Jan 27th 2012 6:38AM The Good Guy image of the Alliance is severely muddled now that their Paladins, their Druids and their enitre city of Mages love the Horde so much that they have abandoned the Alliance. And the same goes for the Night Elf demigods and the "good" Red and Green Dragonflights. Just sayin'. ;-)
Jan 27th 2012 6:19AM Nothing will ever change in Kalimdor or the Eastern Kingdoms after Theramore is burnt to ashes. That would destroy the precious leveling zone balance, which was the whole point of making the Horde be awesome, unstoppable facerollers in Catalysm. (Well, that and boosting Horde faction pride. When Samwise screams "Alliance Sucks!" on stage, he is 100% correct. Compared to the Horde, they are kinda worthless.) Well... if there will be any more territory changes, it won't be the Alliance that gain territory, since Dave Kosak stated that things will get a lot worse for the Alliance (in an interview trying to adress the complaints, good job there) which should mean that the Alliance will lose even more territory in the Old World. My guess is all of Ashenvale, since cutting down every tree and every night elf on the continent has sorta been the goal of the Horde since 2004. And honestly, since the Alliance will never be allowed to kick the Horde out of Ashenvale, a totally deforested Ashenvale seems like a logical continuation of the Kalimdor story, just like Alliance losing Arathi Highlands seems like the next logical step in the Eastern Kingdoms. I mean, the Forsaken only need one shot to turn everyone in Refuge Point to goo, so how can that logically not happen? Oh and now that the Wildhammers are living in both Twilight Highlands and Ironforge, there is really no reason that the Horde can not take Aerir Peak, too. So, Alliance total loss of Ashenvale, Hinterlands and Arathi is how I interpret Dave's words that things will get a lot worse for the Alliance. Because in Pandaria, things can only get better for them. Even if they only get half a zone and the Horde gets the rest of the continent, they still have half a zone more than before, which is better. Anyway, the permanenting of borders after Alliance loses Theramore (which is the best we can realistically hope for for the rest of the game, and something that goes against what the lead quest designer says) means that the Alliance have forever lost and will never get back:
The Human nations of Dalaran (neutral), Lordareon (horde/neutral), Alterac, Stromgarde, Gilneas (contested, and will always be since it's a battleground, while the entire population of the nation is living under a tree) and Theramore. (Kul Tiras may be Alliance one day. If anyone is stll alive. Unless the Forsaken gets there first. Or they become neutral like everyone else in the old Alliance.)
Over half of Ashenvale forest, which is the Night Elf homeland (maybe all of it coming patches.)
Auberdine and Southshore and the hundreds of people living there.
Gnomeregan, since Blizzard decided in the last minute that only the Horde nations should be allowed to get stuff back. (Trolls got Darkspear Isles.)
Mount Hyjal, Felwood and Moonglade. (Cenarion Circle territory. Neutral. Now and forever.)
Cenarius, Malfurion and all the Night Elf druids. (Neutral. See above)
Every paladin in Silver Hand and Argent Dawn. (Neutral. While the Horde has TWO Horde-only paladin orders, Sunwalkers and Blood Knights, that they get to keep.)
Every mage in Dalaran/Kirin Tor. (While the Horde has their own city of mages.)
Khadgar. Rhonin. Shattrath City. The Aldor. (All neutral.)
Alexstrasa. Ysera. Red Dragonflight. Green Dragonflight. (Have been friends of the Kaldorei for thousands of years. Now they are ok with the Orcs taking their lands and slaughtering them.)
Aviana. Aessina. Goldrinn. Malorne. Tortolla. (All formerly friends of the Night Elves. Now neutral. You'd think that at least Aessina would have problems with Horde deforestation. But noooo. And why should she when not even Cenarius cares anymore?)
I could go on and on about this.
Oh and "neutral" means "we are gonna sit here and drink herbal tea while watching the Horde butchering entire nations, kthnxbye". ;-)
Lessee... what has the Horde lost? Thrall, but Metzen said he'll rejoin the Horde soon. And Camp Taurajo, which was four tents on a savannah. Which the Horde retaliated for by destroying three Alliance FORTRESSES, btw. And... that's about it. Compared to the Alliance, where one single race has lost SIX whole nations.
And people compare this to Lord of the Rings or Star Wars.... newsflash people, Sauron lost The One Ring and Isengard and Dol Guldur waaay before Minas Tirith, he had setbacks and the Free Races had epic victories even when it was overall bad for them, and the Empire lost the first Death Star, which was a major setback even though they were still the winning side. (And I seriously doubt that JRRT or George Lucas was screaming "For Sauron" or "For The Empire" at every opportunity or claim that their hands felt like burning when they wore a ranger cloak or a jedi robe, the way Metzen loves to do. I've even seen him smile happily when people at Blizzcon boo at the very, very few players that claim they are Alliance. Something that, by the way, I have never ever heard any Blizzard employee openly admit. Nor will I ever expect one too.)
Is it just me, or does anyone else feel the constant Horde rants from Blizzard makes you feel that you are not doing what Blizzard intented for the players to do, when you play Alliance? Because seriously, why should anyone play the side that always comes across and weak and pathetic (when fighting the other side) and whose allies, supporters and members abandon them on a regular basis? The only way I can see the Alliance nations surviving this, and by surviving I mean not being wholly exterminated by the Orcs and the Forsaken, is that the Horde turns against itself, which would permanent the concept of Alliance worthlessness, since they have 10+ times the manpower that the Horde has, even after all their losses, and - again - we see that they can't fight the Horde face to face even with superior numbers and win any kind of military victory. At all.
