Two Bosses Enter: Echo of Sylvanas vs. Warlord Zon'ozz

Welcome back to the WoW Insider ring, where two champions will face off in mortal combat (with a c, not a k) and the ultimate winner being decided by you. This week, the Echo of Sylvanas aims to knock Warlord Zon'ozz and his Old God masters back to the very abyss that they came from. It'll be a hard fight, considering people actually know who General Zon'ozz is for once because of the incredible Raid Finder.
Last week, the Echo of Baine barely carved out a win with a staggeringly close 51.7% of the vote. Sadly, that means the Echo of Jaina is sent home packing, and the tauren chieftain's ancient spirit echo lives to fight another day. You may be getting your own book in the coming months, Jaina, but this is where your story ends on Two Bosses Enter. Ha, ha! Clever!
Vote now or forever be wracked with the pain and guilt of despair as your favorite combatant loses by the vote you never cast. Vote now and be saved from the torment!
| Echo of Sylvanas (End Time) | |
|---|---|
| Warlord Zon'ozz (Dragon Soul) |
The rules of the ring
- The WoW Insider Ring is considered neutral territory, where both combatants are able to access their usual encounter mechanics and abilities. If you can't visualize it inside the squared circle, visualize it someplace else -- but you must take into consideration all of each bosses' abilities and mechanics.
- Assume that each opponent is intelligent and capable of strategic thinking.
- All of the competitors' abilities, including crowd control and other effects to which bosses are usually immune, work on their opponents (with apologies to considerations of lore on this point).
- Assume that the opponents share similar levels, health pools, and comparative overall damage output.
- Don't get caught up in gameplay mechanics and what actual players might do in each encounter.
- Don't neglect style, story, and scale. Everything is a factor; seeking balance is your goal as a spectator and judge.

The Banshee Queen advances on to the next round of combat as her long-departed echo struggles with sanity. The Echo of Sylvanas won by a decent margin, but it wasn't shut-out material. Nonetheless, Sylvanas is not one to trifle with ... and neither are her fans.
Against Yor'sahj, Sylvanas won out through speed and cunning, being able to deal with the slimes quickly. Yor'sahj really is a survival fight, and the minions Sylvanas controls are loyal and smart enough to take the brunt of the survival for their Queen. She's the one to beat.
Echo of Sylvanas' abilities include:
- Shriek of the Highborne Sylvanas shrieks with anguish, inflicting damage to an enemy and decreasing movement speed.
- Black Arrow Sylvanas fires an explosive black arrow at an enemy, inflicting heavy AoE damage.
- Unholy Shot Sylvanas fires a barrage of missiles at an enemy, striking up to three enemies within 10 yards, inflicting extra shadow damage.
- Blighted Arrows Sylvanas blights the ground under an enemy, inflicting heavy damage and knocking back enemies caught in the arrow crossfire.
- Wracking Pain When Sylvanas spawns ghouls, enemies are damaged when they pass through the ghoul link.
- Sacrifice When the ghouls reach Sylvanas, they explode doing tons of damage. Kill a ghoul to break the line and escape!

Warlord Zon'ozz was a dark horse candidate for reader favorite, considering he's 1.) a boss, and 2.) kind of a pushover in the Raid Finder. That's not to say he's lovable in his own right -- I'm just trying to find it. Nonetheless, Zon'ozz took a slim victory over the Echo of Tyrande, proving that being a pretty lady doesn't always advance you to the next round. Or being the spirit of a dead pretty lady. Either way, nice work, readers.
The key things to look for in the fight between Zon'ozz and Sylvanas are the movement-related mechanics with Zon'ozz's ball. That thing might be a little tricky, but you guys have great imaginations, so I'm sure you'll come up with something. Remember, it's about substance and fun over being super-correct. Just have fun!
Warlord Zon'ozz's abilities include:
- Focused Anger Zon'ozz increasingly focuses his anger and rage, increasing physical damage and attack speed.
- Psychic Drain Warlord Zon'ozz channels a waves of psychic force in a cone in front of himself, dealing damage.
- Disrupting Shadows Covers enemies with Disrupting Shadows, inflicting damage over time, more damage, and a knock-back on dispel
- Void of the Unmaking Summons the Void of the Unmaking, which will Void Diffusion after colliding with an enemy, dealing massive damage to all in range and bounching the Void back in the opposite direction.
- Zon'ozz will become more vulnerable if his Void of the Unmaking collides with him.

