Blue Posts and Other WoW News: Paladin/Gurthalak nerfs, and Zarhym on LFR loot issues

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Blue posts
Quote:
They have managed to work out what role each item is intended for so why can't blizzard?
They have managed to work out what role each item is intended for so why can't blizzard?
We know this information. The item designers have plenty of spreadsheets too. If you're saying creating said spreadsheet takes an equivalent amount of time as coding a system in the game whereby item distribution accounts for the spec you're fulfilling in a dungeon, you're wrong.
Quote:
If you are DPSing you get the need bonus on (your) DPS gear. Tanks on tank gear. Healers on healer gear. A little common sense with things like bears and spriests on their slightly different needs and all of a sudden the loot issues where everyone needs everything are all fixed.
Then a little common sense when there are two of an item, you treat it as any guild would, you roll and the top two get it. Not treat each piece separately.
It should have been completely obvious that everyone would need on everything they could regardless of whether they need it as your getting 20G for that shiny new weapon is much better for you than the person stuck with an i353 weapon getting a much hoped for upgrade because you will never see them again.
Blizzard fixed frost orbs from being needable soon after LFD launched. They fixed needing on BoEs in 5 mans. Why on earth didn't they fix LFR loot when it was glaringly obvious that the current LFR loot tags would not be sufficient?
New loot systems must be so depressing for GC and crew. Every time a new one comes out they must be so hopeful that their customers will all be pulling together. I wonder if they have a shrink on call each time a new one launches when they get reminded, yet again, about simple game theory, and the fact that in a group of strangers each person will do what is best for them.
If you are DPSing you get the need bonus on (your) DPS gear. Tanks on tank gear. Healers on healer gear. A little common sense with things like bears and spriests on their slightly different needs and all of a sudden the loot issues where everyone needs everything are all fixed.
Then a little common sense when there are two of an item, you treat it as any guild would, you roll and the top two get it. Not treat each piece separately.
It should have been completely obvious that everyone would need on everything they could regardless of whether they need it as your getting 20G for that shiny new weapon is much better for you than the person stuck with an i353 weapon getting a much hoped for upgrade because you will never see them again.
Blizzard fixed frost orbs from being needable soon after LFD launched. They fixed needing on BoEs in 5 mans. Why on earth didn't they fix LFR loot when it was glaringly obvious that the current LFR loot tags would not be sufficient?
New loot systems must be so depressing for GC and crew. Every time a new one comes out they must be so hopeful that their customers will all be pulling together. I wonder if they have a shrink on call each time a new one launches when they get reminded, yet again, about simple game theory, and the fact that in a group of strangers each person will do what is best for them.
We're not that naive. We knew from the start of designing the Raid Finder system that we'd need to build a smarter loot distribution system to regulate fair play. It was also really important to us to get Raid Finder working and implemented with the Dragon Soul raid. We had to be realists about it.
The loot system will be improved in upcoming updates -- including in patch 4.3.2, where it'll no longer be possible to win two of the same item for a single boss kill. But we're really happy with the implementation of Raid Finder and feel it's a great new feature for the game, and one we'll continue refining over time.
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Quote:
Already aware of your stated concerns, the business decision of how to optimally allocate resources restricted us from immediately addressing this issue. We confidently felt that the improvements to the game sufficiently outweighed this issue, and that its severity would be further mitigated in future patches.
Already aware of your stated concerns, the business decision of how to optimally allocate resources restricted us from immediately addressing this issue. We confidently felt that the improvements to the game sufficiently outweighed this issue, and that its severity would be further mitigated in future patches.
I usually hate it when people decide to read into what I've said and translate it into some other meaning, but this was pretty fair, lol. ;)
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I don't think this is an issue of money... you can only throw so many developers on a project before it stops being effective to add more people. At some point there's just an amount of time it takes to get something done. So if they want to roll it out with 4.3 they have to do that parts that work in that timeline.
You can put together a plan for a project that says 9 women can make a baby in a month, but it doesn't mean that will work in reality.
I don't think this is an issue of money... you can only throw so many developers on a project before it stops being effective to add more people. At some point there's just an amount of time it takes to get something done. So if they want to roll it out with 4.3 they have to do that parts that work in that timeline.
You can put together a plan for a project that says 9 women can make a baby in a month, but it doesn't mean that will work in reality.
This is well said. Money isn't nearly the overarching, limiting factor people love to claim it is. And the common argument I see in response to the above quote is "hire more people then." But I think it's pretty easy to understand that looking for the perfect fit for a position is not always a quick process, nor is the training of new employees. This is particularly true when one is speaking about development studios generating creative media. Expertise, design philosophy, synergy, etc. are very important to the success of a project, not sheer headcount.
Our development teams are quite modest in size compared to a lot of studios, but it's because we genuinely feel it's not always good to have so many hands on a project. If that means we have to make tough decisions about how and when to release a product or feature, so be it.
That said, we do still have plenty of positions we're looking to fill. ;)
There are several things that we want to follow-up on and clarify:
- We noticed Retribution DPS was higher than we expected. We investigated and realized Gurthalak was the cause. We further realized (and several players independently discovered) that the weapon proc was activating twice as often for Retribution as intended.
- Retribution was getting more than twice as many proc chances than we intended. This was caused by the application of Censure, not the dot itself ticking.
