I used to see while leveling an ally toon in the Cata 1-60 zones.9) I'll be ok as long as everything remains balanced in the end.10) Jaina is gonna be a major player in MoP, therefore it's unlikely for her to die so early into the expansion.
11-16-2011 @ 10:50AM
@ Nagaina.Wolfheart happened before 4.0.1With "bye bye Night Elves" I mean something like total Horde Victory in Ashenvale. Specifially, every tree cut down, every Night Elf building razed, and not a single living Night Elf in the entire zone. Night Elf and worgen players can go to Darkshore -> Stonetalon -> Desolace -> Feralas instead, Alliance don't NEED Ashenvale and Dustwallow to quest in."Because Blizzard has never actually killed off a faction leader."Cairne? Bolvar (he got better, and turned neutral)?Magni?
11-16-2011 @ 10:56AM
Not to address your post point by point, but the Broken Front in Icecrown was the first time I really thought "Oh dear, the Horde is running a bit amok." Attacking Alliance troops when there was a clearly more urgent threat is just not smart, but it seems to be a pattern of behaviour that has thrived under Hellscream's leadership.Btw, for my money Hellscream himself isn't evil. He's just over-enthusiastic meathead, doing the best job he can of leading the Horde. The trouble is, he's a figurehead for less-reconstructed orcs who yearn for the days of the Old Horde, who commit atrocities in an attempt to gain Hellscream's favour. He comes down hard on that stuff when he becomes aware of it - he's just a lot more ignorant than a faction leader should be.
11-16-2011 @ 12:48PM
Magni's not dead, he's a chunk of enchanted rock. Bolvar's not dead, he's the new Lich King.Cairne, admittedly, is dead, though I hope his disembodied spirit plagues Garrosh Hellscream's microscopic conscience like a splinter that can never be removed.
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