The Echo of Baine proved to be as stubborn as a bull in his fight against the Echo of Jaina, but with such a narrow win, one wonders if Baine's staying power is everlasting. You see, Jaina's fans could be fickle fans, now seeing their lady slain move on to a second choice rather than their champion's opponent.
We could be wrong. Jaina's fans could be loyalists, traditionalists. You root for the man who defeated your man (or woman, in this case). You stand in line with the conqueror and cheer for his or her victory. Will the Jaina fans realize that they had a tough choice to make between two favorites and move to the other's side? Only time will tell.
While Quaza's horse didn't exactly win the race, this depiction of the battle was pretty great, and I wanted to share it with everyone. It's a little long, but you don't mind, right? That's what I thought.
Once again, Baine Bloodhoof stood in the circular pool of lava. He wasn't a fool, of course; a slab of obsidian floating in the pool kept him out of the intense heat not six inches away from his hooves. There were 4 such rocks, in a rough diamond-like shape, and standing on the one opposite him was a human female. One he'd met several months ago, shortly after his father was murdered by Magatha Grimtotem. One he knew to be a powerful magi, trusted by his former warchief, Thrall. One who held the line against the Burning Legion.Loving it! While Jaina didn't win in the voting, she sure put up a hell of a fight in the ring and in the comments. Good initiative, Jaina fans.
One called Jaina Proudmoore.
"You! Are you the one responsible for what has happened here...?"
Her look of puzzlement only enraged Baine. Seething rage filled him. He had trusted her. Thrall had trusted her. Yet she was the one who desecrated this land. It must have been her. Who else could have done it?
Jaina hopped to the rock adjacent to his, then to his own. She still looked puzzled, and attempted to explain that she had not done anything to the landscape. Lies, of course. Lies. Lies. LIES!
"What dark horrors have you wrought in this place? By my ancestors' honor, I shall take you to task!"
And Baine charged, closing the gap between them in a heartbeat.
To her credit, Jaina reacted fast, instantly summoning a fiery boulder and smashing it into his shoulder. The flames stung, but Baine shrugged it off. His axe glowed red as he pulled it from the lava beside him - a trick he learned from his battle against Peroth'arn. She backstepped, dodging the glowing axe while preparing another flaming orb in her hands. This one caught Baine full in the chest, and he staggered back, pinwheeling at the edge. He grabbed his totem, and hurled it at Jaina, using the same motion to regain his balance. She flew clear of the platforms over the lava pool.
"Perhaps this will cool your head!"
All of a sudden, Jaina was no longer flying over the lava. She stood only a couple feet in front of him, sweeping her arms forward, as if swinging a sword upwards. And blades, made of solid ice, swept forward at Baine. He rolled to the side, enough to dodge the middle blade but not enough to hit the right one. He used this as an excuse to re-ingite his axe, and charged at the mage once again.
Jaina wasn't done it seemed. She hurled an orange ball over to one of the adjacent platforms. A Flarecore, Baine recognised. A potent piece of magic that exploded after a short while, devistating anything caught in the blast (no doubt what caused this landscape's devistation). It was also easily destroyed - if he got to it in time.
Baine lept, landing on the little ball. It shattered. So did the entire platform.
He swam back towards the rock Jaina was still standing on. She smiled, seeing the perfect opportunity. She sent out a frostbolt to slow his swimming, and blinking into position, she unleashed another 3 blades of ice his way.
Which melted upon hitting the lava, as Baine had planned.
Baine could throw his totem nearly as well swimming as he could standing, as Jaina learned a few seconds later. This time, she couldn't blink back to the platform, and Baine crawled up long before Jaina got close. His axe shone with a crimson matched only by the magma around him, as he prepared to strike the finishing blow as the mage reached the edge.
And the pyroblast again caught him full in the chest.
Another flarecore went out, onto the other adjecent platform. Baine slammed Jaina with the flat of his axe and ran to it, jumping the gap between rocks. Squishing the magic, Baine turned around in time to deflect a pyroblast with his axe, and used the heat to melt the frostbolt she followed it up with. Baine threw his totem at the mage again. Jaina reacted faster than she had previously, avoiding the projectile altogether with her Blink and Frost Blades combo. But Baine had wanted her to blink, for now he lept forward, intent on shattering the rocks beneath her feet.
And his own totem slammed him on the head before he landed. His vision blurred, he felt nauseous. He was vaguely aware he was standing there, open for attack. And as Jaina's Pyroblast flew towards his head, he heard her words.
