Apr 20th 2009 5:15AM Charlie,
I assume that the OP taking Holy as the duel spec was for raid healing, why wouldn't I, he was talking about saving money on changing roles.
Are you arguing that disc with raid healing glyphs is a better option for raid healing than holy?
Yes disc has alot of the tools that holy has for raid healing and some of their own, but I argued that Holy have better tools because we talent them heavily.
Vern eluded to PoH spam as the advantage of Holy, I was just arguing against that.
"Are you confusing raid healing with group healing? (meaning individual raid members taking dmg vs multiple members at the same time taking damage)"
This was a little confusing, I'll assume your not talking about different raid healing assignments as that would be weird, that you are talking about different types of damage you encounter while raid healing.
I was saying that due to single players taking alot of damage during the fight, you would not be able to spend 12 sec (or whatever) spamming PWS on 8 targets before each tantrum, unless someone else was covering the single target heals.
This would make the PWS spam technique unreliable, would it not?
I love the priest class, I have played it for a long time, I have played all specs in raid situations for a long time, if you really think asking a Disc priest to raid heal as holy now and then is the same as asking a Tank to DPS then you are missing out on a large part of what your class has to offer to the Healing role.
Ulduar is not as easy as raids you would have seen in the past, if you are only ever tank healing then great, no need to think about Holy, but if you have to fill a raid healing role now and then then do your guild a favour and try to have a duel spec best suited to the role.
Of course you don't HAVE to, you don't HAVE to use consumables, you don't HAVE to raid consistently, but if you give 2-cents about what is best for the raid then you would.
I am well aware of the benefits a disc priest brings to a raid, stop assuming everyone is ignorant about Disc just because they don't think it is the spec for all situations.
Apr 19th 2009 11:53PM Very bad spec imo, you miss out most of the biggest selling points of both Holy and Disc specs, I'd recommend you choose one then practice practice practice to get the most out ofi it.
If you are looking to raid heal then Holy is the go, personnaly I go with this: http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#bVcbuZcxxcfMqih0euVo:0dmMVz
Apr 19th 2009 11:04PM So who is making sure everyone is topped up and healing individual damage debuffs on raid memebers before the tantrum? Doesn't one of your raid memebers in range having to be healed through a targetted boss ability screw up the contribution disc can make to raid healing by mass shielding?
Learn to Holy,
Gearing for holy isn't radically different to Disc, unless you are overvaluing haste for holy in 3.1, if you have geared with int over spi it isn't going to be a big hit either as int still rocks. We both love crit and sp and don't like MP5 so I don't see the problem.
Given the nature of raid damage in Ulduar, that is it doesn't often come as one big hit, rather a number of smaller hits, POH is not your one stop shop for raid healing. POH is great hasted but unless you set up the raid for it, and the raid doesn't need to spread out, it isn't often hitting all party members.
Don't forget that CoH is still very nice and was buffed slightly, and PoM is kicking arse with the nature of the raid damage in that it bouces around like crazy. Binding heal sets you up for hasted PoH/Gheal while not having to heal yourself directly. Hell when you add up the healing from renew and empowered renew it too is a significant contributer.
Priests have lots of tools that have become viable in 3.1, Holy priests have more tools, and better tools through their talents for raid healing. If you aren't using them in Ulduar then you are missing the fun. I have never seen such a wide spread on healing done by my healing abilities.
To suggest that Disc with different glyphs is the best off spec option for Disc is ignorant. Take some effort and learn to play 3.1 holy properly before looking elsewhere for your raid healing needs.
Mar 31st 2009 10:06PM GHeal bad, bad holy priest, bad.
You rarely gheal on sath 3D, you could time one for just after a breath, but a shield and pom while the breath is casting is a better use of your global cooldowns and you can do it on the run if needed. Flash heal has a short enough cast time to land after the breath but before the next hit and a decent chance it will be instant or hasted.
