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Feb 19th 2008 2:16PM Neocene, I know that many people won't like what I am about to say . . . but "spending weeks and perhaps months" to get a few specific pieces of gear is exactly what the "hard-core" raiders do. My guild has been raiding only 2 nights a week (BT clear one night, Hyjal the other), but to get to this point has taken many hours of tedious wipes and redo's. Please do not take this as a "raider" coming down on a "casual," but I want to help you understand that getting gear simply takes time. Personally, I am simultaneously upset and elated at the new badge loot. I am happy because now I can get my alt some respectable gear, but I am very upset that the highest levels of gear are available to those who, in essence, "wait long enough."
Similar to the debate that happened when the Season 1 Arena gear became available for purchase with honor, some people--myself included--feel that the accomplishment of completing the toughest content in the game is losing its luster. And this is definitely a very recent trend; it's not as if any of us could just farm ZG or MC over and over again to get gear similar to the Tier 3 gear from Naxx.
All in all, I think that this is the closest that we are going to come to a compromise on gear for so called "casuals" and "hard-core raiders." In theory, the hard-core raiders pay in skill and front-end time while casuals pay in time spent farming.
Feb 13th 2008 2:25PM @ Brass, I feel your pain. Gul'dead-US had only 1 Alliance and 2 Horde guilds in BT/Hyjal as of 2 weeks ago. So my guild xfered off. Since then another Alliance guild has entered BT, but they have a considerable way to go to get geared up as a guild. I think that what might happen, and this is only a "guess," we might see more top-tier guilds leaving low-pop or less-progressed servers to join the older, bigger servers in an attempt to see more content; or at least on an individual player basis.
That said, I am really excited to see how this whole "let's work together as a server" idea plays out. I started playing after BC came out and missed the "glory days" of AQ40.
One last thought . . . Is it plausible that we might be experiencing, as an unforeseen consequence of having to unlock progression that is based on progression, a concentration of talent on a few servers, and the potential for servers being known as "hard-core" servers versus "powder-puff" servers?
Nov 27th 2007 4:44PM MacBook Pro
2.0 Core Duo
2 gigs RAM
128 MB VRAM
Nov 27th 2007 1:48PM I think there is a noncombat chicken that can be gotten in Westfall. But, I think that there is a quest that needs to be done to allow the ability to train the chicken. I remember a guildie telling me about it and that you needed to /cluck or something a bunch of times at the targeted chicken . . .
Nov 9th 2007 11:40AM I think this is a very timely and appropriate article. I didn't start playing WoW until after BC came out, but I think that having to level "old-world" patterns early on helped me to appreciate the amount of work that leveling a profession truly entails.
The article mentions the proliferation of alts as an alternative to seeking out true crafters. I think that this is only 1/2 of the problem. I am a perfect example of using alts. As it stands, I have 4 lvl 70's and a lvl 60. Their respective professions are:
375 mining/375 BS Mace (paladin)
375 tailoring/375 herbing (mage)
375 alch x-mute/375 enchant (warrior)
375 skinning/370 LW (rogue)
300+ mining/355 JC (shaman lvl 60)
I raid with my pally and rogue and use the mage and the warrior's professions as a way to get around the hassle of trying to find someone to make stuff for me. Only my Blacksmith and my Tailor have any truly "rare" recipes, but even then, about half of them are BOE patterns for BOE items. This leads me to the second half of what I see to be a problem with crafting professions in general; BOE patterns for BOP items.
On my server, US-Guldan Alliance, there is only 1 guild raiding BT/MtHyj. There used to be 3, but now only 2 guilds in SSC/TK. This low number of raiders would lead you to believe that crafters on this server should make a pretty good living--fewer chances to get rare patterns drives down the supply quotient . Unfortunately this isn't the case.
For example, I bought my rogue the LW pattern for the Boots of Utter Darkness. Not an amazing pattern but pretty solid as a second pair of boots for when I have reached the +hit cap. Anyway, I paid 600g for the pattern because it had never been seen on my server and because it only needs primal nethers. The pattern was BOE which is great for me because at the time, my rogue hadn't yet gotten into SSC/TK, but the item made is BOP. So, I couldn't sell the pattern at a reduced price to a LW friend to have them make it for me. As such, I dropped my enchanting (which by the way, I only picked up so that I could DE all the Outland quest rewards) and started to level up my leatherworking SOLEY FOR THE PURPOSE OF EQUIPPING THESE BOOTS. This, I feel, leads less experienced player to think that professions are taken up for the benefit of the crafter rather than the marketplace.
Furthermore, the BOP patterns that make BOE items that can be found in the current t5-t6 end-game content requires Nether Vortexes to craft. I know my guild still requires that we spend DKP on these and it is expressly not allowed to use the nether vortexes for anyone outside of the guild. I think the reasoning behind this to benefit the guild before the server is understandable, but it also puts the best crafted items out of reach for most players, and thus, lowers even further the demand for such BOE items because the materials aren't readily available.
Now, this may be my naivete at work here, but to summarize, it is the proliferation of alts and the "relative" ease at which the vast majority of recipes can be had, in COMBINATION with the increase in BOP crafted items and teh general unavailability of the opportunity on the server to obtain the mats for the best BOE items that has lead to the downfall of the crafting professions in general.
Thanks again for such a great topic starter.
Oct 11th 2007 12:36PM For my guild it was a lack of focus and inconsistency.
It took us 6 weeks do attempts to down Vashj. Then the 2 main tanks went on vacation at the same time. 2 weeks of not raiding spelled the end for us. Ultimately, I think that it was not the fack that Vashj was difficult to master, but rather that on some weeks we could clear SSC to Vashj in 2 nights, whereas others took us till Sunday, thereby lelaving us with only Monday night to attempt her. Repeatedly making mistakes on prior encounters that we thought we had mastered really took an emotional toll on the guild and forced many people to no longer have any fun in raiding. I am secretly hoping that ZA will fire it back up.
R.I.P. Friends with Benefits, US Gul'dan Alliance
It was a good run gang.
Oct 4th 2007 10:41AM I am curious what you do when you have finally killed a boss, after weeks, but it turns out to be like the last wish of a dying man. Case in point, after a few weeks of wiping on Vashj, my guild finally downs her, but rather than celebrate by learning the back half of TK, people were too burned out to go on and th eguild has since totally broken up with many members quitting WoW altogether. Oh well, such is life. Let this be a cautionary tale too, I guess.
Jul 31st 2007 4:57PM fav scene is by far the montage where the Spartans are fighting all the different varieties of foes thrown at them
Nov 21st 2006 6:25PM go wiii