"You forced my hand."
mibu.work1's discussion of the fight led to some very interesting thoughts. Rather than looking at the abilities or relative strengths of each champion, mibu looked at each Echo's attitude, figuring out what their motives for fighting or lashing out were. A very interesting read, at the very least:
Honestly, I see Baine winning this one not out of his abileties or his tactics, it's because of his attitude. Look at Jaina, she's tired, she's appologetic. She doesn't belong where she is and she knows it. She's not like Tyrande, struggling with her loss, nor Sylvanus, who has embraced the madness around her as protection, she's given up. Baine, on the other hand, is a tauren warrior in his prime, and, rare for tauren, filled to the brim with rage. He's spoiling for a fight and he's found one. If you want to know what fights like these look like, look no further than the Brad Pitt version of Troy, and the fight between Paris and Menaleus. Jaina in here is Paris, she has ability, training and weapons, but her heart isn't in it, and she'll lose because of that. In a fight where the combatants are equally skilled, seasoned, and equipped, it comes down to attitude, and Jaina's is not ready for a fight to the death against someone she's not sure she should be fighting in the first place.I agree. The Echo of Baine is mad with torment and is lashing out at all around him. Jaina seems baffled and confused by her situation and feels reactionary, at least in the dungeon portrayals of the echoes. I do not envy her fictional position.
This season has been great so far with the reports. Keep them coming, everyone. This column happens because of your participation, and it's great to see people enjoying themselves. This week's matchup is going to be a doozy, so keep your eyes on the results and keep cheering for your champion.
| Echo of Baine (End Time) | |
|---|---|
| Echo of Jaina (End Time) |
Filed under: Two Bosses Enter






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Noah Mar 20th 2012 2:31PM
Spell check on the poll: War*lord Zon'ozz
Rai Mar 20th 2012 2:50PM
I'd like to summarise one key event of this fight to demonstrate what might happen.
If Zon'ozz pushes Sylvanas into casting Wracking Pain and Sacrifice, he'd be trapped in the middle of a ring of ghouls. If the shadowy orb is up, it'd have nowhere to go and be bounced back by any one of the ghouls, forcing him into his shadowy "take extra damage" phase, while Sylvanas is immune to all damage during that time. By that point, sacrifice will hit and wipe most, if not all, of his health.
It doesn't matter how much life he drains from her or the amount of damage he does before she jumps up into the air, poor Zon'ozz's abilities are his own handicap here.
Garnlok Mar 20th 2012 5:31PM
Actually it won't work that way because of a little known point on the shado orb mechanic: It has a several second CD on the bounce where it can't hit Zon'ozz. My raid wiped a half dozen times in a single night even though we knew the mechanics because our groups where to close together and when the melee group moved it went strait through Zon'ozz cause of the internal CD (and bounced off the tank). This means during ghoul phase it would bounce against the ghouls repeatedly, frying them all, allowing Zon'ozz to escape the ring and his orb to hit the wall, giving him the victory.
Kelly Mar 20th 2012 3:08PM
I don't know who'd win or why, I'm voting for Sylvannas because, well.... I'm a guy.....
firiun123 Mar 21st 2012 7:48AM
Rigor mortis... the new viagra.
Quaza Mar 20th 2012 3:58PM
I have to agree with Rai on this; the fight is so imbalanced that I can't even write a story for this. Sylvanas' Ring of Adds completely and utterly destroys the Wrecking Ball mechanic. (Like my names for them?) There's no way Zon'ozz can dodge his ball while trying to smash his way free, and if Zon'ozz is forced to cast his Black Blood after being hit, Ghoul Bang would finish him.
Even assuming he could cancel that cast, he'd still have the damage debuff, which would not fall off before the mechanics repeat.
Sylvanas, for sure.
Ikana Mar 20th 2012 5:30PM
This fight is horribly unbalanced. For several reasons.
1- Sylvanas Fanboys, need I say more?
2- Warlord Zon'ozz is easily destroyed by Sylvanas. Her abilities outrank his completely. Zon'ozz may be a raid boss, but Sylvanas still can take all his health out with sacrifice. Unless he kills the adds.
3- Godfrey Fangirls/boys, why? Well they may want Sylvanas to be killed again by him again. You never know....
Well, I'm going with Sylvanas.
Ferato Mar 20th 2012 5:48PM
Im voting Sylvanas purely because her abilities make her the outright winner over Zon'ozz.
Even if they weren't overpowered as other commenters suggest they are more challenging to her foes then the Warlords are.
Shrikesnest Mar 20th 2012 8:14PM
This fight is a joke.