- This was not an accidental bug fix of some sort. The proc was happening more often than we expected and desired, leading to damage higher than we expected and desired, so we took steps to fix it.
- We changed the duration of Gurthalak's proc some time ago. The 4.3.2 tooltip change simply acknowledges this fix. The weapon's damage should not change in 4.3.2.
- Gurthalak is still a fantastic weapon for Retribution paladins and any other two-handed DPS plate-wearers. The average DPS reduction is lower than the 10% figure some have quoted. The sword's damage can be quite variable, and there are isolated cases where it may have briefly contributed 20% or more of someone's damage, but those are statistical outliers.
- Being nerfed is never fun. We get that. The increased proc chance was our mistake, as always, and we apologize for not catching it sooner. Retribution paladin damage for players without Gurthalak is where we intended it to be. We expect Retribution damage with this change to also end up where we intend it to be. If damage falls unacceptably low for some reason, we will certainly consider taking additional measures.
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Filed under: Today in WoW






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
scherbaddie Jan 6th 2012 12:20AM
I'm surprised they didn't temp ban the Pallies who've been using it. They should've known it wasn't meant to proc that much and were abusing an exploit.
christopher.weil17 Jan 6th 2012 12:29AM
Banning people using a weapon that dropped for them and was noticeably better than their current weapon? Sure makes sense!
(No it doesn't. Please don't say dumb things like this anymore.)
stevepete Jan 6th 2012 2:00AM
If scherbaddie's post was meant to be sarcastic, then it's pretty funny. If not, then it's idiotic.
Langis Langley Jan 6th 2012 2:48AM
Why is it idiotic? He's on point: both are exploits, and Blizzard only selectively chooses which ones to punish based on fuzzy logic and TOS terms.
Adam Jan 6th 2012 2:56AM
I believe the OP was making that comment in jest.
Nathanyel Jan 6th 2012 4:09AM
Adam: I believe that, too. I mean, I have to, else I would be crying.
clundgren Jan 6th 2012 4:17AM
Blizzard letting the weapon proc on censure is not an obvious mistake; it still procs from bleeds, for example, and other items have been allowed to proc off censure and never nerfed (Tiny Abomination obviously comes to mind). So there is no way that anyone reasonable would consider using Gurthalak an exploit.
Noyou Jan 6th 2012 5:04AM
He's kind of a tool. He prolly caught a ban for something silly.
Skarn Jan 6th 2012 1:46PM
That would be ridiculous. Most of the people using it didn't even know there was a bug with it. They just equipped and used a new weapon they got off a boss. It didn't take any strange or unusual actions, just normal playing. Completely different from working around LFR loot restrictions, for example.
You're either making a terrible joke or are a terrible troll.
Langis Langley Jan 6th 2012 4:38PM
He's actually trying to make a point of the silliness of fuzzy rules, not necessarily asking for Ret Pally bannings. But hey, that's why his post is gray, dark, and 132 times better than most of the nonsense following it.
scherbaddie Jan 16th 2012 7:47PM
A little late to reply to this now, but yes the post was sarcastic, and no I've never been banned.
murmaiderxx Jan 6th 2012 12:38AM
They admitted it was on them for the higher proc, it's nothing that's in the game that isn't widely known to them and people aren't tweaking or bending anything unusual to be listed as an exploit.
Jaq Jan 6th 2012 12:42AM
This always happens with proc weapons; Bryntroll, for example, was proccing way too often for Death Knights and Paladins back in 3.3, though not to the extremes that Gurthalak was. It wasn't an exploit back then, it isn't one now.
MisterRik Jan 6th 2012 12:44AM
I'm not entirely clear on this - are they nerfing *paladins*, or are they nerfing this "Gurthalok" (whatever the hell that is)?
Because dangit, my ret paladin was finally fun to play again after 4.3.
Castor27 Jan 6th 2012 1:26AM
The way I read it was that Gurth was applying as intended, but also applying with censure ticks which was doubling it's output. They nerfed censure ticks to not proc the tentacles any more, which in turn nerfed the DPS for Ret. The nerf only applies if you have been using Gurth before they applied it. If you aren't or got it after the nerf you will not notice a difference. TBH I have had it for a while and did not notice anything in the LFR's I ran tonight anyway.
terph Jan 6th 2012 1:39AM
It was an error in the post, I think. It's proccing off the seals, not censure ticks.
That being said, I wonder if something else got screwed up. I don't have Gurth in any form yet. My dps was lower tonight and looking at my logged performance and gear upgrades, it should have been higher. I did better, the RNG was fine. Been comparing a little bit but still not sure what happened to it.
terph Jan 6th 2012 12:18PM
Ok, forget what I said about the ticks.
But still stands that something feels off, and I'm in the camp that thinks maybe something was broken with other "proc" items and enchants.
danielabrems Jan 6th 2012 1:13AM
They're nerfing the weapon for Paladins.
danielabrems Jan 6th 2012 1:14AM
Stupid comment system, meant to reply to MisteRik.
thedoctor2031 Jan 6th 2012 1:18AM
I love how ret paladins are nerfed when they have been weak all expansions while holy paladins who started moderate and only got better all expansion haven't had their HR touched.