Blue Posts and Other WoW News: A whole lot of answers about the Darkmoon Faire

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Blue posts
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The original armor did not take me more than 2 months to complete.
The original armor did not take me more than 2 months to complete.
We're not attempting to recreate the time investment that was originally seen to obtain these items when they were relevant. They exist for transmogrification/customization choices, not necessary power increase requirements to be able to progress your character.
If they were part of a progression path we'd definitely look at the acquisition rates and standardize them, but as they're show-off pieces the acquisition rate is usually gated a little higher so that the appeal and worth of showing them off remains high.
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Ohh more math! That should prove how "fun" this "faire" is! lol
Ohh more math! That should prove how "fun" this "faire" is! lol
I'm pretty awful at math, but simple addition shouldn't scare anyone... I hope.
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Just to clarify one point, the quest drops that happen in the dungeons/raids/BG's happen all the time, even if the faire isn't in town. Think of it sort of like the Darkmoon Card redemptions. You're out playing all month, while you're doing stuff you're getting chances at the items, then when the faire is in town you turn it all in. (It's also worth pointing out that the turn-in items aren't soulbound, so just like the cards I'd expect some people to farm them just to put them up on the AH.)
It's really just this first week and appearance of the faire that's off because the Darkmoon Adventurer's Guide wasn't available for the 3 weeks prior. When it rolls around next month there should be better feel for how the whole system and ticket acquisition rate feels.
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I'd really like to have this expanded on, as it's something I've touched on in both threads; why is it seen that aesthetic character growth has to be more punitive than stat/function-based character growth? I know that Blizzard has always taken an extremely hands-off role when it comes to the RP/vanity aspect of this game, but why is there a perception both within the community and from the developers that there should be a lower acquisition rate for people who want to customize how their character looks compared to those who simply want higher stats?
I'd really like to have this expanded on, as it's something I've touched on in both threads; why is it seen that aesthetic character growth has to be more punitive than stat/function-based character growth? I know that Blizzard has always taken an extremely hands-off role when it comes to the RP/vanity aspect of this game, but why is there a perception both within the community and from the developers that there should be a lower acquisition rate for people who want to customize how their character looks compared to those who simply want higher stats?
It's a simple fact of the intent behind the vanity rewards and people's desires to customize their appearance, and do so in a way that they are unique from other players. To be unique, or close to it, the desire is to have something to show off that no one else has, or at least very few people have. Secondarily (or in some cases primarily) the appeal of the item can simply be due to some very difficult-to-reach goal. "Look at me, I did X". To achieve that from our side there needs to be a high barrier of entry to obtain the item or else everyone can get it, the item loses its special 'show off' value, and as a way to be unique from other players it has completely lost all value. This isn't just a dress up game, the items have significance attached to how they were obtained. Some things, like pets or mounts, have alternate values through achievements and such though, so things can get a bit more complex.
Obviously it doesn't apply to everything, there are nigh unlimited amounts of ways now to customize your character with transmogrification. The vast majority of customization options don't require a ton of time investment. But if you look at these items in the Darkmoon Faire, or the mounts or pets that are hard to obtain, and you really want them to dress up and show off, I think that's proving the exact point of why they're difficult to obtain.
I'll bring up the sparkle ponies. When they came out everyone wanted one and sure enough on the first day the sky was filled with sparkles, and ponies, but now days you rarely see anyone bring theirs out because they became too common. You see people, usually, on their rarest/most difficult to obtain mount, because that's the satisfaction of obtaining these things and then displaying them in a social setting. "This is who I am, and this is what I've achieved."
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Wait, what?
Hold on, hold on. Aren't you guys the people who have, for years, told everyone who complained about other players getting rare things easier after time had past that they shouldn't complain because, after all, they had those things and got to enjoy them longer than players who are now able to get the items far easier? I seem to remember that being said in blue text many, many times over the years. I know, being here since classic, I've been on the receiving end of those blue posts many times as I saw things I worked hard for, unique things I had, given out to players sometime later for almost no effort.
Other than the few times you've removed mounts to be sure only the raiders got them and could feel special, this is the first time I've ever seen blue text that took the side of players wanting to be somewhat unique, players who don't want other players to have what they have, even if significant time has past since they got the items. Pretty massive about-face in policy, I have to say.