Ignoring difficulty from a player's perspective, Sylvanas has ranged attacks, death zones, an army of killer ghouls and various razzmatazz attacks. Zon'ozz, on the other hand, has a bouncing orb of energy, a rudimentary melee attack and a big fat wad of nothing else. All Sylvanas has to do is kite him around and fill his slow ass full of unholy Scourge arrows, and should he close the gap, finish him with her ghouls.
I really can't see any winning fight scenario for Zon'ozz short some kind of massive territorial advantage.
Vaniya Mar 20th 2012 8:34PM
Sylvanas walked around the... old God ally that was seemingly dead. In this time-twisted world, most everything was dead, and Sylvanas could tell that she was dead. Well, more dead than usual. Suddenly, Bronze lightning raced up and down the creature's tentacles, bringing it back to life! One tentacle grabbed her and pulled her into its maw.
She easily survived the fall, quickly noticing her surroundings. Immediately she saw another, much smaller Old God~esque being. Somehow she knew that this was Warlord Zon'ozz. "You will pay for what you have done, heathen!" she shouted. The creature shrieked in some unintelligible language, prompting her to fire off arrows at it. They bounced off the creature's tough skin, barely phasing it.
Furious, Zon'ozz conjured a void of unmaking, firing it at Sylvanas. Ignoring the seemingly minor threat. Sylvanas lunged around it. But the void was not to be trifled with, and bent around, hitting her squarely in the back. "Bastard!" she yelled.
Zon'ozz was not done with her yet, however, and fired another one at her, also cursing her with dark magics. Sylvanas immediately knew about the curse, familiar with what one feels like, and thought how to retaliate. All during this, she fired a steady stream of arrows at Zon'ozz.
But the Warlord knew that his foe was adept at archery, and craftily altered the void when he had conjured it. When it got close to Sylvanas, it sucked her bow out of her hands, disarming her. "You believe I can not hold my own in the fray? You have made a foolish mistake." she whispered to herself.
Curse still upon her, it was taking its toll on her, slowing her and eating at her life. She conjured a banshee servant out of the twisting agonized souls that drifted in this black world, and just as it came into existence, she twisted it. By using a clever trick she devised, Sylvanas transferred her curse onto the banshee, who quickly succumbed.
Sylvanas leapt to Zon'ozz, drawing her swords in the air. Landing on a spike on his carapace, also impaling him on her weapons. She could feel her life depleting... Slowly dying. She focused all her will, and ripped her spirit from her body. Summoning ghoul minions, she finished the beast off in a dark ritual.
Gathering her strength back, Sylvanas repossessed her body, damaged as it was, healing it with dark magic.
evandunn80 Mar 20th 2012 10:52PM
I'll make this simple.
I have never had or seen anyone get killed fighting Zon'ozz (even when not paying attention)
I've seen my friends get wrecked fighting Sylvanas. (About 2 mintues after the start)
muzeipost Mar 21st 2012 7:20AM
I'm assuming your referring to lfr mode?
Wightskipper Mar 21st 2012 3:45AM
It depends if Zon'ozz is set to Heroic. The adds would totally destroy her.
firiun123 Mar 21st 2012 7:52AM
I'll put a very simple summary up whilst I work on an ultra epic fight description to avoid revision.
Zon'ozz casts ball
Sylvanas bounces it back to him
Sylvanas summons ghouls
Zon'ozz wipes.
too easy :D
firiun123 Mar 21st 2012 8:12AM
Confused as she was after waking near the empty shell of Wrymrest temple, and having already destroyed more multi-colored slimes than existed even in Gnomeregan, Sylvanas wandered the desolate wasteland.
Grasped by the tentacles of yet another old god, Sylvanas was dragged into the layer of Zon'ozz. Rolling her eyes at yet another faceless servant of the old gods, Sylvanas loaded her bow and got to work.
Three arrows in, and Zon'ozz summoned a Void of the Unmaking, hitting Sylvanas straight in the chest. Sylvanas doubled over in agony, the pain almost too much to handle, whilst the void bounced back to Zon'ozz, summoning the wrath of the old gods down on Sylvanas.
“Looks like I’ll need some help here”, Sylvanas thought to herself. She summoned a circle of ghouls around Zon'ozz, each sacrificing themselves for their queen, blowing up as they reached Zon'ozz. He didn't stand a chance.
Hopping over what remained of Tyrande Whisperwind, Sylvanas tutted. “amateur”.
icepyro Mar 21st 2012 11:34AM
I love Sylvanas as much as the next Forsaken, but this is a lot closer that most people give credit for. As a healer in dungeons and raids, I find Warlord Zon'ozz much more taxing and it's not just because of length of fight.