I think what people who think they deserve to be invited to raids as disc are missing, is that pallys for almost all situations are better single target healers than, well anyone (inc. Disc priests). If you raid more than just Sath 3D then a pally is better hands down for every other situation.
So given that your guild has enough pallys to cover tank healing, the raid leader will be looking for a class for pure raid healing (Shamans and holy priests dominate) or capable of doing both very well so they can be assigned to what’s needed given the situation.
Disc priests, while they can raid heal ok, are not at the same class of shamans/Holy priests. They are not as good as paladins for 95% of situations at tank healing, so why given the option would you take a disc priest to a raid unless all the content is on farm and it doesn’t really matter what you bring?
Raid leaders don’t have to ignorant to not invite a disc priest, they could just be pragmatic in that there are better options than a disc priest for all but gimmicky situations.
On disc being a pvp spec, my logic goes as follows: If holy is a better pve spec than disc, and disc is a better pvp spec than holy, then disc is a pvp spec.
Please don’t post anecdotes about raid healing as disc, or bubbles, blah blah blah, I’m not saying Disc can’t heal the current content, it can, I’m not saying disc is bad at healing, it isn’t, I’m just saying that there are better options out there, which can influence whether you get invites.
Feb 22nd 2009 9:38PM
I've played Holy through all wow content, once we started doing 3Drakes I went disc because it was suggested in strats. I stayed disc for about a month clearing all content.
I think it’s great that you are enjoying playing disc, and yes it is great for 5-mans. But please don’t confuse this with 15-man raid viability.
The content is very very easy at the moment, healing is not hard, you could heal most of it as shadow in healing gear, just because raids don’t fail with a disc priest at the moment does not mean that they are as viable as the other healing classes/specs.
Let me just be clear, the following statements are only directed at Disc priests in 25 man raids, you go ahead one pvp 5/10 man to your heart’s content, I support that.
There is no evidence that Disc priests are anything but a sub-par healer, there is actually a tonne of evidence against them which is all swept away with a general “it doesn’t show on meters so it must be awesome” type statement.
All you we have are baseless claims and anecdotal evidence, it is not impossible to ballpark the mitigation and shielding effects of a disc priest, but disc priests supporters never do, because... disc priests aren’t competitive on a single target with a holy priest, never mind a holy paladin. You can figure out how much PW:S did from a WWS report looking at Glyph of Power Word Shield healing and assuming all the shields where hit through (avg. Heal x 5 x casts). You can figure out how much grace mitigated by looking at tank damage and taking the 3%, assuming up all the time, aegis is harder but it can be theory crafted from crits. Whenever this is done disc does not look so rosy.
There is a reason why Blizzard are looking to buff Disc priests single target healing in 3.1, please just look forward to that rather than touting how uber Disc is now, your only doing yourself damage.
Sep 8th 2008 8:06PM I've used alot of these types of sites, including maxdps, and I checked out Gearwishlist when it was working.
Gearwishlist is probably the worse of them all. It looks nice, but the rankings are really off.
It is pretty hard to find a static list of healing gear rankings for a particular class like priests, nevermind an automated ranking system.
The problem is with giving weightings to different stats for different classes and arguably play style. You can't for example sort healing gear by what the class can wear, item level, and +heal and call it a day.
The best site I have seen for ranking healing gear, (would be fine for dps too) is: http://www.lootrank.com/wow/rank.asp
Here you can select all your own filters and weighting of stats to get a ranking which is very close to what you are looking for.
Here is an example of what I use for a holy priest: http://www.lootrank.com/wow/rank.asp?Lan=&Cla=16&i7=1&s7=1&s8=4&Art=8&i1=1&s1=1&s2=4&Slot=1&j4=1&s3=1&s4=4&Max=20&i8=1&s5=1&s6=4&Gem=4&j5=1&j6=1&n2=1&i5=1&maxlv=70&i6=1&j3=1&k5=1&mp5=7&Sta=7&heal=9&Int=5&Spi=9&has=9&Ver=4