Wait, what?
Hold on, hold on. Aren't you guys the people who have, for years, told everyone who complained about other players getting rare things easier after time had past that they shouldn't complain because, after all, they had those things and got to enjoy them longer than players who are now able to get the items far easier? I seem to remember that being said in blue text many, many times over the years. I know, being here since classic, I've been on the receiving end of those blue posts many times as I saw things I worked hard for, unique things I had, given out to players sometime later for almost no effort.
Other than the few times you've removed mounts to be sure only the raiders got them and could feel special, this is the first time I've ever seen blue text that took the side of players wanting to be somewhat unique, players who don't want other players to have what they have, even if significant time has past since they got the items. Pretty massive about-face in policy, I have to say.
Time changes all. We're not going to be able to keep everything in the game relatively "difficult" to obtain from now until forever. There are going to be game changes or a progression of player power that simply makes some of their acquisitions easier. We can try to build in gates, such as lockouts and timers to help mitigate them, but it's very possible that at some point in the future the Darkmoon Faire items become substantially easier to obtain through some change.
As time goes on more and more people will naturally be able to achieve these desired 'show off' items, and so as time goes on it makes sense to continue to introduce new ones. Being the first, or one of a few is awesome, but unless we do something like the AQ gong event again (never) we're not going to literally gate items to a specific number of people.
Such is the reality of a constantly moving and evolving game. It's a big reason why we use words and phrases like "currently" and "at this time", we can't speak to how we're going to be thinking or designing the game a year from now, or what items will be available and at what cost.
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That doesn't necessarily mean that the items need to be more easily obtained. But it does seem to me like an illustration of how Blizz lacks in understanding what our motivations are (resulting in some overly-restrictive barriers IMO).
That doesn't necessarily mean that the items need to be more easily obtained. But it does seem to me like an illustration of how Blizz lacks in understanding what our motivations are (resulting in some overly-restrictive barriers IMO).
Maybe I misunderstood, as it seemed the items being very easy to obtain simply to provide all of the customization options possible was exactly what was being requested.
I understand the intent of obtaining items to customize your character, and I would absolutely argue that it is not devoid of wanting to appear special/unique to those around you. World of Warcraft is not a strict 'roleplaying' game, in that the majority of focus is on cooperative or competitive group-based content, and much of that is to obtain and earn prestige through displayable rewards. Because of that our intent is largely going to be to create methods through which that prestige can be obtained. That doesn't mean everything has to be some kind of crazy long time investment, and it's a fact that World of Warcraft asks very little in that regard for 98% of the content, but surely there needs to be some that are very difficult to appease those who are looking for it. I would also argue the Darkmoon Faire and its items are not one of them, though, and do not ask an out-of-the-ordinary amount of dedication to obtain the rewards.
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This, it seems to me, is related to the assumption on Blizz's part that the only "valid" purpose for Transmogrification is prestige-- to show off the armor we earned, preferrably in an attempt to look more powerful and awesome. But many of us are not in fact motivated by that-- we're motivated by the desire to customize our characters to make them look the way we want, according to our own feel for our characters-- whether that feel is "powerful and awesome" or "silly and quaint".
This, it seems to me, is related to the assumption on Blizz's part that the only "valid" purpose for Transmogrification is prestige-- to show off the armor we earned, preferrably in an attempt to look more powerful and awesome. But many of us are not in fact motivated by that-- we're motivated by the desire to customize our characters to make them look the way we want, according to our own feel for our characters-- whether that feel is "powerful and awesome" or "silly and quaint".
No and I apologize for using that phrase, my intent wasn't to devalue character customization it was to make a point that the items don't just exist in the world for baseless customization, but they're either obtained by killing a boss, being great in the Arena's, or even putting time into gathering enough tickets so you can look awesome.
Like I said before there are tons of customization options that are very, very easy to obtain, and the combinations and customization potential is really insane. But, there are going to be restrictions and requirements to get what's considered the higher prestige items because that's in no small part what makes them prestigious, and drives people to obtain them. I understand that may not be why you play the game, but it is why the majority of people play, and the majority of the content that's developed.