An intelligent boss (rules of the ring here remember) can avoid Sylvanas's spots on the ground. He can easily nuke a ghoul and get out of dodge.
His ball mechanic is BS in LFR and does nothing if Sylvanas fails to bounce it and not much if she does bounce it. In normal it will kill her to solo it, and kill her to bounce it, so unless she does Wracking Pain then and let the ghouls bounce it, but then the question becomes whether he returns to center before her sacrifice.
Then there are the dots. Given there is only one person here except during one phase, the dot will be placed on Sylvanas. Disrupting Shadows hurts without heals or dispel. h-u-r-t-s.
Now the scenario everyone seems to be thinking, that Sylvanas will use Wracking Pain so the ghouls bounce the balls, and it hits Zon'ozz just in time for him to stand still and go into the black phase, allowing Sacrifice to be cast right there where he stands and takes him out, that might happen, but I don't think that's enough damage. If Zon'ozz survives that, he's won. The DoT will catch up, the ball mechanic may help a little, as will the general attacks while she's running around, although leet hunters jump, twist, shoot, twist, land while still going in the direction they want. On second thought, he will die because he will have already taken damage from her arrows and whatnot.
I think the worst part is both bosses have their nasty side and their gimmick mechanic side. So really it all comes down to timing. Does Zon'ozz really stupidly return to the same spot as Sylvanas after the ball bounces and make himself more vulnerable just as she casts Sacrifice? Is the ball still bouncing when she casts Sacrifice (he will be safely out of the way if so)? Does the DoT do sufficient damage before this? How about the arrows that can't be avoided (they do pretty decent damage too if left unhealed)?
Whoever wins, I bet they will be one attack away from death. Still the timing is more reliant on Sylvanas than Zon'ozz which gives him the edge. And really, we wouldn't even be discussing this if it's normal difficulty as everything Zon'ozz does will do sufficient damage that he wins (and fairly quickly I might add). All things considered, I have to give it to the Warlord.
Jabadabadana Mar 21st 2012 6:14PM
Story/lore-wise this is a joke. All the echoes are echoes, broken, time-lost, shadowy fragments of their former selves. Not a one of them should have half a chance in hell against the story scale of a raid boss. It doesn't matter that Sylvanas or any other echo is a badass in their real forms, these aren't they're real forms. I know she has great big... fans and such, but this isn't really the character people are fans of.
Mechanics wise - Zonozz's only problem will be getting through the little hole after he kills a ghoul, and getting his fat mass out of purple crap. Otherwise, his damage output is significantly higher. (even considering damage similar, Sylvanas doesn't hit hard, she just has nasty avoid mechanics, counterable with intelligence and brute force.)
So Zonozz wins this, hands down. (OK, I know damn well that with fans, Sylvanas will beat just about anyone in this contest, but in my world, none of the echoes are worth anything.)
orkmjolhus Mar 26th 2012 5:34AM
Lets try imagening this without Zonozz ball, he will cast his dot ASAP and imedietly folow with psychic drain and stand still intill Sylv uses her first blighted arrows which is also ASAP, Sylvanas will then use shriek of the highborne to which would slow him for a long time (30 sec), then she would use blighted arrows agein, not on zonozz himslef but in the middel, she imedietly summons her ghols and pulls him to mid, making him stand in the blight and take mdmg agein, next zonozz needs to kill 2 ghols if hes gonna completly avoid wracking pain cause he is so darn FAT, and he cant use psychic drain caus ethen he has to stand still, but he cant relly get to two of the ghols in time cause he is slowed (maybe still another 20 sec), so he WILL take the wracking pain dmg. Durning all of this Sylv would not have taken any dmg save the dot from the begining, and that was only for 3-4 second, while zonozz will have at least lost 20% of his health.
Its lickely that the dot went off when Sylv becomes imune, so zonozz has to cast it agein, giving Sylv time to use blighted arrows to control where his face is so that he cant use psychic drain effectivly, and cause of Sylv´s shriek zon can never hit her with his increasing stacks of focused anger, meaning that the dot is the onlysignificant dmg on sylv while she still hits with all her spells cause of zonozzes (unhelfull) size. when the the slow has even reached the remaining 10 sec she can use her ghols agein and repeat the above actions from the begining.
This is all considered that we dont have the ball, which is a massiv disadvantage for Zon, but it is ultimetly hes size and slow speed that will be his downfall, the bigger they are the harder they fall so to speak.