Jan 26th 2012 2:51PM Except with Theramore gone, the Horde can gather every single Horde soldier on Kalimdor and rush into Ashenvale and exterminate the Night Elves altogether... and cut down every tree in the forest...
Jan 26th 2012 4:34AM Outshine? Have you read the novels? Tyrande more or less becomes the avatar of Elune, and goes from fresh novice DIRECTLY to High Priestess (and national leader), Azshara is shown as much more powerful than Mannoroth and equal or near-equal to Archimonde in raw power, and Malfurion soloes Archimonde (right after he has killed Malorne, IIRC) and WINS, while Jarod Shadowsong, a common low-ranked officer, because of pure leadership skills gets command of the entire allied army AND duels Archimonde and fights him for minutes without losing. (Saved by the Bell, but still.)
What did Krasus and Rhonin do that would match that? The only thing Rhonin did was to teach the mages a few tricks, including Illidan, and we all know how well that worked out. And the main contribution to the fight that Krasus did was weakening himself. (Good job there.)
Jan 26th 2012 4:07AM If they are an RP-PvP guild, shouldn't they camp enemy players that attacked Horde NPCs as part of questing, such as Dragonmaw raiders in Twilight Highlands or Horde Seadogs in Vas'hir?
Or 1-60 examples, but I can't think of any right now, even though they exist, since generally the Horde experience from 1-60 is killing Alliance and the Alliance experience is killing those that wanna destroy the world. :-P
Dec 26th 2011 8:28AM "How it feel? I'm asking, cause I gotta wonder, getting your ass kicked by a girl hunter..."
Dec 22nd 2011 8:27PM @Blayze
The Horde (read: the Orcs) are not attacking Alliance because they see a threat. They are attacking Alliance because the Alliance have something shiny to take. And because you aren't a real Orc warrior unless you fight and kill people as often as possible, preferebly all the time, preferebly PREFEREBLY by charging straight forward into their ranks.
And victory after victory for the Horde is happening because the people that wear Horde t-shirts and yell "For the Horde!" at every opportunity wants it to be so.
The Alliance IS awake. It's defending against the Horde everywhere. And even in some cases attacking. And in every region ultimately losing. Because they are weaker. And waste their numbers fighting other enemies which only makes it easier for the Horde to wipe them all out.
Oh and why do people expect that Blizzard will give the Alliance any kind of victory against the Mighty Horde? Seriously? When did Blizzard give any official statement that that will EVER happen?
All we've read/heard is this.
1. Theramore will burn.
2. It will always be unfair.
3. It will get a lot worse for the Alliance.
4. Varian will become the new High King. Alliance will need him because things will be so bad for them in the future. (Meaning things aren't so bad right now, compared to how they will be.)
5. The Alliance Battlecry should be "have mercy", "we're trying" or "not the face".
6. Chris Metzen's hands burned when he was wearing an Alliance t-shirt (and he was only wearing it as a prank).
7. Maybe we should give the Alliance a nice symbol?
8. For the Horde!!! (repeated a million times from Blizzard management each Blizzcon)
What we have NEVER read/heard (but people keep thinking Blizzard is meaning anyway):
1. Things will get bad for the Horde.
2. The Alliance will take something from the Horde that they value.
3. For the Alliance!!! (by any Blizzard manager or spokesperson that will not say For the Horde! before or after that).
Seriously, how hard can it be to connect the two facts a) Blizzard loves the Horde much more (as evident by ANYONE that has ever been at Blizzcon or seen it streamed) and b) the Horde is winning everywhere and is much stronger, cooler, mightier and made of awesome?
It's not exactly rocket science. ;-)
Dec 22nd 2011 7:45PM Tyrande and the Sentinels are fighting againat the Horde. And losing. Horribly. One of the reasons for this is that the druids (which are 85% Night Elves or something like that) and Cenarius himself has declared neutrality instead of thundering like an avalance down into Ashenvale and rip every Orc, Troll and Tauren they find there to shreads and feed them to the Nightsabers.
Dec 22nd 2011 7:20PM Except when everyone in Theramore is dead or at best gone from Kalimdor forever, (or in worst case raised as Forsaken) the Horde can throw every Orc, Tauren, Troll and Goblin warrior they have into Ashenvale. Comsidering how the Night Elves can barely stand against a small part of the Orc army alone, I think Ashenvale and possibly Darkshore will be Horde-only territory with Theramore gone.
Dec 15th 2011 4:15PM I couldn't agree more about your evaluation of the support classes and those that play them. We definitely need to be able to solo group content better. It's such a huge nerf that our pets can't replace main tanks like they used to, and that we can't use healing gear to boost Mend Pet any longer. If Blizzard fixes this, lets our pets be gaining from all of our stats, and gives us a healing tree like some of the lesser dps classes have, maybe we could at least raid with nothing but hunters? Especially if they stop hurting us by forcing us to wear mail only. Come to think of it. since in MoP only guns, bows and crossbows are hunter weapons (which is a huge nerf, they've given all our melee and caster weapons to lesser people, and they never even gave us maces despite years of demands that everything is a hunter weapon) we should demand that Blizzard not only allows us to wear plate but also lets us wear ANY armor class while still having the mail boost. Since our pets can replace every buffs that the support classes gives us, if we get a healing tree (sub, i'm looking at you), and if we can wear tank gear and have out pets gain all our stats, then we can have all-hunter raiding guilds which would be awesome.
As an extra bonus, it gives us a legitime reason to /gkick all the gnome players, because, you know, we are only keeping them for their playing skills now anyway? It's absolutely not because we enjoy spending time with people desiring to be childlike, small, sweet and cute in a game where everything is about killing as fast and effectively as possible, right? Right!