We're in the infancy of transmogrification though, and so I don't think we really have any idea where we'll be six months or a year from now and the various venues we could have available to obtain pure-customization options for your character.
The third PvP season of World of Warcraft: Cataclysm is now underway! Matchmaking (MMR), Team, and Personal Ratings have been reset and players are once again able to compete in level-85 Arenas and Rated Battlegrounds for the best PvP gear, items, and titles. The 4000-point Honor cap has been restored, and Season 11 Conquest Point and improved Honor Point rewards are now available for purchase.
Players who were in the top teams from each battlegroup at the end of Season 10 will also be receiving their end-of-season rewards shortly. These include Arena- and Rated Battleground-specific titles and, for players who have earned the rank of gladiator, the Ruthless Gladiator's Twilight Drake.
Prepare yourselves for battle as the bloody struggle between the Horde and the Alliance continues.
Players who were in the top teams from each battlegroup at the end of Season 10 will also be receiving their end-of-season rewards shortly. These include Arena- and Rated Battleground-specific titles and, for players who have earned the rank of gladiator, the Ruthless Gladiator's Twilight Drake.
Prepare yourselves for battle as the bloody struggle between the Horde and the Alliance continues.
WoW news from other sites
- MMO-Champion Raid Finder Loot Exploit Suspensions, Paragon Apology
- Wowhead News 4.3 Looking for Raid Exploits Lead to Multiple Bans in Top Guilds
- Patch 4.3 Hotfixes for Dec. 6th, 2011
- World of Warcraft holiday sale is crazy
- Darkmoon artifacts will drop even when there is no Faire
- Totem Talk: Restoration shaman 4.3 loot
- Darkmoon Faire ticket clarifications
- Reader UI of the Week: A tanking UI with a flair for scale
- Maintenance extended until 2:00 p.m. PST
- Shifting Perspectives: The best and the worst of patch 4.3
- Blizzard issues official statement on Raid Finder exploit consequences
- Paragon: We're sorry we cheated
- WoW Moviewatch: Hater Raid Firelands
- The Queue: In which Adam recently discovered The Big Bang Theory
- Around Azeroth: Graphic arts
- Spiritual Guidance: Healing priest strategies for Dragon Soul's first 3 bosses
- Breakfast Topic: Will Raid Finder popularity be sustainable?
- Tuesday Morning Post: Darkmoon's back edition
- PSA: 3DS firmware update is live
- EverQuest II delays expansion launch overnight
- Conquer Online now available on iPad
Filed under: Today in WoW






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
omedon666 Dec 7th 2011 12:21AM
"Secondarily (or in some cases primarily) the appeal of the item can simply be due to some very difficult-to-reach goal. 'Look at me, I did X'. To achieve that from our side there needs to be a high barrier of entry to obtain the item or else everyone can get it, the item loses its special 'show off' value, and as a way to be unique from other players it has completely lost all value."
That a phrase like this enters a conversation about character visual and conceptual customization, in blue text, makes me absolutely sick. When will people start living as their characters and stop feeling the need to compete? That Blizz perpetuates this inflated competitiveness is really depressing.
I've had so much fun this week! I completed my first 25 man raid ever, I capped valour for the first time ever, and yet, at the core of it all, the game is still, even on a level of realizing visual concept, angled so, even in PVE, people play "against" each other, not "with" each other.
VioletArrows Dec 7th 2011 12:32AM
When will people start living as their characters and stop feeling the need to compete?
When people stop being insecure and begging approval in everything they do. Which is never.
Zapwidget Dec 7th 2011 12:47AM
I don't see what's so sickening about it. It's a demonstrated fact. Acknowledging this fact is not really the same thing as perpetuating it. People want to look special. A core part of being special is revealed in the origin of the word.
(from http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/special )
Middle English, from Anglo-French or Latin; Anglo-French especial, from Latin specialis individual, particular, from species species.
The Sparkle Ponies were an excellent example, but definitely not the only example. The same thing has happened with virtually every item from the pet store, and also happens whenever there is more than one comparable item for a particularly visible gear slot, such as shields or shoulders. I myself used Crygil's for most of Wrath for no other reason than it wasn't the Royal Crest, which everyone else had equpped.
omedon666 Dec 7th 2011 12:52AM
SAtating the fact is one thing, I follow you there, Zap, but essentially framing it as "and this is why we do it" feels like they are perpetuating it.
"To achieve that from our side there needs to be a high barrier of entry..."
No, there doesn't, not for visuals. We could quite conceivably "get dressed" and feel conceptually comfortable as our characters for little barrier of entry, and then go climb the mountains of logistical improvement. Blizz just decides to put that conceptual comfort on the same mountains, and that's lame, IMO.
omedon666 Dec 7th 2011 12:53AM
Ahem... that should have started with "stating"... not starting a devil cult here..
raingod Dec 7th 2011 2:08AM
@omedon666 Well you do have 666 in your name...just sayin'. :P
As to your point, the sad fact is, most people are pretty competitive, whether they realize it or not. Everyone wants approval, or some kind of slap on the back and a "good job!" said to them. It's part of human nature. From sports, to war, to love, we always want to be the "winner" or at the least, be noticed for our deeds.
I for one, never thought I was very competitive. I had little interest in sports, though I watch occasionally, never play online games (Words With Friends being an exception), I've never pvp'ed in my four years playing WoW. But let a friend and I do dailies together, and I'm racing to get the quests completed before him. Absolutely no reason to that, but something clicks in my head and off I go. We both also play hunters, and constantly wage battle in our dps numbers. We couldn't care less about anyone else in a group, oit's just both of our numbers we look at (which are generally second and third, occasionally first in the dps meters).
It's, silly, arbitrary and makes no sense, but that's just how it goes. Right or wrong, Blizzard realizes this aspect of human nature and plays to it, and I think does a pretty good job (outside of the damned FL dailies).
Noyou Dec 7th 2011 7:08AM
With transmogrification Blizzard is allowing us every opportunity to be as individualistic as we can possibly be. It is our lemming-like nature for the vast majority of people to want, "the best armor" or whatever to show off. The thing I have a problem with is the people who feel they are all of a sudden entitled to getting X gear as easily as possible for cosmetic purposes. No. It's not how it works, and frankly it's not how it should work. If you want something that is now considered "rare" you are going to have to put the time in it.
DarkWalker Dec 7th 2011 8:10AM
I don't care at all for how difficulty it's to get something, or how many other players are using it: I use whatever pleases me (and rarity does not play any role in how much some cosmetic option pleases me).
My 310% mount was shelved the very day the speed increase extended to all fliers (I really disliked it's appearance); on it's place I started using a simple normal flying mount. In LotRO, most of my cosmetic wardrobe is composed of cheap items and low level quest rewards that match quite well. Had Transmogrification been available earlier, the first thing I would have done to each and every tier piece I got would have been to transmog it - perhaps with the appearance of the low level dungeon sets introduced with Cataclysm, I find them more pleasing to the eye than any tier set.
I read that blue post as Blizzard telling me to bugger off, since WoW is not intended for players like me, who don't like to show off.
(Of note: I don't care at all about the cosmetic versions of old tier pieces being hard to get. As I said, I didn't like the appearance of any tier piece, at the very least, since BC. Too over the top for my tastes.)
TonyKP Dec 7th 2011 9:21AM
They've applied the raider philosophy ("You must work hard for what you want!!") to what I thought was supposed to be a fun mechanic, Noyou. What people think is the "best armor" is going to vary from person to person, as we all have our own individual personal asthetics, so Blizzard is being silly by saying that Person A must work for what he likes while Person B does not simply because Person B's choice happens to not be on Blizzard's arbitrary list.
As I see it, Blizzard added transmogging as a non-raiding thing to do, which is good, and then saddled it with that raiding mindset, which is bad.
egburr Dec 7th 2011 9:57AM
I don't want X gear to show off. I want little x gear to get those damned shoulders out of my line of vision, and to get that damned giant headed glowing staff out of the way. That more than anything is why I am still ticked off about losing my permanent tree form.
I want a very understated set of shoulders and a simple stick for a staff. However, to be useful in raids, I have to have these absurdly huge, glowy, effecty things that are difficult to see around. It's bad enough being a tauren, but do I really have to put up with the rest of that crap?
What bugs me is that the pieces I really want aren't eligible because they don't have stats. I found a "big stick" that is acceptable, except that it still glows on the end. I found shoulders from a replica set that is acceptable enough, but it is going to take forever to get them since the pets/mounts are a priority (in a competition with some friends for most pets/mounts).
I don't want the pieces for vanity; I want them for usability.
TonyKP Dec 7th 2011 11:37AM
Don't know that I'll ever get over losing tree form, Eggbur... :-(
Snuzzle Dec 7th 2011 11:55AM
I go with whatever armor fits the character personality I have in my head. I don't RP, but each of my characters has a personality I connect with, or I can't enjoy playing the character. I still miss my troll priest and mage (in my head, they were brothers) but I truly enjoy my goblin mage and priest too :)
My night elf druid's set consists mostly of Classic greens and a blue or two for a humble look, but that's mostly because it fits her personality. And I tell ya, random world greens are even harder to get than epic tier gear. I've been looking since transmog was announced and I still haven't found my Archer's Boots or Daggerfen Shoulders.
I'm okay with that, but the artificial gating for transmog DMF gear does make me mad. If I want my character to look like x, why make it artifcially difficult to do so? It's not for prestige. No one thinks dungeon 1 sets are prestigious. No one ever did. It's to stretch out the content, nothing more.
Al Dec 7th 2011 3:08PM
They really showed their commitment by not making the old "vanity" vendor whites non-Mogable.
VioletArrows Dec 7th 2011 12:41AM
Meh, I'm not interested at all in the replica armor (or most armor) as long as hunter gear keeps looking fug. I'll see how many tickets I get at the end of the week towards the pets and mounts (which just had to be BoP). XP
So far I've been more "unique" in opting to look like an actual hunter (light leather and mail, utility pouches and pockets) than the ridiculously flashy tier looks.
omedon666 Dec 7th 2011 12:48AM
I feel ya on the hunter gear! I have visual sets for all 10 of my characters (one of each class), and the hunter was the hardest to fill out, due to the abysmal choices. I like the uniformity of tier/season sets, but hunters just get slapped around with the ugly stick with the whole "wear your trophies" theme. I finally settled on the purple/green dragonstalker recolour, purely as a compliment to my hunter's personal and favourite pet colourations, as well as historical concept (she actually has a thing for killing dragons).
LynMars Dec 7th 2011 1:29AM
I and several others went for quest reward items or random green sets that go together for Hunter alts.
The ticket items from Darkmoon are restricted by level, not class, for one, so that may help, if it's in your armor type.
The blog "Disciplinary Action" has some really nice transmog models for most armor types up and ready to go, starting with cloth and doing them for everyone else too, to help people put together sets--whether tier, crafted, or leveling sets (quest/instance/random)
AtlasLoot and MogIt have been invaluable to me in putting together my sets; I don't want all tier for all of my characters either. Still working on the mage's possibilities. The paladin's in the purple judgement recolor (for prot, and righteous plate for ret), priest is in mostly 25man T7, Rogue's in mostly T9, but the hunter has a lovely blue and silver mail set just waiting for her to level. My friend has a green and grey mail set for his hunter.
raingod Dec 7th 2011 2:16AM
I actually like the look from some of the drops in the new 5 mans, so I'll be keeping that look I think. My biggest thing are bows. As a Tauren Hunter, I don't like using guns with him, just bows, so I've been collecting bows and crossbows and having a good time with that more than the gear.
My balance druid, well, that's another story completely.
Al Dec 7th 2011 12:58AM
And here I thought the Sparkle Ponies vanished because they were butt-ugly and people shelved them once they got a high-end mount at 80.
iadamson Dec 7th 2011 1:20AM
This is very opinionated on whatever side you chose.
Fletcher Dec 7th 2011 1:27AM
"we're not going to literally gate items to a specific number of people."
... isn't that ... more or less *exactly* what they're doing with the level 60 PVP gear? Given the limited number of people who earned Grand Marshal/High Warlord way back in the day, and the limited subset of those people who are still playing, the subset of *those* who are still playing the same characters?
I'm not heavily invested in the PVP transmog gear debate - it's not stuff I like the looks of or want to wear - but I think Blizzard's decision to restrict it to the small portion of wizened ancients who originally got it in Vanilla is foolish. Their decision not to announce it beforehand, even more so.